I might be a bit guilty in the fact that I try to make people excited for the game, but that's only because so many people go into an XIV thread with no plans of debating it properly and just come in to slate the game and make sure everyone agrees with them. >.>
And Oum, I agree with you, it is ALWAYS the people with an absurd amount of time invested into XI. I honestly think it's a defensive mechanism because they honestly WANT the game to flop.
There's a few people who do have good points on why they don't want to play, but the majority are in there simply to slate a game they know literally NOTHING about.
Also Oum, I think Ent is setting up a server for Ni, I'll tell you want in :D
[XIV] Tanaka Debunks Fatigue Rumours
[XIV] Tanaka Debunks fatigue rumours
Asura.Halloween said:
Flion is actually what's wrong with the topic here. You're blindly stating that this game is great and ignoring every issue the testers are having. If the game industry only had to please you, FFXIV would be a $50 per month subscription and you'd only be allowed to play 1 hour a day.
The players calling out for what they want and going into an uproar about what they don't want is good for all of us. It leads to better quality games.You instead want to shut all the naysayers up and ignore all the problems that are springing up out of this game.
And it's not just "Beta" bugs that will all magically disappear at release. There are gameplay issues and UI travesties that they're not planning on doing anything about, as of now.
I want FFXIV to be the best it can be. I want to play it. And that's why I tried offering my critiques in the beta forums. They say they want to communicate more with their players, but we've heard nothing from them except that single public announcement, and only because it was getting bad press.
EDIT: oh, and Blazza, they tweaked the XP for beta session so we would level faster.
The players calling out for what they want and going into an uproar about what they don't want is good for all of us. It leads to better quality games.You instead want to shut all the naysayers up and ignore all the problems that are springing up out of this game.
And it's not just "Beta" bugs that will all magically disappear at release. There are gameplay issues and UI travesties that they're not planning on doing anything about, as of now.
I want FFXIV to be the best it can be. I want to play it. And that's why I tried offering my critiques in the beta forums. They say they want to communicate more with their players, but we've heard nothing from them except that single public announcement, and only because it was getting bad press.
EDIT: oh, and Blazza, they tweaked the XP for beta session so we would level faster.
lol
There has been plenty of feedback for lots of bad things in the Beta. Such as no MP regen/rest system for mages, tedious crafting menus, and 48 hour quests. The 8 hour thing has been the centre of attention though because some JP sites overexaggerated slightly, though i still think it sucks. XIV will be good when SE listen to their playerbase(which is never).
Asura.Halloween said:
They say they're still tweaking the xp thing, but as of now, probably everyone will hit the 8 hour threshold on full experience points. The only thing a player can really do anything about is the class specific skill point threshold...and that's by changing their job.
But the experience points threshold does not reset with a different class. And it won't reset if you're moving from job to job and doing any fighting/gathering/crafting. Although, it might have a chance at resetting if you're rummaging through the market wards for hours. But that's a totally different headache.
P.S Open beta August 31st
But the experience points threshold does not reset with a different class. And it won't reset if you're moving from job to job and doing any fighting/gathering/crafting. Although, it might have a chance at resetting if you're rummaging through the market wards for hours. But that's a totally different headache.
P.S Open beta August 31st
Zekko said:
FFXIV.Nobuaki said:
We'd like to thank all the beta testers for their cooperation during the closed beta test. We have received your valuable opinions and feedback and will do our best to incorporate them into the open beta and official release versions of the game.
Now, we have received a lot of questions and opinions from everyone today, and we would like to give you some answers regarding character growth balance in beta phase 3.
First, the concept was to achieve a balance which would allow those with little time to enjoy FFXIV to get more out of their play time, and above that, create a game that does not force you to spend long hours playing it. To that end, we implemented Guardian's Favor, which adds a bonus to Guildleve, and makes it easier to level in shorter amounts of time.
To balance this out, we came up with a hypothesis regarding what amount of skill points and experience one was likely to earn in an hour. Think of this as a rate at which a player can fight battles, do Guildleves or skill-up.
