[XIV] Tanaka Debunks Fatigue Rumours

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2010-09-08
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[XIV] Tanaka Debunks fatigue rumours
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 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-25 21:26:55
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You guys playing the open beta next week?
 Odin.Zicdeh
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-08-25 21:27:20
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Phoenix.Oumura said:
As stated before, the UI lag is mainly because its all server-side for now. Upon release it should be client-side so hopefully it will be much better. :D

I hope so, that leaves the targeting issues and the actual UI issues, though I can get through unwieldy menus without much issue, but if targeting is still an issue, and Monster Party V. Player Party combat is still a commonality, that could prove troublesome.
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-08-25 21:28:26
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Shiva.Flionheart said:
You guys playing the open beta next week?


I certainly am. "Next week" Might be a little optimistic, but I'd say within 2 weeks for sure. My guess is by the 7th of September.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-25 21:33:51
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Odin.Zicdeh said:
Shiva.Flionheart said:
You guys playing the open beta next week?


I certainly am. "Next week" Might be a little optimistic, but I'd say within 2 weeks for sure. My guess is by the 7th of September.

Sounds viable. I'll be making a character for it anyway. Is it bad that the main thing I'm looking forward to is character creation, and the story? lol
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By Odin.Zicdeh 2010-08-25 21:44:23
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Shiva.Flionheart said:
Odin.Zicdeh said:
Shiva.Flionheart said:
You guys playing the open beta next week?


I certainly am. "Next week" Might be a little optimistic, but I'd say within 2 weeks for sure. My guess is by the 7th of September.

Sounds viable. I'll be making a character for it anyway. Is it bad that the main thing I'm looking forward to is character creation, and the story? lol


Not really, but that may be because of the words you chose. Story often is what seperates a "Meh" game from a "Omgwtfittiesgo!" game, look at Mass Effect 2. Really just B- Third Person tacshooter, but make that the driving force to progress the top-notch Bioware Story and cinematic design, and you have a game that defines a genre.


I still really want to get my hands on the battle system, and from what I've seen, the atmosphere looks a lot more unique than FFXI's fairly bland world. FFXIV seems to really be a snapshot in the greatest FF days of that Techno-past vibe, sort of like FFIV(? the Kefka one), FFIX and FFXII, instead of that god awful angsty Steam-punk SyFy ***of FFVIII and FFXIII.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-25 21:53:07
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I know what you mean, I actually really like the setting of XIV, it does seem to be similar to VI and IX in terms of time placement. I quite like what they did with XI in terms of time placement. Sky and Sea were quite sci-fi ish, as if the gods were more technologically advanced.
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By Lakshmi.Snuffy 2010-08-25 22:00:42
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Odin.Zicdeh said:
FFXIV seems to really be a snapshot in the greatest FF days of that Techno-past vibe, sort of like FFIV(? the Kefka one), FFIX and FFXII, instead of that god awful angsty Steam-punk SyFy ***of FFVIII and FFXIII.

I think you have it backwards. I'd consider 6 to be the only steampunk FF, since you know, it actually had steam engine machinery and industrial revolution setting. 8 was not steampunk by a longshot, that's a mix of Japanese university culture with Tom Clancy politics and high fantasy and high scifi backdrop. Haven't played 13 but the looks of it puts it closer to pre-Sin 10, which is just sci fi, gods-are-actually-aliens type.
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By Zekko 2010-08-25 22:20:44
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FFXIV.Nobuaki said:
We'd like to thank all the beta testers for their cooperation during the closed beta test. We have received your valuable opinions and feedback and will do our best to incorporate them into the open beta and official release versions of the game.

Now, we have received a lot of questions and opinions from everyone today, and we would like to give you some answers regarding character growth balance in beta phase 3.

First, the concept was to achieve a balance which would allow those with little time to enjoy FFXIV to get more out of their play time, and above that, create a game that does not force you to spend long hours playing it. To that end, we implemented Guardian's Favor, which adds a bonus to Guildleve, and makes it easier to level in shorter amounts of time.

To balance this out, we came up with a hypothesis regarding what amount of skill points and experience one was likely to earn in an hour. Think of this as a rate at which a player can fight battles, do Guildleves or skill-up.

Then, using that supposed amount, we made it so you can earn 8 hours worth of skill points and experience at 100% of this rate. The subsequent 7 hours' worth will gradually see the attainable skill points and experience points fall to 0.

The limitation on thee amount of points you can attain is set on a weekly timer. Once it passes a week since you first began leveling a particular skill, the limitation resets to zero. After it resets, it will come into effect again once you begin work on that skill once more.

Even if you are hit with this limitation during a one-week period, its detrimental effects decrease if you do not level that particular class. You can even recover back to the full 100% rate of point acquisition, so you do not always have to wait the full week for the limitations to go away.

