>youre parents
>>you're parents
I am parents.
Oh~and Youre Parents Must Be Straight...
Oh~and youre parents must be straight...
I'm happy for that child, now they won't have to have a catholic education; saves them.
Leviathan.Hohenheim said:
I'm happy for that child, now they won't have to have a catholic education; saves them.
the kid will be way better of course, and i hope the parents didnt truly want him going there in the first place. i HOPE this was all just a stunt..
they should still sue to try and set a precedence though >.>. win lawsuit, get admitted, and be like *** you nazi ***.. taking our winnings elsewhere <.<
maybe help start tearing down some of these imaginary sociological confines were stuck in.
I'd like to know why these women sent their kid to a Catholic school in the first place knowing they have a problem with gays in general; they seemed to be seeking trouble no? I understand private schools being desirable, but they should have seen this coming; would we expect Muslim parents to send their child to a Catholic school and not expect some problems?
Another question is how was the child accepted into the school in the first place. Obviously there had to have been applications and interviews where the lesbian relationship would have been found and rejected in the beginning. I'd have to assume that the two lesbians lied or simply misled the school administrators into thinking the boy had a male parent somewhere (technically he does).
Another question is how was the child accepted into the school in the first place. Obviously there had to have been applications and interviews where the lesbian relationship would have been found and rejected in the beginning. I'd have to assume that the two lesbians lied or simply misled the school administrators into thinking the boy had a male parent somewhere (technically he does).
Garuda.Snuffy said:
I'd like to know why these women sent their kid to a Catholic school in the first place knowing they have a problem with gays in general; they seemed to be seeking trouble no?
I remember on the most recent Penn and Teller episode on the catholic church and there was an organization of gay catholics. They were protesting wearing signs that said "Another Gay Catholic." But I don't get it. Why on earth would you want to be a part of an organization that's core beliefs go against your lifestyle? Never mind the fact that they said that it is estimated 20-50% of all catholic priests are gay and or engage is gay sex.
There's a lot of hypocrisy in this story. It's one thing to stand up for your right to say serve openly in the military, but another to change the core beliefs of a religious sect.
But not all church's practice in a discriminatory way. Here in California (I know XD) we have plenty of progressive church's that accept gay/lesbian members and have no problem with accepting children of gay couples.
Ramuh.Ilvex said:
But not all church's practice in a discriminatory way. Here in California (I know XD) we have plenty of progressive church's that accept gay/lesbian members and have no problem with accepting children of gay couples.
Finally managing to pull myself away from Yakuza 3, I have returned. And seeing as how the immaculate name of Bonta-kun has been invoked, I will do my best to perform to expectations.
Seeing as how the thread has split into two separate topics, I'll be making two separate posts. One on politics and one on religion. There may be a few posts between the two, as it does take a while to gather and type out my thoughts.
I'll start with a bit of a disclaimer. I write what I believe. Not to the law or anything else. And I deal in what I believe to be very hard truths. A lot of you, in fact, may not like what I have to say. That's fine. My goal is not to get you to like me, simply to provoke thought and spark intelligent debate. To accomplish that goal, I only ask that you remain as objectionable as possible while you read.
In that spirit, I suppose I should start with what I do believe. I'm fairly certain I'm conservative. Some might go so far as to call me a libertarian. As a politically-minded person, I'm still fairly young, and as such I'm still trying to gather and organize my beliefs before I can slap a label on them.
There are some laws that are right for the wrong reasons, and some that are wrong for the right reasons. I believe V said it best, "People should not be afraid of governments, governments should be afraid of their people." The moment you allow the government to intervene in what you believe is the moment you become enslaved to it. And that, I believe, is what is happening in this country right now.
It is so very easy to take something that is handed to you. But nothing comes without a price, and the next time it happens to you I urge you to take a very close look at the person handing it to you and ask yourself what their motives are. You cannot truly value something unless you've earned it yourself.
I believe in what this country's founders did. You are entitled to only 10 things. They are called the Bill of Rights. you are entitled to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness, but not to have it handed to you. And to that end education is not a right, it is a privilege. If the government offers you a "free" education, think about what you will eventually have to trade to get it, and think about what you will actually be taught.
