Info On E/R/M Weapons Future

The above process has already been ongoing for a while now but rather than scrapping everything and reverting to their old direction I think it's more likely SE will just condense the servers once again and just stick to their original plans. If you don't like the way the game is now it's probably time to just let it go.

You mean a lot of the people who reflex activated for adoulin realized it's not a different game and quit for the same reason they quit before? Who would have thought.

I did not claim population dropped because of REM. I only said population didn't increase without REM.

Ppl kept saying population would increase, newer/returning player would come back and play happily without REM, that's just as baseless.

This is my personal view on the subject and, we should all be aware that not everyone has the same expectations from the game.

But the lack of something unique to strive for is really unsettling. Relics&co. had, sorry if I use this wording, "magic" to them in that sense. With the idea though that every weapon will be outclassed in 3 months it makes me feel very disenamoured with the game. You can say I can still make those weapons, but honestly, grinding so much like they still require and in the end not even being able to use them for actual gameplay is discouraging to say the least.

I understand though that the dev team has moved in a different direction and trying to mend things now can only cause disruption. At this point I am unsure whether fixing them is a good idea anymore or not. But I certainly feel like the game lost something special.

People that use the argument "you can still spend 3 months grinding those REMs that are greatly inferior to items you can get in 3 hours" don't really have any place to say that unless they regularly grind Garrison and Eco Warrior.

How many people enjoyed grinding relics, though. I think the bigger problem is that many people just fishbotted, made gil, RMTed, etc as a means to an end. As a result of this, they feel their weapons are more important. If you'd enjoyed farming it, I don't see how you can be justifiably upset that it's not the best any more.

And my point that it's not NECESSARY to kill REM to achieve this. But some ppl just want to see REM die, when it's not necessary.




So why let it go? You just want the game to work the way YOU want, when others wanted another way, or at least an alternative option that can co-exist with your way, you just bash them, tell them to "let go".

Oh and btw, SE can code that armor into the game if they want to, duh. Obviously I'm just using it as an example to show that you don't need to kill REM to make ppl do new content.


Still don't get it? You can pay for clear and LEECH a delve boss item.

You farm fodder, make gil, buy a relic, is the same as

You farm fodder, make gil, pay a LS or group to get in, watch them kill while alt-tabbing youtube and get KI.

On the other hand, you spend 200 hr killing fodder for a relic is less work than spending 1hr to get into ally on GEO, and 45 min semi-afking with bubbles on for a KI? It probably take less than 10hours to grind enough plasm+KI for an Oatixur, including pt gather time.

Can you please tell me, how "awesome" or "super skilled" to get into an ally on GEO, toss a bubble and just stand there for 45 min and get a god tier weapon?

Delve has higher impact without REM beating their weapons. Can you rationally deny this?


SE wants them to let it go. I don't really care either way. I have a handful of relics on my main, 3 ragnaroks & 3 annihilators on alts, etc. If they become awesome, that's neat. I don't really feel like they belong best in slot though.

Adding obscenely overpowered gear lends itself to the major slot before the minor slots. That's just logic.

Wrong. In the first example, the highest level of gameplay involved could be done by a monkey. The gil is shifting between a lot of people grinding.

In the second example, the newest and hardest content is a vital component. The gil is only one part of it, if no group on your server has the coordination to do it then you will need to get to that point before buying is even an option. This is actually the case on some servers. The gil goes to the players that are capable of doing the hardest content, creating a proportional reward for their efforts(which is something FFXI has long lacked.. hence, most endgame players still fishbotting as their major gil source).

It has something to do with the other 17 people. Maybe you should stop thinking about yourself.

I'm going to guess that there's a lot of people that are upset precisely because farming for an REM wasn't really a pleasant experience. I'd like to think the people who actually farmed Dynamis for their ***are the most upset about this. People that fish botted and blinkered, probably not as much.

I've said it before, but I think their intent with outdating RME was a good one, it just wasn't going to work with the playerbase that got filtered out after 2+ years of continuous non-content.

Imagine what wouls go through your community's head when they see 80% lower player subs vs the year previous

That's my point, Kincard. If people didn't enjoy farming their relic, they shouldn't have done it. It's a game, you aren't any more entitled to having your gear stay good just because you did something you didn't enjoy to get it.