Then, using that supposed amount, we made it so you can earn 8 hours worth of skill points and experience at 100% of this rate. The subsequent 7 hours' worth will gradually see the attainable skill points and experience points fall to 0.
The limitation on thee amount of points you can attain is set on a weekly timer. Once it passes a week since you first began leveling a particular skill, the limitation resets to zero. After it resets, it will come into effect again once you begin work on that skill once more.
Even if you are hit with this limitation during a one-week period, its detrimental effects decrease if you do not level that particular class. You can even recover back to the full 100% rate of point acquisition, so you do not always have to wait the full week for the limitations to go away.
The skill points you do not gain are instead saved as Surplus Points. Each class has its own amount surplus points, so you can try out a new class if surplus points begin appearing in your log window.
However, each class does not have its own amount of experience, so playing a different class will not mitigate the declining experience point rate.
This is the system as currently implemented.
In truth, this system was not just put in during phase 3 of the beta, but has been implemented from the start. However, we have received many opinions saying the system explained above is not what actually appears in phase 3 of the beta. There are several reasons for this.
Around the time of beta phase 3, it became possible to play for longer periods of time, thus increasing the amount one could play in a single week.
In beta phase 3, Guildleves received a boost in skill points and experience points awarded to encourage party play.
The skill points and experience gained from defeating enemy parties as well as weaker single enemies was lowered, though due to a bug, did not take affect initially in beta phase 3. This was fixed during beta phase 3.
The number biggest culprit behind this issue was that last bug, which allowed players to gain more skill points and experience than we expected, causing the limitations to come into effect much quicker. Of course, not adjusting the limitations in accordance with the boost to Guildleve was a problem as well.
The lack of explanation regarding these adjustments was a mistake on our part for which we sincerely apologize.
The numbers behind these limitations are all still under development, and we plan to adjust them according to player feedback in an effort to make them less severe. In particular, we are considering making the decline in points less drastic and are already hard at work on it. Also, as the limit on experience carries over through class changes, we plan to lessen its effect compared with the limit on skill points.
At the very least, we promise players will not be hitting the limit as quickly as they did at the start of beta phase 3.
Also, I would like to address one other thing below:
The reduction in what you acquire from gathering is based on the actions of that particular class and is unrelated to limitations on leveling. We are also in the process of adjusting this and plan to make changes based on player feedback.
Surplus points currently have no use. However, there are opinions saying preparing some kind of reward would be good, but that's just giving people something else to strive for, which misses the whole point of this system. We want to take our time and thoroughly investigate this issue.
Now, the open beta test will include more than just the above adjustments. As we stated before, awarding more skill points for party play is also an important topic we plan to address, so we hope you enjoy testing out what we come up with.
Lastly, as director of this title, I wish to deeply apologize for the lateness of my comments due to my absence while attending Gamescom. In addition, articles written during my trip contained much speculation, outdated information and mistranslations which only invited more confusion. In the future, I will do my best to make direct, official statements in a timely manner. I humbly ask for your understanding regarding this matter.
See you in the open beta!
Final Fantasy XIV Director
Nobuaki Komoto
Now, we have received a lot of questions and opinions from everyone today, and we would like to give you some answers regarding character growth balance in beta phase 3.
First, the concept was to achieve a balance which would allow those with little time to enjoy FFXIV to get more out of their play time, and above that, create a game that does not force you to spend long hours playing it. To that end, we implemented Guardian's Favor, which adds a bonus to Guildleve, and makes it easier to level in shorter amounts of time.
To balance this out, we came up with a hypothesis regarding what amount of skill points and experience one was likely to earn in an hour. Think of this as a rate at which a player can fight battles, do Guildleves or skill-up.
Then, using that supposed amount, we made it so you can earn 8 hours worth of skill points and experience at 100% of this rate. The subsequent 7 hours' worth will gradually see the attainable skill points and experience points fall to 0.
The limitation on thee amount of points you can attain is set on a weekly timer. Once it passes a week since you first began leveling a particular skill, the limitation resets to zero. After it resets, it will come into effect again once you begin work on that skill once more.