The point brought up about civil rights is a good one, and in light of what I'm about to say, I would be remiss to mention that in the 1800s if you were a slave, you didn't have the right to an education either. If you could read, you were killed. Society's values reflect their culture. What is different from then and now? Why can a black man not be kept from a restaurant now? Yes, it's the laws, but it should not be. You don't go into another man's house and tell him how to act and what to believe, and neither should the government.
The answer, the real answer, is the people. As thought and ideas continue to be exchanged, people change, and that changes the values of society. It's hard to imagine, but if you'd been raised with the values of the 1830s, you you wouldn't think twice about keeping a black man out of a restaurant. But this new generation has stopped seeing people as black, white, asian, and hispanic, and started seeing them as humans.
Ask yourself though, truly ask yourself, how far does that acceptance extend? And I will use the most extreme example. Can a man be faulted for being attracted to a child any more than he can be faulted for being attracted to another man? Is 18 a magic number where the opposite sex suddenly becomes attractive? I remember developing my first crush in Kindergarten at the age of 5. Of course there is no way to properly engage in sex with someone who lacks basic world experience, but what if someday that was no longer the case? Even today many children think nothing of sending naked pictures to each other. It's just food for thought.
In the end, if someone were to discriminate against someone else, in some places, the law may stop it. But I believe law should have nothing to do with it, and it should be left up to the greater will of the people. If someone excludes somebody and you don't like it, don't use their establishment. If enough people feel the same, heir business will dry up.
Seeing as how the thread has split into two separate topics, I'll be making two separate posts. One on politics and one on religion. There may be a few posts between the two, as it does take a while to gather and type out my thoughts.
I'll start with a bit of a disclaimer. I write what I believe. Not to the law or anything else. And I deal in what I believe to be very hard truths. A lot of you, in fact, may not like what I have to say. That's fine. My goal is not to get you to like me, simply to provoke thought and spark intelligent debate. To accomplish that goal, I only ask that you remain as objectionable as possible while you read.
In that spirit, I suppose I should start with what I do believe. I'm fairly certain I'm conservative. Some might go so far as to call me a libertarian. As a politically-minded person, I'm still fairly young, and as such I'm still trying to gather and organize my beliefs before I can slap a label on them.
There are some laws that are right for the wrong reasons, and some that are wrong for the right reasons. I believe V said it best, "People should not be afraid of governments, governments should be afraid of their people." The moment you allow the government to intervene in what you believe is the moment you become enslaved to it. And that, I believe, is what is happening in this country right now.
It is so very easy to take something that is handed to you. But nothing comes without a price, and the next time it happens to you I urge you to take a very close look at the person handing it to you and ask yourself what their motives are. You cannot truly value something unless you've earned it yourself.
I believe in what this country's founders did. You are entitled to only 10 things. They are called the Bill of Rights. you are entitled to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness, but not to have it handed to you. And to that end education is not a right, it is a privilege. If the government offers you a "free" education, think about what you will eventually have to trade to get it, and think about what you will actually be taught.
The point brought up about civil rights is a good one, and in light of what I'm about to say, I would be remiss to mention that in the 1800s if you were a slave, you didn't have the right to an education either. If you could read, you were killed. Society's values reflect their culture. What is different from then and now? Why can a black man not be kept from a restaurant now? Yes, it's the laws, but it should not be. You don't go into another man's house and tell him how to act and what to believe, and neither should the government.
The answer, the real answer, is the people. As thought and ideas continue to be exchanged, people change, and that changes the values of society. It's hard to imagine, but if you'd been raised with the values of the 1830s, you you wouldn't think twice about keeping a black man out of a restaurant. But this new generation has stopped seeing people as black, white, asian, and hispanic, and started seeing them as humans.
Ask yourself though, truly ask yourself, how far does that acceptance extend? And I will use the most extreme example. Can a man be faulted for being attracted to a child any more than he can be faulted for being attracted to another man? Is 18 a magic number where the opposite sex suddenly becomes attractive? I remember developing my first crush in Kindergarten at the age of 5. Of course there is no way to properly engage in sex with someone who lacks basic world experience, but what if someday that was no longer the case? Even today many children think nothing of sending naked pictures to each other. It's just food for thought.
