Anyone Wanna Make The "Botless Asura"?

I know you don't actually play the game anymore but man do I disagree with this. Asura PUGs are a crapshoot. There's nothing fun about the BRD in your Sheol C who gets outparsed by the SCH only casting Dia2, or the COR who spends half the V20 Gaol fight trying to roll for 11s, or the tank who is in 5/5 Souveran +1 in 2023. I have much much more fun playing with my static or in other people's statics when they have open slots. Not only are these people more enjoyable to interact with (many PUG members don't even say two words for an entire run), but they are more reliable to be successful in content.

As for playing the game like a job, that's up to the player and the group. I for sure know people who, every day, go "well I have two KIs to burn for Sortie and need to do a Sheol C and we have to go help x clear y content". You don't need to play that way to be successful or have fun. The static I am in only gathered four days a week for no more than three hours total. Now that we have beat all the current content we are down to three days. Not everyone treats the game like a job, even though you might.

Fun and v20 aren't compatible

Either/or no and. You get ruthless efficiency or fun.

(if you "claim" it's fun, consider how mad you get when you lose and rethink your ideas)

That's relative, I enjoy v20-v25 a lot more than I do Sortie. What I hate about Odyssey is how difficult it is to assemble a group that doesn't suck, is willing to be patient while people work through learning from mistakes, and is willing to persist at it.

You can PUG v20 with some difficulty, v25 t3 is another story though and I agree that shouldn't be something you can PUG. The frustrating downside of that is trying to assemble a group willing to do what it takes to clear it without getting annoyed and rage quitting.

I do get mad when we lose repeatedly due to stupid crap that we have 0 control over, but that's less of a thing at 20 than it is 25


or the WHM running a bot during a C farm or Gaol fight. Curaga bomb on the pull and instant death.

This reflects my experiences though, pretty accurately. The times you and I PUGd C farms with Vann were pretty much the only PUGs I've ever had work well and at that point we had a pretty steady rotation of the same people around the same time, it was a pseudo-static.

I can't think of a time in 11s history (I missed the Delve era for the most part) where endgame content was regularly PUGed, so judging the state of Asura by PUG activity is not the best indicator.

Not sure what you mean. We have had plenty of fun in our static clearing the Gaol fights. Only one person has ever been outwardly mad and they removed themself from the situation when they realized it.

This is usually pretty easy to spot before you even go in. If it's someone you're unfamiliar with, swap gear to drop your HP and see how they respond. If they are consistently healing you in town whenever you drop to a threshold, it's a pretty safe bet. You can then either ask them to turn it off, boot them and find someone else, or ruin your run but have some fun by bringing them but wearing Accursed Belt the whole time.

I'm kind of surprised nobody seems to setup a specific discord for PUG activity honestly, that could make it easier if it became widely used. Discord can be used from a brower now so there isn't some massive bar for entry as there used to be.

Not only can you post if you're inb the process of building but post intention of doing something on a day and people can be on for it.

There was one for Odyssey when v25 came out, but it's kinda fizzled out.

My understanding is that Odin has such as discord for random PUG stuff. With Asura, I have found that most of the good people are already in all the same discord servers. There is less of a need for a general PUG discord if I already know that people I trust and who will help are in one of the servers I am already part of.

It might get more traction if there was a tracker built onto the front page of XIAH showcasing attempts to build or intent to do so on that day from the discord too. I dunno how much work that would entail though.

I recently pugged a couple nyzul token runs with 2 randos, 1 did the lamp and the other ignored aggro/kill restrictions on gears both runs and netted us about 5k-6k tokens each run.

This is an example of why I don't bother with PUGs for anything other than maybe ambuscade. It's just not worth the frustration.

It's petty and self-defeating, but if my options are less-than-average runs with PUGs or not running, I'd rather just stand around in town.

the cool kids clubs, as it were


this is a joke

i do echo clint's sentiment at times though. as much as it's possible to get decent pug runs on content, the chances of it going downhill tend to be more frequent than not, and i'd rather wait until people I know are on to do things, even if that means standing around a while longer.

this is especially true for people shouting for ridiculous requirements or a "guaranteed" reward amount (13k segs, 10k+ tokens)

they're just frequently false.

I really love these. If 4-5/6 of your members are pickup, how the *** do you know what you're going to get before you go in? It's hilarious. I especially enjoy when certain people yell for content and include "WIN 100%", as if victory is assured before even entering.

Which endgame? Ambuscade VD, Omen Ou was definitely more PUG-able even when it was new and somewhat challenging. Even MT was somewhat PUG-able(if you are more picky with gears and members of course) after some time lol.

The only content that I find even less Pug-friendly than Odyssey would be legion in 2012 and 18 men delve in 2013. Maybe aeonic T4 when it was out too. But those were LS alliance content, you only need find a free day, join a few LS runs for clears and be done. If you are already in an established endgame LS getting clears regularly those 18 men event wasn't THAT time consuming. Unlike Odyssey which requires a static that gathers multiple days per week.

Personally I find Odyssey being less casual friendly than many other endgame events. Not because of the skill/gear requirement nor pt communication requirement. But because of the social requirement as the mechanics limits the people that you can team up with...... This was discussed many times in another Odyssey thread already so there is no point to brought it up again anyways.

Or I am getting old. Playing 4 days a week, 3hr per day with a static is out of reach /shrug.

And unfortunately master levels or certain pieces of gear don't really mean a lot either. I've had runs where someone boasted about being ML30 RDM w/ su4 iirc and couldn't land grav on E boss. Spent the entire run in full relic+3 gear and single-casting every buff under the sun, including regen2. it was appreciated, don't get me wrong, but we also had a scholar so a lot of those were uh. not doing anything.