The skill points you do not gain are instead saved as Surplus Points. Each class has its own amount surplus points, so you can try out a new class if surplus points begin appearing in your log window.

However, each class does not have its own amount of experience, so playing a different class will not mitigate the declining experience point rate.

This is the system as currently implemented.

In truth, this system was not just put in during phase 3 of the beta, but has been implemented from the start. However, we have received many opinions saying the system explained above is not what actually appears in phase 3 of the beta. There are several reasons for this.

Around the time of beta phase 3, it became possible to play for longer periods of time, thus increasing the amount one could play in a single week.
In beta phase 3, Guildleves received a boost in skill points and experience points awarded to encourage party play.
The skill points and experience gained from defeating enemy parties as well as weaker single enemies was lowered, though due to a bug, did not take affect initially in beta phase 3. This was fixed during beta phase 3.
The number biggest culprit behind this issue was that last bug, which allowed players to gain more skill points and experience than we expected, causing the limitations to come into effect much quicker. Of course, not adjusting the limitations in accordance with the boost to Guildleve was a problem as well.

The lack of explanation regarding these adjustments was a mistake on our part for which we sincerely apologize.

The numbers behind these limitations are all still under development, and we plan to adjust them according to player feedback in an effort to make them less severe. In particular, we are considering making the decline in points less drastic and are already hard at work on it. Also, as the limit on experience carries over through class changes, we plan to lessen its effect compared with the limit on skill points.

At the very least, we promise players will not be hitting the limit as quickly as they did at the start of beta phase 3.

Also, I would like to address one other thing below:

The reduction in what you acquire from gathering is based on the actions of that particular class and is unrelated to limitations on leveling. We are also in the process of adjusting this and plan to make changes based on player feedback.

Surplus points currently have no use. However, there are opinions saying preparing some kind of reward would be good, but that's just giving people something else to strive for, which misses the whole point of this system. We want to take our time and thoroughly investigate this issue.

Now, the open beta test will include more than just the above adjustments. As we stated before, awarding more skill points for party play is also an important topic we plan to address, so we hope you enjoy testing out what we come up with.

Lastly, as director of this title, I wish to deeply apologize for the lateness of my comments due to my absence while attending Gamescom. In addition, articles written during my trip contained much speculation, outdated information and mistranslations which only invited more confusion. In the future, I will do my best to make direct, official statements in a timely manner. I humbly ask for your understanding regarding this matter.

See you in the open beta!

Final Fantasy XIV Director

Nobuaki Komoto


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 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-25 22:26:19
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Zekko said:
FFXIV.Nobuaki said:
We'd like to thank all the beta testers for their cooperation during the closed beta test. We have received your valuable opinions and feedback and will do our best to incorporate them into the open beta and official release versions of the game.

Now, we have received a lot of questions and opinions from everyone today, and we would like to give you some answers regarding character growth balance in beta phase 3.

First, the concept was to achieve a balance which would allow those with little time to enjoy FFXIV to get more out of their play time, and above that, create a game that does not force you to spend long hours playing it. To that end, we implemented Guardian's Favor, which adds a bonus to Guildleve, and makes it easier to level in shorter amounts of time.

To balance this out, we came up with a hypothesis regarding what amount of skill points and experience one was likely to earn in an hour. Think of this as a rate at which a player can fight battles, do Guildleves or skill-up.

Then, using that supposed amount, we made it so you can earn 8 hours worth of skill points and experience at 100% of this rate. The subsequent 7 hours' worth will gradually see the attainable skill points and experience points fall to 0.

The limitation on thee amount of points you can attain is set on a weekly timer. Once it passes a week since you first began leveling a particular skill, the limitation resets to zero. After it resets, it will come into effect again once you begin work on that skill once more.

Even if you are hit with this limitation during a one-week period, its detrimental effects decrease if you do not level that particular class. You can even recover back to the full 100% rate of point acquisition, so you do not always have to wait the full week for the limitations to go away.

The skill points you do not gain are instead saved as Surplus Points. Each class has its own amount surplus points, so you can try out a new class if surplus points begin appearing in your log window.

However, each class does not have its own amount of experience, so playing a different class will not mitigate the declining experience point rate.

This is the system as currently implemented.

In truth, this system was not just put in during phase 3 of the beta, but has been implemented from the start. However, we have received many opinions saying the system explained above is not what actually appears in phase 3 of the beta. There are several reasons for this.