That's not much different from REM though.

This statement:
If nobody on your server kills delve boss, you can't buy KI.

Is the pretty much the same as:
If nobody on your server kills ADL, you can't buy marrow.
If nobody on your server kills VW, you can't buy HMP.
If nobody on your server do assault, you can't complete a Mythic(inb4 mules, that's still more than 1 character)

The problem was that they set a precedent that REMs were going to be the strongest weapons in the game (I recall they've even made statements about it before, like back right before the release of Abyssea and their whole introduction about TotM). Guess it's more to do with that people just don't like being bamboozled. If they had known that REMs would have been outdated eventually, do you think nearly as many people would've worked on them?

And you're right, it's ultimately just a game and nobody is entitled to anything. That's why people that are dissatisfied have stopped playing.

Comparing 6man content to 18man content and ignoring the bulk of my argument. I'll waste my time when you come up with something worthwhile.

That wasn't even the main reason why some ppl are against the idea of killing REM.

I don't enjoy grinding 200 hours, but I think the concept of taking years to get a god tier weapon is pretty cool in an MMO. Because it feels much, much more satisfied to get it, even if the process isn't enjoyable all the time. This concept is just more exciting than 45 min of alt-tabbing on GEO, and toss it after 3 months when next update come for many players.

You don't like this concept, I get it. But you don't have to bash everyone that enjoys different aspect from you. I don't mind REM co-exist with god-tier weapons, as long as it's still relevant. I did not say this game should be REM only, and REM as only option. But I just don't understand why some ppl would go "DIE REM DIE, ALL YOUR FAULT THAT FFXI SUCKED"

ADL and VW wasn't designed to be a 6 man content, it was supposed to be 18 man. Salvage was supposed to be 18 too I think. Those contents are just old, so less players required to do it. But it was supposed to be harder than solo/lowman content.

How do you know after 8 more years ppl would not trio Tojil with their D1000 weapons?

I don't care if RME die or not. I farmed some of them. I still have them. I'm not crying that they aren't the best any more, and I think it's absurd how many people are.

Stop directing your anger at SE toward me. You've yet to make a coherent point more relevant than 'I WANT MY ALMACE TO BE BETTER NOW'.

I was 8boxing both, easily, pre-adoulin. You can't even pretend they're anywhere near the same scale of content. If I take my characters on an attempt at T1-T6 by myself, I'm not getting anywhere near that. VW and salvage were 6mannable on release, and ADL was doable with less than 12 and a lot of flexibility. A T1-T6 run has significantly less flexibility and requires players to pay attention, wear proper gear, and coordinate together.

I just said you can do that later when better weapons out!

And my point was clear enough, and being mentioned over and over by many, you just refuse to read.

My point:
Some ppl liked FFXI with REM, killing it isn't necessary, and certainly doesn't make the game better. I made 0 mention about Almace, wtf.

I did not direct my anger toward you. I disagree with your opinion and stated mine, that's not allowed?

Yes, I spent 10x more time in FFXI grinding armor pieces all over the place than grinding a REM.

Being able to theoretically future 6man T6 has no impact on the current situation. The D1000 weapons you speak of will be from the latest 18 man content at the time.

Much armor is still best in slot that was before delve. If you really want to turn it into a slot by slot time comparison, I can do that. It's not going to change much though: the weapons are the clear strongest incentive because it's the clear most important slot.

I would still do T6s if relics were up-to-date. The people I know firsthand, however, probably would not. The people who were holding out for relic update are finally caving and trying to participate in delve, at least here. I think that's what SE intended, and I don't fault them for it at all. People are stubborn and these things take time.

Salvage was never supposed to be 18 man, or if it was then they hugely *** up. Voidwatch was never mandated to be 18 man either, but the rewards improved (more procs) and the event tended to get easier the more people you brought. It's also worth noting that Voidwatch was designed as level 90-99 content. Jeuno Tier 2, Prov, CoP, and ToAU were the level 99 branches, iirc.

How is this topic still going?

XI went at a gradual pace that tried to keep a majority of it's content relevant and then Matsui decided, "*** the ultimate weapons, let's speed up a decade old game into a blatant gear-treadmill where everything gets outdated every update."