In the end, if someone were to discriminate against someone else, in some places, the law may stop it. But I believe law should have nothing to do with it, and it should be left up to the greater will of the people. If someone excludes somebody and you don't like it, don't use their establishment. If enough people feel the same, heir business will dry up.
And I suppose I should begin religion the same as my last post, by stating my beliefs. But this is a difficult subject to talk about and all I can do is promise that I will try my hardest not to evangelize to anyone.
I cannot look at all the beauty in the world and not believe that there is some divine hand behind it all. I was raised Christian - Methodist actually. I'm not an advocate for the separation of church and state. I've always believed that society cannot function without some moral background. I know one doesn't need religion to have morals, but I often wonder how or if morals would have developed without religion. However I am an advocate of the separation of state and church, if that makes any sense to you.
I've found that despite the doctrines, politics exist in church, and that if someone doesn't like you or what you have to say, they can make it uncomfortable to attend. So I've chosen to worship on my own. Having always been told that God loves everyone, I can't imagine he would deliberately keep anyone from heaven, and I would like to think that he worked through Moses, Buddha, and Mohammed the same as he worked through Jesus.
Some Christian denominations are certainly more strict than others but tentatively they all have the same core values, and if you've done your best to follow them for long enough, you start seeing the world as a very different place. Every person I look at now I see a miracle. Someone who developed from a tiny seed into a marvel of nature. I wonder what experiences in life they've had and what stories they have to tell. Instead of a person, it's a lot easier to see them as human.
And in a futile attempt to tie in to the original topic, I've recently exposed myself (not in the literal sense) to a group of Catholics who pray outside of an abortion clinic. Being adopted myself, it's not hard to guess my views on abortion, but I was impressed by these people. They don't judge the women going in, or the nurses that work there, or even the doctors that perform the procedure. They meet everyone they come across with love and open arms.
As much as I would like to, I'm not going to recommend religion to anyone here. But I will recommend that you go talk to priests and ministers of all walks of faith if only to share ideas. When you do I believe you will find you've grown as a person.
I cannot look at all the beauty in the world and not believe that there is some divine hand behind it all. I was raised Christian - Methodist actually. I'm not an advocate for the separation of church and state. I've always believed that society cannot function without some moral background. I know one doesn't need religion to have morals, but I often wonder how or if morals would have developed without religion. However I am an advocate of the separation of state and church, if that makes any sense to you.
I've found that despite the doctrines, politics exist in church, and that if someone doesn't like you or what you have to say, they can make it uncomfortable to attend. So I've chosen to worship on my own. Having always been told that God loves everyone, I can't imagine he would deliberately keep anyone from heaven, and I would like to think that he worked through Moses, Buddha, and Mohammed the same as he worked through Jesus.
Some Christian denominations are certainly more strict than others but tentatively they all have the same core values, and if you've done your best to follow them for long enough, you start seeing the world as a very different place. Every person I look at now I see a miracle. Someone who developed from a tiny seed into a marvel of nature. I wonder what experiences in life they've had and what stories they have to tell. Instead of a person, it's a lot easier to see them as human.
And in a futile attempt to tie in to the original topic, I've recently exposed myself (not in the literal sense) to a group of Catholics who pray outside of an abortion clinic. Being adopted myself, it's not hard to guess my views on abortion, but I was impressed by these people. They don't judge the women going in, or the nurses that work there, or even the doctors that perform the procedure. They meet everyone they come across with love and open arms.
As much as I would like to, I'm not going to recommend religion to anyone here. But I will recommend that you go talk to priests and ministers of all walks of faith if only to share ideas. When you do I believe you will find you've grown as a person.
Wish your group of Catholics lived in my city. A crazy religious nut just murdered our abortion doctor. After the doctor came out of church no less.
Fenrir.Shindo said:
And I suppose I should begin religion the same as my last post, by stating my beliefs. But this is a difficult subject to talk about and all I can do is promise that I will try my hardest not to evangelize to anyone.