Around the time of beta phase 3, it became possible to play for longer periods of time, thus increasing the amount one could play in a single week.
In beta phase 3, Guildleves received a boost in skill points and experience points awarded to encourage party play.
The skill points and experience gained from defeating enemy parties as well as weaker single enemies was lowered, though due to a bug, did not take affect initially in beta phase 3. This was fixed during beta phase 3.
The number biggest culprit behind this issue was that last bug, which allowed players to gain more skill points and experience than we expected, causing the limitations to come into effect much quicker. Of course, not adjusting the limitations in accordance with the boost to Guildleve was a problem as well.

The lack of explanation regarding these adjustments was a mistake on our part for which we sincerely apologize.

The numbers behind these limitations are all still under development, and we plan to adjust them according to player feedback in an effort to make them less severe. In particular, we are considering making the decline in points less drastic and are already hard at work on it. Also, as the limit on experience carries over through class changes, we plan to lessen its effect compared with the limit on skill points.

At the very least, we promise players will not be hitting the limit as quickly as they did at the start of beta phase 3.

Also, I would like to address one other thing below:

The reduction in what you acquire from gathering is based on the actions of that particular class and is unrelated to limitations on leveling. We are also in the process of adjusting this and plan to make changes based on player feedback.

Surplus points currently have no use. However, there are opinions saying preparing some kind of reward would be good, but that's just giving people something else to strive for, which misses the whole point of this system. We want to take our time and thoroughly investigate this issue.

Now, the open beta test will include more than just the above adjustments. As we stated before, awarding more skill points for party play is also an important topic we plan to address, so we hope you enjoy testing out what we come up with.

Lastly, as director of this title, I wish to deeply apologize for the lateness of my comments due to my absence while attending Gamescom. In addition, articles written during my trip contained much speculation, outdated information and mistranslations which only invited more confusion. In the future, I will do my best to make direct, official statements in a timely manner. I humbly ask for your understanding regarding this matter.

See you in the open beta!

Final Fantasy XIV Director

Nobuaki Komoto



Bolded the part that made me happy, and not worried anymore.
 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-25 22:31:38
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I'm also happy to know that Tanaka is actually looking at the beta forums to get good feedback on the system.
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By Alexander.Jukie 2010-08-26 05:13:11
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Am too lazy to check the whole thread but did you guys see this article? It just popped up on facebook.

http://ffxiv.zam.com/story.html?story=23092
 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-26 05:14:21
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Alexander.Jukie said:
Am too lazy to check the whole thread but did you guys see this article? It just popped up on facebook.

http://ffxiv.zam.com/story.html?story=23092

Yup, it's up a few posts. It's made me happy that you can recover back to 100% when playing a different class meaning that you can recover fatigue before the week is up.
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By Alexander.Jukie 2010-08-26 05:19:02
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I hope they have a lot of other things to do in the game cos exping is something I do way too much
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By Unicorn.Jewkitten 2010-08-26 06:18:45
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What is disturbing is they are attempting to level the playing field, making the casual gamer and the hardcore gamer equal.

THE ENTIRE POINT OF MMO's is to see someone bad *** and ECLIPSE / SURPASS them! Now with this system no matter how hard I try, how much time I focus, I will never surpass someone who began 6-8 months ahead of me (cause I have to wait for PS3 version).

It is not the MMO's job to make a casual person viable and strong, it is the PLAYERS job to make themselves competitive and strong.

Those who don't care about the game and spend the time they do have on the game /telling others how great their RL is and calling the highly accomplished players nerds/losers have been and will always be a hundred steps behind those who have pride and a professional mindset in their gameplay.


And even with limits, restrictions and the such a focused, hungry and prideful person will find a way to surpass his peers and come out ahead. One way or another.
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By Unicorn.Jewkitten 2010-08-26 06:24:01
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P.S. - Making FFXIV super pretty yet super restricted they are aiming for an entire NEW casual audience.

Hardcore ppl will likely be forced to keep their FFXI accounts open just to have a unrestricted timesink.

Yet both casual and hardcore will be ALSO roped in by the newness off FXIV and all the shimmering adventure and potential.


The result: they gain an entire new audience, keep the old playerbase on BOTH games and continue to cash in teh moneh.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-26 06:25:30
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The limits are very loose from what we've been seeing. 15 hours on a job to get it to 0, 3 hours on another job to bring the first back to full EXP.

It's not that much of a big deal.
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By Unicorn.Jewkitten 2010-08-26 06:29:40
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Shiva.Flionheart said:
The limits are very loose from what we've been seeing. 15 hours on a job to get it to 0, 3 hours on another job to bring the first back to full EXP.

It's not that much of a big deal.


We shall see:/

I'll be playing it no matter how it turns out.


Just to be a respectable child-like Lalafell rather than a chubby baby Tarutaru if anything:D


Though the larger character models of elves and their version of Mithra are tempting, cause no one can see all my bad *** gear on my small *** Tarutaru:/ very hard to show off. lol
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-26 06:35:31
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Brogadyn here.