...and also we spent a lot of time waiting for him to reach us, and then at one point they also straight up told us they didn't have basement accesses like partway thru the run so we just started doing it w/o him.

...and for the bosses they DID join, they spent most of the fight trying to debuff instead of contributing to damage, so at that point they were just a cheerleader

god, the more i remember the sadder i get

Sure... everyone has their preferences. I personally enjoy PUG more than static because:

1) I can meet new people, really the whole point to play mmo.

not everyone plays the game seriously, and sometimes you have to deal with not so serious players. but to me the entertainment of meeting new people often outweigh the frustration of having a suboptimal run. As long as nobody is being *** about bad runs it's generally okay to me.

2) Instead of feel like having to log on specific time because 5 other people is waiting for me, I can take my time, get home whenever I want and log on whenever I want.

Whenever I am in a static I always feel pressured to get home or log on on the right time because people are waiting. If I am late I always feel pressured to send discord messages to notify people which feels like an on-call work. And believe it or not Ive experienced static drama only because I couldn't log on on the gather time because of work. It was frustrating.

For people like me, if all the content is static focused but none are LS based nor PUG friendly then playing FFXI becomes less enjoyable IMO.

Maybe it's just me, but the statics I've been in haven't been super rigid. It's not like it was 15 years ago, most people understand we all have jobs, families, and aren't 19 anymore.

I'm sure they exist, but none of mine have been that rigid. When I started back a few years ago, the word 'static' sent shivers down my spine, but for the most part they aren't like that anymore. YMMV.

No one has said PUG's are dumb and shouldnt be used or anything of that ilk. That is a very far cry from rag-tag PUG's should be incapable of regularly clearing elite-tier endgame content. If random PUG's can clear the elite-tier endgame content, then the elite-tier endgame content is too easy.

... :(

I've recently attempted making a linkshell on Asura, but I think the envrionment, as pointed out earlier, is very different from what it used to be. I feel like most people that "cared" either finally gave up before empy+3 came out, transferred to a server where they don't need to struggle to swim upstream, or both.

That said, I think you'd be pleased to find that there are people that play the game still! You just kind of have to go out of your way to find them - but I'm sure that's not a bad thing.

The game gets very boring at ML50 doing V25.

Worse if you're decked out

Most groups I know of are lax. Yeah it sucks if you are trying to progress and a key member takes the day off. But, given the party size limit on current content, there are usually several people that you can call on to pinch hit when you are down a regular member. We are all old now with responsibilities and I think people understand and respect that for the most part. So long as you give some sort of warning that you aren't going to make it, which is easy with Discord these days, nobody is going to admonish you for prioritizing real life. If they do, then that group is probably not one you want to be part of anyways.

Speaking of games where you can PUG your way through elite-tier endgame content

party finder, where people have ridiculous requirements and meet none of them nor understand the fights they're participating in

i see absolutely no difference

One of my biggest and longest-standing beefs with XIV was that endgame (savage) was far too accessible for people that had no business being there.

Personally, I don't like the feel of being distracted by any kind of messengers when Im busy. If Im entirely focusing on doing something, I don't wish to think about 5 friends in ffxi waiting in game for me for some content. Id prefer to think about them when Im ready to play ffxi. :P

The biggest advantage of static is efficiency and familiarity with each members, so having to replace even one member, imo, is detrimental. Even if everyone is nice and all that, after a few times it may cause problems. Nevermind the fact that how Odyssey NM content is designed makes replacing members harder.

Like, the new guy needs required skill, gears, AND wanting the same NM as everyone else, AND having the right job, AND 3k seg ready to participate. This is a lot more effort than needing one more capable person for ambu VD for example. Without these restrictions at least it's easy to quickly get a friend or LS mate to help.

I don't mind the hardest content being static focused btw, but most relevant content for progression requires a static is a different story.

I mostly agree with this, with the caveat that, perhaps SE didn't intend on absolutely everybody clearing v25s, or full clears of Sortie.

It's likely you can't PUG v25 but I've seen v15s and v20s PUG'ed often. Those players are still getting, for the most part, the same endgame experience but more their speed. Point is, it doesn't totally gate casuals without statics out of content. The same could be said for sortie. PUGs might be doing 1/2 or 1/3 galli runs compared to regular statics that are clearing 6 bosses + 2x naakuals and several objs.

In any game, no-lifers/hardcore/static players are going to simply have an advantage over those that play less often, less seriously, and alone. AFK mobile games aside, I don't see a way you can game-design around that.

Being on a small server I can confirm it isn't any different, but we still have a healthy number of linkshells regularly doing things. Stop waiting on yells and start joining quality groups who aren't super elitist, but also don't just stick to doing Exemplar's for an hour a week. These groups exist because I lead one, and I know several others who lead theirs.

We sometimes have players from other LS help out. This is the new "PUG". A LS prepares for an event, and then word gets out they are doing the event, so if you need extras you can bring them along. Rarely need to yell because being on a small server, players have to form connections. They can't chill on their comfy /sitchair in Mhaura/Jeuno all day waiting on someone to carry their unsociable backsides to wins. If you have the time, join several groups and do something almost everyday.

For active players, yells are mostly reserved for those groups who seriously need (for example) a bard, but none of their LS bards are logged in, and all you can provide is WAR THF PUP, so nobody wins.

I'd argue all content in the game should be able to be PUG'ed. It's an MMORPG, making groups to do content is the game.

Will these groups vary in quality and ability to do said content? Sure, that's why the progression is there. But it should be attainable given that progression has been followed.