As it was mentioned on like, Page 1 or somewhere earlier in this thread, if they're waiting until the end of Adoulin and then scaling R/M/E with quests/go get these drops from x NM, that's great. It gives Delve a time in the spotlight and then R/M/E can be at least comparable alternatives rather than 100~200m+ vanity pieces. (If it's not 99, I don't care, you didn't reach the top like the players who spent excessive time and money that did.) Granted, Matsui had a decent idea, but the overnight 1-20 scaling was incredibly poorly implemented and will probably cost this game a decent toll.


But in the end, if they still choose to discontinue R/M/E despite the outburst they had from all regions of the community, vote with your dollar and find something else to play.

An armor pieces that give crazy stat such as skill lv+188, Triple attack+ 20%, attack +1000 doesn't necessary make less impact than D300 weapons in terms of performance. I agree that ppl are more attached with REM emotionally though.

The reason why ppl are THAT emotionally attached to REM, is not because REM are weapons not armor. But because it's design, background story and entire concept. And FFXI is just not as exciting without such concept. If there's an armor with similar concept/design/background story that exist for years, it should has same impact as REM.

But ppl are attached to REM, emotional factor plays a role.

You keep saying "it takes time for ppl to move on and deal with it". This is a game, if customers doesn't like it they stopped paying. If someone pay to play an MMO with REM to get an REM, and dev killed REM, they'd just quit. And I don't see what's so good about losing profit. It's not like they're making more money when those ppl quit. Those who doesn't play FFXI or quit before SoA, they probably wouldn't bother with XI without REM anyways. And vice versa, if you're playing FFXI just fine with REM, kill REM or not makes 0 impact on you, you'd keep playing anyways, but it will make others quit, ultimately it affected you because the game died faster with less ppl.

This logic doesn't even make sense. If you actually played in this manner you would never progress in this game. The game has always been built around the need to perform repetitive events which you may find boring in an effort to achieve something you may need before attempting something you actually find enjoyable. This form of grinding has always been present. One can even argue even more so now than before. Plasm farming is mind numbingly boring but if the result of spamming it means you are properly geared to be able to tackle the stronger delve bosses (or naakuals or whatever newer endgame content that is later introduced) then obviously you are gonna do it even if you don't enjoy it.

You have a completely unrealistic assessment of how many people actually care about REM enough to quit. Wanting it to be true will not make it so. The game has much bigger problems atm, your weapon is nothing in the grand scheme of why the playerbase is dropping.

this might sound strange to you, but some people only do content they enjoy.. some of them are even 'successful'.. they just enjoy a wider range of content than you do

I kinda disagree with VW not being alliance fight. It was out at 90 cap, back at 90 cap it did require more than 2 pt for it, for majority of the groups at least. Maybe you CAN do it with less than 18, but most pt did it with full ally until it got easier. That was before ppl spam proc and zerg it in 2 min.

I did cities 6boxing at 90 cap. Hi.

Delve T6 is not the end-all hardest content any MMO will see. It is, however, much more demanding than most of what FFXI has had in recent years.

If killing REM makes 0 impact like you say, then you wouldn't see a new 5+ page thread about it and ppl ask for it every 2 weeks.

A dozen vocal crybabies is nothing. Half of the thread is people telling them to shut up. Most of the threads are the same people. If you really think it's a significant portion of the deactivated accounts, I have no idea what to tell you.

gets so boring watching all the bitching about players getting mad at other players for not being happy about the REMs getting owned by easy to obtain items and all the mention of elite players who think they are awesome for having relics is laughable, its funny how many shouts you see now that ONLY take delve weapons and these are the same players accusing REM users of being butt hurt elitist, REMs deserve the boost just as much as all the other boosted items from old events (salvage v2 requiring v1 armor, augmented sky/hnm gear, limbus v2 items requiring v1 armor, dynamis +2) the lists go on and on yet its funny how players was happy about these updates.

Nobody should be bitching at anyone else for being upset at making something most players worked hard to get only to watch it get owned by weapons that require very little time to obtain just like players shouldnt be bitching about ur precious delve weapons getting *** raped in under 3 months gear is ment to be replaced but ive always liked the idea SE keep alot of old gear relevent by at least letting you upgrade it so its useful against other gear choices not completely destroyed, i hope they do let players update REMs so the ones shouting delve orly can start sucking the *** of the players they was insulting and excluding for months.