Always the Brogadyn man
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By Sylph.Belmonth 2010-08-26 10:41:12
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Don't you have to play other classes anyways? to learn the skills of the others?

Like in case of Lancer getting Second wind from pulgilist or Bloodbath from Marauder? I seriously doubt you can go 100% with one class and miss out on abilities of the other classes that could prove useful.
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By Lakshmi.Cesil 2010-08-26 15:11:13
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I don't think it will be too bad...well you never know but I am just going to wait and see.

At least this way I can level up a bunch of jobs instead of rushing to highest level on one job and such. :/
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-26 15:12:21
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Sylph.Belmonth said:
Don't you have to play other classes anyways? to learn the skills of the others?

Like in case of Lancer getting Second wind from pulgilist or Bloodbath from Marauder? I seriously doubt you can go 100% with one class and miss out on abilities of the other classes that could prove useful.

Yeah pretty much. In my opinion this is why the implemented the fatigue system. It's a way so that people are forced to try other classes and get helpful and sometimes necessary skills from.
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By Alexander.Jukie 2010-08-26 16:52:32
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Shiva.Flionheart said:


Yeah pretty much. In my opinion this is why the implemented the fatigue system. It's a way so that people are forced to try other classes and get helpful and sometimes necessary skills from.

I totally read that as *** system. My dyslexia do be good today. <.<
 
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 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-26 23:41:22
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You do realise fatigue slowly resets whilst playing another class, don't you? And you're not forced to play another class for skill points, just EXP.

Stop blowing this WAY out of proportion.

But then you could stay in XI, I heard it's getting some awesome things this update *snigger*
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 Lakshmi.Jaerik
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By Lakshmi.Jaerik 2010-08-27 01:47:20
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There seems to be two brands of FFXIV nay-sayers, here. There's those who don't want to play it due to some perceived defect like the fatigue system.

Which is fair enough. But then there's those who don't want to play it and feel somehow compelled to convince no one else to play it either. Which is baffling to me.
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By Odin.Blazza 2010-08-27 01:55:19
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So wait, does the fatigue system only effect exp points and not rank points? Because if that's the case then I really don't see the issue. The last couple of versions I played I felt it was too easy to get exp compared to rank points anyway. I reached level 15 about the same time I hit rank 10 Gladiator, and that was without touching any other job at all. If I was playing it properly, I'd be leveling a few jobs bit by bit for their skills rather than just burning one job as high and fast as I can. So yeah, if it only effects exp, then it sounds like a good thing.
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By Phoenix.Oumura 2010-08-27 01:59:52
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Shiva.Flionheart said:
Brogadyn here.
Always the Brogadyn man
1000xTHIS. The only thing I would ever be outside of this would be a Hyur...but even that is a stretch. Have we decided on a server yet? >.>;

Lakshmi.Jaerik said:
There seems to be two brands of FFXIV nay-sayers, here. There's those who don't want to play it due to some perceived defect like the fatigue system.

Which is fair enough. But then there's those who don't want to play it and feel somehow compelled to convince no one else to play it either. Which is baffling to me.
The latter is what I see much more of, even moreso as the release date looms ever closer. It seems to be the same people who have also put absurd amounts of time into XI as well. While I realize this may not always be the case, I'm just going based off of personal observation.
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By Fenrir.Tool 2010-08-27 02:00:37
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Lakshmi.Jaerik said:
There seems to be two brands of FFXIV nay-sayers, here. There's those who don't want to play it due to some perceived defect like the fatigue system.

Which is fair enough. But then there's those who don't want to play it and feel somehow compelled to convince no one else to play it either. Which is baffling to me.

Bribes from Blizzard perhaps? >_________>
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By Midgardsormr.Renala 2010-08-27 02:16:32
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Fenrir.Tool said:
Lakshmi.Jaerik said:
There seems to be two brands of FFXIV nay-sayers, here. There's those who don't want to play it due to some perceived defect like the fatigue system.

Which is fair enough. But then there's those who don't want to play it and feel somehow compelled to convince no one else to play it either. Which is baffling to me.

Bribes from Blizzard perhaps? >_________>


Replying to jaerik and the seoncd quote after. It seems your right, TBH. Theres alot of people who don't like a certain part, or parts, then then theres people who're trying to talk down on FFXIV, and to try and talk people into thinking its a ***game, when its not even out yet.

And now to the second part. It'd be a low-blow for bliz, But I know thats a joke, But in seriousness, I think the world of MMORPGs will be remade with this game, so alot of companies are sweating as the launch date inches closer every minute, every day.
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