Even if you are hit with this limitation during a one-week period, its detrimental effects decrease if you do not level that particular class. You can even recover back to the full 100% rate of point acquisition, so you do not always have to wait the full week for the limitations to go away.
The skill points you do not gain are instead saved as Surplus Points. Each class has its own amount surplus points, so you can try out a new class if surplus points begin appearing in your log window.
However, each class does not have its own amount of experience, so playing a different class will not mitigate the declining experience point rate.
This is the system as currently implemented.
In truth, this system was not just put in during phase 3 of the beta, but has been implemented from the start. However, we have received many opinions saying the system explained above is not what actually appears in phase 3 of the beta. There are several reasons for this.
Around the time of beta phase 3, it became possible to play for longer periods of time, thus increasing the amount one could play in a single week.
In beta phase 3, Guildleves received a boost in skill points and experience points awarded to encourage party play.
The skill points and experience gained from defeating enemy parties as well as weaker single enemies was lowered, though due to a bug, did not take affect initially in beta phase 3. This was fixed during beta phase 3.
The number biggest culprit behind this issue was that last bug, which allowed players to gain more skill points and experience than we expected, causing the limitations to come into effect much quicker. Of course, not adjusting the limitations in accordance with the boost to Guildleve was a problem as well.
The lack of explanation regarding these adjustments was a mistake on our part for which we sincerely apologize.
The numbers behind these limitations are all still under development, and we plan to adjust them according to player feedback in an effort to make them less severe. In particular, we are considering making the decline in points less drastic and are already hard at work on it. Also, as the limit on experience carries over through class changes, we plan to lessen its effect compared with the limit on skill points.
At the very least, we promise players will not be hitting the limit as quickly as they did at the start of beta phase 3.
Also, I would like to address one other thing below:
The reduction in what you acquire from gathering is based on the actions of that particular class and is unrelated to limitations on leveling. We are also in the process of adjusting this and plan to make changes based on player feedback.
Surplus points currently have no use. However, there are opinions saying preparing some kind of reward would be good, but that's just giving people something else to strive for, which misses the whole point of this system. We want to take our time and thoroughly investigate this issue.
Now, the open beta test will include more than just the above adjustments. As we stated before, awarding more skill points for party play is also an important topic we plan to address, so we hope you enjoy testing out what we come up with.
Lastly, as director of this title, I wish to deeply apologize for the lateness of my comments due to my absence while attending Gamescom. In addition, articles written during my trip contained much speculation, outdated information and mistranslations which only invited more confusion. In the future, I will do my best to make direct, official statements in a timely manner. I humbly ask for your understanding regarding this matter.
See you in the open beta!
Final Fantasy XIV Director
Nobuaki Komoto
[+]
Asura.Halloween said:
There are effectively 2 different counters. 1 for job level and 1 for basic level. The basic level counter does not change when you switch jobs. It does not reset unless you spend enough time not gaining any experience points. Experience points are not the same as class skill points.
Source please.
[+]
Well that's about as clear as mud.
Also source on Open beta date please.
Also source on Open beta date please.
[+]
Asura.Halloween said:
mhmm just keep closing your eyes. everything's peachy in Flion's version of ffxiv.
I, however, have actually been playing closed beta since the start. My sources come direct, not through 3rd persons
The details for the FINAL FANTASY XIV Open Beta Test are described below.
Operating Procedure
Schedule:
Tuesday, August 31, 2010 at 19:00 (PDT)
*The Open Beta Test will be online continuously for 24 hours a day.
*Maintenance and any other announcements will be posted accordingly.
*Information on testing dates and times will also be posted on the official FINAL FANTASY XIV Twitter feed.
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_JP
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_EN
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_DE
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_FR
Log-in Capacity
During the initial stages of the beta test, the number of players allowed to be logged in at any given time will be limited, with capacity to gradually increase as adjustments are performed on server load. Should the maximum capacity already be reached when you attempt to log in, a message will appear indicating that the world is currently congested, and you will be asked to try again in a short while. At this time you will be placed on a waiting list in the order of attempted log-in time. To maintain your position on the waiting list, you must initiate the log-in procedure again within ten minutes of your first attempt.