I cannot look at all the beauty in the world and not believe that there is some divine hand behind it all. I was raised Christian - Methodist actually. I'm not an advocate for the separation of church and state. I've always believed that society cannot function without some moral background. I know one doesn't need religion to have morals, but I often wonder how or if morals would have developed without religion. However I am an advocate of the separation of state and church, if that makes any sense to you.
I've found that despite the doctrines, politics exist in church, and that if someone doesn't like you or what you have to say, they can make it uncomfortable to attend. So I've chosen to worship on my own. Having always been told that God loves everyone, I can't imagine he would deliberately keep anyone from heaven, and I would like to think that he worked through Moses, Buddha, and Mohammed the same as he worked through Jesus.
Some Christian denominations are certainly more strict than others but tentatively they all have the same core values, and if you've done your best to follow them for long enough, you start seeing the world as a very different place. Every person I look at now I see a miracle. Someone who developed from a tiny seed into a marvel of nature. I wonder what experiences in life they've had and what stories they have to tell. Instead of a person, it's a lot easier to see them as human.
And in a futile attempt to tie in to the original topic, I've recently exposed myself (not in the literal sense) to a group of Catholics who pray outside of an abortion clinic. Being adopted myself, it's not hard to guess my views on abortion, but I was impressed by these people. They don't judge the women going in, or the nurses that work there, or even the doctors that perform the procedure. They meet everyone they come across with love and open arms.
As much as I would like to, I'm not going to recommend religion to anyone here. But I will recommend that you go talk to priests and ministers of all walks of faith if only to share ideas. When you do I believe you will find you've grown as a person.
I cannot look at all the beauty in the world and not believe that there is some divine hand behind it all. I was raised Christian - Methodist actually. I'm not an advocate for the separation of church and state. I've always believed that society cannot function without some moral background. I know one doesn't need religion to have morals, but I often wonder how or if morals would have developed without religion. However I am an advocate of the separation of state and church, if that makes any sense to you.
I've found that despite the doctrines, politics exist in church, and that if someone doesn't like you or what you have to say, they can make it uncomfortable to attend. So I've chosen to worship on my own. Having always been told that God loves everyone, I can't imagine he would deliberately keep anyone from heaven, and I would like to think that he worked through Moses, Buddha, and Mohammed the same as he worked through Jesus.
Some Christian denominations are certainly more strict than others but tentatively they all have the same core values, and if you've done your best to follow them for long enough, you start seeing the world as a very different place. Every person I look at now I see a miracle. Someone who developed from a tiny seed into a marvel of nature. I wonder what experiences in life they've had and what stories they have to tell. Instead of a person, it's a lot easier to see them as human.
And in a futile attempt to tie in to the original topic, I've recently exposed myself (not in the literal sense) to a group of Catholics who pray outside of an abortion clinic. Being adopted myself, it's not hard to guess my views on abortion, but I was impressed by these people. They don't judge the women going in, or the nurses that work there, or even the doctors that perform the procedure. They meet everyone they come across with love and open arms.
As much as I would like to, I'm not going to recommend religion to anyone here. But I will recommend that you go talk to priests and ministers of all walks of faith if only to share ideas. When you do I believe you will find you've grown as a person.
Every single major religion says i'm going to hell, so I fail to see how I can grow as a person when the foundation of their thought is subjective to me. I don't hate them, I just don't pay any mind to them.
Fenrir.Shindo said:
Finally managing to pull myself away from Yakuza 3, I have returned. And seeing as how the immaculate name of Bonta-kun has been invoked, I will do my best to perform to expectations.
Seeing as how the thread has split into two separate topics, I'll be making two separate posts. One on politics and one on religion. There may be a few posts between the two, as it does take a while to gather and type out my thoughts.
I'll start with a bit of a disclaimer. I write what I believe. Not to the law or anything else. And I deal in what I believe to be very hard truths. A lot of you, in fact, may not like what I have to say. That's fine. My goal is not to get you to like me, simply to provoke thought and spark intelligent debate. To accomplish that goal, I only ask that you remain as objectionable as possible while you read.