Feedback Submission
While playing, testers who have been asked to submit opinions on anything at all regarding topics such as game balance issues, settings that you may have found difficult to understand, and features that you felt were inconvenient, unintuitive, or required further explanation are asked to use the feedback hread, and for those testers who have been assigned the task of reporting bugs are asked to use the bug report form.
I, however, have actually been playing closed beta since the start. My sources come direct, not through 3rd persons
Quote:
The details for the FINAL FANTASY XIV Open Beta Test are described below.
Operating Procedure
Schedule:
Tuesday, August 31, 2010 at 19:00 (PDT)
*The Open Beta Test will be online continuously for 24 hours a day.
*Maintenance and any other announcements will be posted accordingly.
*Information on testing dates and times will also be posted on the official FINAL FANTASY XIV Twitter feed.
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_JP
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_EN
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_DE
http://twitter.com/FF_XIV_FR
Log-in Capacity
During the initial stages of the beta test, the number of players allowed to be logged in at any given time will be limited, with capacity to gradually increase as adjustments are performed on server load. Should the maximum capacity already be reached when you attempt to log in, a message will appear indicating that the world is currently congested, and you will be asked to try again in a short while. At this time you will be placed on a waiting list in the order of attempted log-in time. To maintain your position on the waiting list, you must initiate the log-in procedure again within ten minutes of your first attempt.
Feedback Submission
While playing, testers who have been asked to submit opinions on anything at all regarding topics such as game balance issues, settings that you may have found difficult to understand, and features that you felt were inconvenient, unintuitive, or required further explanation are asked to use the feedback hread, and for those testers who have been assigned the task of reporting bugs are asked to use the bug report form.
Oh I'm sorry, I wasn't aware that you had some sort of issue with optimism.
I'll continue to be optimistic due to remembering the mess XI was in Beta.
[+]
Asura.Halloween said:
pessimism actually works out for the best. If it turns out to be a good game, it'll be all the better because I wasn't expecting much.
I wouldn't want to be pessimistic for that long a time. The excitement I feel when I'm waiting for something new is probably one of my favourite aspects of a new game.
The risk is worth the reward imo.
[+]
I'm reading through all of this and trying to comprehend it correctly so I may get this wrong but,
Once again, we would like to thank you all for your participation and support during the Closed Beta. We will continue to take your valuable feedback into consideration as we develop the game during Open Beta and even beyond the official release.
Now I would like to take a moment to respond to the many questions and opinions regarding the manner in and rates at which experience and skill points are obtained in Beta 3.
Firstly, the concept for FINAL FANTASY XIV was to design a system of character progression that offers meaningful advancement for those with limited time to dedicate to playing. We did not want to create a game that forced people to play for hours on end to see their efforts rewarded. To that end, in addition to the Guardian's Aspect and guildleve systems, we introduced a means of apportioning swifter advancement to shorter periods of play.
In order to achieve this balance, we calculated a value for the amount of skill or experience points that could be earned in a one-hour period. This theoretical value represents an hour spent engaged solely in combat, levequests, or any other activities that earn skill or experience points, and sets a threshold delimiting how many of these points can be earned in a period of play.
Based on this, we have implemented a “threshold value” concept. These thresholds are regulated by a one-week timer that begins counting down the instant you earn skill/experience points. After a week has passed, the thresholds will reset, and the moment skill/experience points are earned again, the timer begins counting down anew.
For the first eight thresholds during this week-long period, players will receive skill/experience points at the maximum rate possible. The actual amount of time spent reaching these thresholds is not significant. That is to say, a player who exceeds eight hours of gameplay will still be rewarded the maximum amount of skill/experience points, so long as the total amount earned is below the eighth threshold value. For the subsequent seven thresholds, players will earn skill/experience points at a gradually decreasing rate, eventually reaching a rate of zero.
It is worth noting, however, that the reduced rate will also gradually recover while players are engaged in activities that do not yield skill/experience points. In this manner, it is possible for the threshold value to reset completely, even before the completion of the one-week timer.