In that spirit, I suppose I should start with what I do believe. I'm fairly certain I'm conservative. Some might go so far as to call me a libertarian. As a politically-minded person, I'm still fairly young, and as such I'm still trying to gather and organize my beliefs before I can slap a label on them.
There are some laws that are right for the wrong reasons, and some that are wrong for the right reasons. I believe V said it best, "People should not be afraid of governments, governments should be afraid of their people." The moment you allow the government to intervene in what you believe is the moment you become enslaved to it. And that, I believe, is what is happening in this country right now.
It is so very easy to take something that is handed to you. But nothing comes without a price, and the next time it happens to you I urge you to take a very close look at the person handing it to you and ask yourself what their motives are. You cannot truly value something unless you've earned it yourself.
I believe in what this country's founders did. You are entitled to only 10 things. They are called the Bill of Rights. you are entitled to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness, but not to have it handed to you. And to that end education is not a right, it is a privilege. If the government offers you a "free" education, think about what you will eventually have to trade to get it, and think about what you will actually be taught.
The point brought up about civil rights is a good one, and in light of what I'm about to say, I would be remiss to mention that in the 1800s if you were a slave, you didn't have the right to an education either. If you could read, you were killed. Society's values reflect their culture. What is different from then and now? Why can a black man not be kept from a restaurant now? Yes, it's the laws, but it should not be. You don't go into another man's house and tell him how to act and what to believe, and neither should the government.
The answer, the real answer, is the people. As thought and ideas continue to be exchanged, people change, and that changes the values of society. It's hard to imagine, but if you'd been raised with the values of the 1830s, you you wouldn't think twice about keeping a black man out of a restaurant. But this new generation has stopped seeing people as black, white, asian, and hispanic, and started seeing them as humans.
Ask yourself though, truly ask yourself, how far does that acceptance extend? And I will use the most extreme example. Can a man be faulted for being attracted to a child any more than he can be faulted for being attracted to another man? Is 18 a magic number where the opposite sex suddenly becomes attractive? I remember developing my first crush in Kindergarten at the age of 5. Of course there is no way to properly engage in sex with someone who lacks basic world experience, but what if someday that was no longer the case? Even today many children think nothing of sending naked pictures to each other. It's just food for thought.
In the end, if someone were to discriminate against someone else, in some places, the law may stop it. But I believe law should have nothing to do with it, and it should be left up to the greater will of the people. If someone excludes somebody and you don't like it, don't use their establishment. If enough people feel the same, heir business will dry up.
Seeing as how the thread has split into two separate topics, I'll be making two separate posts. One on politics and one on religion. There may be a few posts between the two, as it does take a while to gather and type out my thoughts.
I'll start with a bit of a disclaimer. I write what I believe. Not to the law or anything else. And I deal in what I believe to be very hard truths. A lot of you, in fact, may not like what I have to say. That's fine. My goal is not to get you to like me, simply to provoke thought and spark intelligent debate. To accomplish that goal, I only ask that you remain as objectionable as possible while you read.
In that spirit, I suppose I should start with what I do believe. I'm fairly certain I'm conservative. Some might go so far as to call me a libertarian. As a politically-minded person, I'm still fairly young, and as such I'm still trying to gather and organize my beliefs before I can slap a label on them.
There are some laws that are right for the wrong reasons, and some that are wrong for the right reasons. I believe V said it best, "People should not be afraid of governments, governments should be afraid of their people." The moment you allow the government to intervene in what you believe is the moment you become enslaved to it. And that, I believe, is what is happening in this country right now.
It is so very easy to take something that is handed to you. But nothing comes without a price, and the next time it happens to you I urge you to take a very close look at the person handing it to you and ask yourself what their motives are. You cannot truly value something unless you've earned it yourself.
I believe in what this country's founders did. You are entitled to only 10 things. They are called the Bill of Rights. you are entitled to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness, but not to have it handed to you. And to that end education is not a right, it is a privilege. If the government offers you a "free" education, think about what you will eventually have to trade to get it, and think about what you will actually be taught.
The point brought up about civil rights is a good one, and in light of what I'm about to say, I would be remiss to mention that in the 1800s if you were a slave, you didn't have the right to an education either. If you could read, you were killed. Society's values reflect their culture. What is different from then and now? Why can a black man not be kept from a restaurant now? Yes, it's the laws, but it should not be. You don't go into another man's house and tell him how to act and what to believe, and neither should the government.
The answer, the real answer, is the people. As thought and ideas continue to be exchanged, people change, and that changes the values of society. It's hard to imagine, but if you'd been raised with the values of the 1830s, you you wouldn't think twice about keeping a black man out of a restaurant. But this new generation has stopped seeing people as black, white, asian, and hispanic, and started seeing them as humans.
Ask yourself though, truly ask yourself, how far does that acceptance extend? And I will use the most extreme example. Can a man be faulted for being attracted to a child any more than he can be faulted for being attracted to another man? Is 18 a magic number where the opposite sex suddenly becomes attractive? I remember developing my first crush in Kindergarten at the age of 5. Of course there is no way to properly engage in sex with someone who lacks basic world experience, but what if someday that was no longer the case? Even today many children think nothing of sending naked pictures to each other. It's just food for thought.
In the end, if someone were to discriminate against someone else, in some places, the law may stop it. But I believe law should have nothing to do with it, and it should be left up to the greater will of the people. If someone excludes somebody and you don't like it, don't use their establishment. If enough people feel the same, heir business will dry up.
Your home is not a public place, so that point is pretty much moot. I do agree however that just boycotting and spreading through word of mouth one's disdain for an establishment is a powerful tool. In this case we're discussing a private school which is kind of a unique scenario, but the reason things like the civil rights movements become law is because the people prove themselves unable to make the right choice. Laws aren't just made into laws because one guy suddenly decides it should be, there's a long and grueling process behind it, where two opposite sides of the coin have a chance to debate the issue for a long time (IE healthcare reform taking forever). Nothing is arbitrarily contrived and enforced, that would be a dictatorship.
Asura.Malekith said:
Personally I think the archdiocese made the right call.
Look if this was a public school then we have an issue. Because FREE PUBLIC education is a right.
However, this is a private school, as such they can do what they want. There is a history of court decisions and public policy on their side, because in the end Private education is a privilege.
Privileges aren't rights, folks. It's not even close. As such they are easily gained and lost, wholly dependent on the whim of whomever issued them in the first place.
Look if this was a public school then we have an issue. Because FREE PUBLIC education is a right.
However, this is a private school, as such they can do what they want. There is a history of court decisions and public policy on their side, because in the end Private education is a privilege.
Privileges aren't rights, folks. It's not even close. As such they are easily gained and lost, wholly dependent on the whim of whomever issued them in the first place.
[+]
Whether or not there is a right or a wrong side in this, I just feel bad for the child. She's getting caught up in the adult drama, the kind that she probably can't even comprehend. She's being rejected for something beyond her control without truly understanding and on the other side, she could just be being used as a tool for some silly stunt. No child deserves any of this. /sigh
[+]
First off let me start by saying Discrimination of any sort doesn't really sit well with me. The Christian community (Not everyone just those that do things such as what was mentioned here) doesn't really sit well with me either. I just cannot fathom how people can think its okay to judge someone on their sexuality/religious beliefs (or lack there of) or really anything for that matter, when passing judgment is wrong to begin with (according to their religion). Now don't get me wrong, I know plenty of Christians (friends/family/etc.) and I love them dearly, not to mention that I used to be Christian myself(I'm now Pagan). However, the reason I am no longer Christian is because of the mass amounts of hypocrisy within their belief system. I'm not saying that the Church didn't have a right to turn them away, because they do, but the Parents of that child and the Gay Community have the right to protest it if they so wish. In fact, more power to them for protesting.
Fenrir.Shindo said:
I'm fairly certain I'm conservative. Some might go so far as to call me a libertarian.
Good post, and I respect your opinion (even if I disagree), but I do feel the need to correct you on this one.