Any skill points earned in excess of the threshold maximum—that is, at a rate of zero—will be stored as "bonus skill points." These are specific to each class, so players limited to earning bonus skill points still have the freedom to change classes and begin earning skill points again at the maximum rate, allowing their reduced skill rates to recover in the meantime.
The experience point threshold, however, is unrelated to class, and switching classes will have no effect on the decreasing rate of earnable experience.
This is how the progression system currently works.
FINAL FANTASY XIV Director
Nobuaki Komoto
doesn't this kind of defeat the entire purpose of the system? I mean think about it. Your hardcore players will speed through this maximum threshold in as little time as possible and then spam missions/quests/etc. to reset the maximum threshold before having to wait the entire week time limit thus making them able to level faster? So in essence, this system designed to keep the hardcore player and the casual player more closely connected is actually not functioning correctly already.
Asura.Halloween said:
Quote:
Even if you are hit with this limitation during a one-week period, its detrimental effects decrease if you do not level that particular class. You can even recover back to the full 100% rate of point acquisition, so you do not always have to wait the full week for the limitations to go away.
The skill points you do not gain are instead saved as Surplus Points. Each class has its own amount surplus points, so you can try out a new class if surplus points begin appearing in your log window.
However, each class does not have its own amount of experience, so playing a different class will not mitigate the declining experience point rate.
The skill points you do not gain are instead saved as Surplus Points. Each class has its own amount surplus points, so you can try out a new class if surplus points begin appearing in your log window.
However, each class does not have its own amount of experience, so playing a different class will not mitigate the declining experience point rate.
Quote:
Once again, we would like to thank you all for your participation and support during the Closed Beta. We will continue to take your valuable feedback into consideration as we develop the game during Open Beta and even beyond the official release.
Now I would like to take a moment to respond to the many questions and opinions regarding the manner in and rates at which experience and skill points are obtained in Beta 3.
Firstly, the concept for FINAL FANTASY XIV was to design a system of character progression that offers meaningful advancement for those with limited time to dedicate to playing. We did not want to create a game that forced people to play for hours on end to see their efforts rewarded. To that end, in addition to the Guardian's Aspect and guildleve systems, we introduced a means of apportioning swifter advancement to shorter periods of play.
In order to achieve this balance, we calculated a value for the amount of skill or experience points that could be earned in a one-hour period. This theoretical value represents an hour spent engaged solely in combat, levequests, or any other activities that earn skill or experience points, and sets a threshold delimiting how many of these points can be earned in a period of play.
Based on this, we have implemented a “threshold value” concept. These thresholds are regulated by a one-week timer that begins counting down the instant you earn skill/experience points. After a week has passed, the thresholds will reset, and the moment skill/experience points are earned again, the timer begins counting down anew.
For the first eight thresholds during this week-long period, players will receive skill/experience points at the maximum rate possible. The actual amount of time spent reaching these thresholds is not significant. That is to say, a player who exceeds eight hours of gameplay will still be rewarded the maximum amount of skill/experience points, so long as the total amount earned is below the eighth threshold value. For the subsequent seven thresholds, players will earn skill/experience points at a gradually decreasing rate, eventually reaching a rate of zero.
It is worth noting, however, that the reduced rate will also gradually recover while players are engaged in activities that do not yield skill/experience points. In this manner, it is possible for the threshold value to reset completely, even before the completion of the one-week timer.
Any skill points earned in excess of the threshold maximum—that is, at a rate of zero—will be stored as "bonus skill points." These are specific to each class, so players limited to earning bonus skill points still have the freedom to change classes and begin earning skill points again at the maximum rate, allowing their reduced skill rates to recover in the meantime.
The experience point threshold, however, is unrelated to class, and switching classes will have no effect on the decreasing rate of earnable experience.
This is how the progression system currently works.
FINAL FANTASY XIV Director
Nobuaki Komoto
doesn't this kind of defeat the entire purpose of the system? I mean think about it. Your hardcore players will speed through this maximum threshold in as little time as possible and then spam missions/quests/etc. to reset the maximum threshold before having to wait the entire week time limit thus making them able to level faster? So in essence, this system designed to keep the hardcore player and the casual player more closely connected is actually not functioning correctly already.