Libertarians and Conservatives only agree on fiscal policy: basically, small government, less spending, lower taxes. That's it.
Libertarians arguably take that a step further: that the government should be so small, it has no role in limiting personal or interpersonal behavior that does not harm someone else.
That means anything goes: legalize all drugs, legalize gay marriage, remove all broadcasting decency laws/game and movie ratings, legalize prostitution, relax gun laws, relax pornography laws, etc. Any and all consensual acts between adults should be legal until it tangibly hurts someone else. They also tend to be environmentalists and soundly reject the influence of religion in government.
This places them to the left of even Liberal Democrats on nearly all social issues, and in direct opposition to Conservatives. The only thing they agree on is taxes and spending.
Recently, because the last two Republican/Conservative administrations were so unpopular, there has been an effort to hijack the term "Libertarian" to mean "True Conservative." Basically, to the Right of the current Republican Party, in an effort to rebrand their message. This drives the actual Libertarian party batshit insane, because they couldn't disagree more on most issues.
I appreciate the correction. I haven't done much research in the area, and honestly the last thing I care about is fixing a label on myself.
I think basically the moral of the story here is that America really needs to start practicing freedom FROM religion and not freedom OF religion. Religion only forces people to think a certain way and forsakes all other ways of thought. It's 2010 and the fact that people running my country still believe in talking snakes and women being from made from a rib is absurd and (to some extent) dangerous. Leave religion in the dark ages where it belongs and move onto free thinking, people. Religion will only hold back the progression of all humankind as a whole.
[+]
LOL...people are going on and on about government interference, capitalism, and the legal right to discriminate, but few seems to be touching on the real issue here: A CHILD who has NO SAY in his/her circumstances is being told that an institution created for the sole purpose of educating will NOT educate him/her SOLELY because of RELIGIOUS INDIGNATION.
Wow...this sounds EXACTLY like something I'd hear coming out of some oppressive country in the Middle East, not the self-declared "Land of the Free".
Just...wow.
Wow...this sounds EXACTLY like something I'd hear coming out of some oppressive country in the Middle East, not the self-declared "Land of the Free".
Just...wow.
[+]
Preschool am srs business now guys... One cannot learn the way school is before the real deal, because their parents arent straight!
Pandemonium.Alimorel said:
Whether or not there is a right or a wrong side in this, I just feel bad for the child. She's getting caught up in the adult drama, the kind that she probably can't even comprehend. She's being rejected for something beyond her control without truly understanding and on the other side, she could just be being used as a tool for some silly stunt. No child deserves any of this. /sigh
I think the kid will be fine, I mean most kids would love to get out of school, especially Catholic school. Considering that at least 50% of any elementary class is spent repeating last year's curriculum, the child won't get far behind everyone else.
If there actually is any trauma inflicted on the kid, it's the parents fault. They're no different than the parents who give their kids a "God hates gays" picket board to hold because they're using the kid to promote their politics. Unless those lesbians are really so naive to think a Catholic school would have no problems, they knew what would eventually come of it. Shame on them for giving the child no choice in all of this.
Caitsith.Silvaria said:
LOL...people are going on and on about government interference, capitalism, and the legal right to discriminate, but few seems to be touching on the real issue here: A CHILD who has NO SAY in his/her circumstances is being told that an institution created for the sole purpose of educating will NOT educate him/her SOLELY because of RELIGIOUS INDIGNATION.
Wow...this sounds EXACTLY like something I'd hear coming out of some oppressive country in the Middle East, not the self-declared "Land of the Free".
Just...wow.
Wow...this sounds EXACTLY like something I'd hear coming out of some oppressive country in the Middle East, not the self-declared "Land of the Free".
Just...wow.
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Asura.Malekith said:
Caitsith.Silvaria said:
LOL...people are going on and on about government interference, capitalism, and the legal right to discriminate, but few seems to be touching on the real issue here: A CHILD who has NO SAY in his/her circumstances is being told that an institution created for the sole purpose of educating will NOT educate him/her SOLELY because of RELIGIOUS INDIGNATION.
Wow...this sounds EXACTLY like something I'd hear coming out of some oppressive country in the Middle East, not the self-declared "Land of the Free".
Just...wow.
Wow...this sounds EXACTLY like something I'd hear coming out of some oppressive country in the Middle East, not the self-declared "Land of the Free".
Just...wow.
Jaerik said:
First, the school is in the wrong. State law in Colorado, where this school is located, says private institutions cannot deny service based on sexual orientation. End of discussion.
The denial wasn't based on orientation of the student, the kid's too young to even know. Sure it's semantics since it's the parents being discriminated again but splitting legal hairs like that matters a big damn deal.
IF you dig deeper and look at the local coverage you don't see anything about the local ACLU, GLBTG groups or the prosecutors making any argument that the denial was illegal. The school was within it's rights.
Furthermore for the kid that was in school, and a sibling that is there as well they're being allowed to finish off the school years. They're not being allowed to return. We're not talking about an instant boot situation
Look I respect jaerik, but he's not all knowing. How about you do your own research and come back to me when you find out first hand what the facts are. Don't just come on here and wave "jaerik said" at me.
IF you dig deeper and look at the local coverage you don't see anything about the local ACLU, GLBTG groups or the prosecutors making any argument that the denial was illegal. The school was within it's rights.
Furthermore for the kid that was in school, and a sibling that is there as well they're being allowed to finish off the school years. They're not being allowed to return. We're not talking about an instant boot situation
Look I respect jaerik, but he's not all knowing. How about you do your own research and come back to me when you find out first hand what the facts are. Don't just come on here and wave "jaerik said" at me.
Asura.Malekith said:
In our land of the free that school has every right to carry out its educational mission the way it sees fit. The parents had an agenda and picked a fight... that's the real issue here.
except in colorado schools dont have "every right to carry out its educational mission the way it sees fit". stop trying to make it sound like the america you wished we lived in, where its ok to deny KIDS education for their race, creed, or sexual orientation(even if only talking about private schools), is the actual world we live in.. where basically everyone everywhere knows that shits not ok by any means.
Asura.Malekith said:
Look I respect jaerik, but he's not all knowing. How about you do your own research and come back to me when you find out first hand what the facts are. Don't just come on here and wave "jaerik said" at me.
try heading your own advise >.>
Asura.Malekith said:
IF you dig deeper and look at the local coverage you don't see anything about the local ACLU, GLBTG groups or the prosecutors making any argument that the denial was illegal. The school was within it's rights.
You mean like this:
Quote:
Mindy Barton, legal director of the GLBT Community Center of Colorado in Denver, said her organization is investigating the case to make sure the private Catholic school didn't violate discrimination laws when it turned away the student. But, she said, she believes the school was within its legal right.
"Their actions might be legal, but that doesn't make them right," she said. "It's frustrating and disappointing."
Source: Dailycamera
"Their actions might be legal, but that doesn't make them right," she said. "It's frustrating and disappointing."
Source: Dailycamera
If what Jaerik said is true, that in Co. private institutions can't discriminate based on sexual orientation, then they must be considering the child the one the school discriminated against. However, your assertion that no one from the GLBT community is looking into this is wrong. Your assertion that no one is looking into the legality of this is wrong.
Furthermore the contract was likely with the parents who would be the ones paying for the education of their child. The school was offering the service to the parents not the child. Therefore, it would be the parents that are being discriminated against.
Malekith said:
Look I respect jaerik, but he's not all knowing. How about you do your own research and come back to me when you find out first hand what the facts are. Don't just come on here and wave "jaerik said" at me.
Leviathan.Syla said:
I think basically the moral of the story here is that America really needs to start practicing freedom FROM religion and not freedom OF religion. Religion only forces people to think a certain way and forsakes all other ways of thought. It's 2010 and the fact that people running my country still believe in talking snakes and women being from made from a rib is absurd and (to some extent) dangerous. Leave religion in the dark ages where it belongs and move onto free thinking, people. Religion will only hold back the progression of all humankind as a whole.
Well, God only ask for 10% of our paychecks. Unlike some people who demand you a 33% of it. Hey but at least they give you something back lol
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