Asura.Halloween said:
well then maybe you should wait a little longer. Definitely don't join open beta, and don't start at retail release. You'll just be disappointed.
They've already said they have no plans for an auction house system at release and they want to test how their market wards will work. Couple that with having no search function of any kind within sight, and buying things from players will be Ru'lude Gardens bazaar mall x1000. They won't even be changing the restriction on movement when we're looking at bazaars, so you're stuck in 1 spot.
They still have not done anything about going through 10 menus to craft or buy/sell things. So it takes an hour currently (due to interface lag) to sell all your loot from your last adventure.
They're still on software mouse and have no plans to change it to hardware.
There will be no skill/equipment set memory, so every time you change jobs (which they recommend to be numerous and frequent) you have to manually set all your skills/spells/equipment again.
key mapping is, in their opinion, just fine. But they recommend using a gamepad (wut?).
Loot is random. Rat tails and arrowheads from a firefly? Ok.
Wrong battle messages during battle.
Player search function is...just stupid. You can do a search for a player you see right in front of you and he won't pop up in the search half the time.
They say they're still tweaking xp/skill point values for party play (i don't know why they're having so much trouble with that), because as of now, you're still much better off soloing.
camera movement weirdness.
ergh i didn't mean to start ranting...there are just so many issues, big and small, that have been there forever and still aren't fixed. And they announce open beta just a few days from now. I hope they're planning a HUGE update for the 31st.
They've already said they have no plans for an auction house system at release and they want to test how their market wards will work. Couple that with having no search function of any kind within sight, and buying things from players will be Ru'lude Gardens bazaar mall x1000. They won't even be changing the restriction on movement when we're looking at bazaars, so you're stuck in 1 spot.
They still have not done anything about going through 10 menus to craft or buy/sell things. So it takes an hour currently (due to interface lag) to sell all your loot from your last adventure.
They're still on software mouse and have no plans to change it to hardware.
There will be no skill/equipment set memory, so every time you change jobs (which they recommend to be numerous and frequent) you have to manually set all your skills/spells/equipment again.
key mapping is, in their opinion, just fine. But they recommend using a gamepad (wut?).
Loot is random. Rat tails and arrowheads from a firefly? Ok.
Wrong battle messages during battle.
Player search function is...just stupid. You can do a search for a player you see right in front of you and he won't pop up in the search half the time.
They say they're still tweaking xp/skill point values for party play (i don't know why they're having so much trouble with that), because as of now, you're still much better off soloing.
camera movement weirdness.
ergh i didn't mean to start ranting...there are just so many issues, big and small, that have been there forever and still aren't fixed. And they announce open beta just a few days from now. I hope they're planning a HUGE update for the 31st.
I can't wait till the open beta, messing around with all the settings is one of my favourite things to do in a game :D
[+]
Part of the problem, also, I think is that beta testers tend to invariably be of the hardcore "invest hours in the game" type LOL. Few "casuals" would even bother to sign up for a beta environment or have the mentality to handle the tasks needed of testers.
So it would seem natural that most all beta testers (with some perhaps very open-minded exceptions) might be set against something they feel is incongruous with their own playstyles no?
So it would seem natural that most all beta testers (with some perhaps very open-minded exceptions) might be set against something they feel is incongruous with their own playstyles no?
tl;dr
But I think this might be relevant:
http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/08/26/square-enix-doesn-t-want-you-playing-too-much-final-fantasy-xiv-every-week.aspx
But I think this might be relevant:
http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/08/26/square-enix-doesn-t-want-you-playing-too-much-final-fantasy-xiv-every-week.aspx
Bahamut.Kaioshin said:
tl;dr But I think this might be relevant: http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/08/26/square-enix-doesn-t-want-you-playing-too-much-final-fantasy-xiv-every-week.aspx
At least the author of the Gameinformer article was fair and updated the article to reflect newer developments.
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