Dev Tracker - Discussion

I get that, but what the issue most people have, including myself is the quality of the content. It's laggy, it's buggy. Nothing is being done about it. Which is why people complain.

I get your point there. I do find it rather frustrating when a lot of the new content we get though is a “did they really just spend their time on this?”

Like alter ego adjustments this month. Idk how long and how much effort went into this. But it comes down to “was the time put in worth it for the content produced?” If it took the development team 2-4 weeks to make alter ego adjustments, then I’d argue that’s horrible time spent as they could have used that time on better quality content (new battlefields, Empy reforge, etc)

I dont notice any lag in Dynamis. But Odyssea, OHHHHH MY WORD, that area is a damn lagfest for me. The lag seems to be all client side too. I hit evisceration, the mob HP drops, and then I see the animation and action in the log. If the mobs HP is dropping, then clearly the server is communicating with the client.

Dynamis is not laggy and buggy, DI isnt too. Buggy and laggy is whole game when you put 18-200 people in an instance/small area. I doubt they can fix that, since they already mentioned that they cant update how data is trasmited between client and server.

Doing dynamis 3boxing when most server is asleep and its smooth as silk. Odyssey is very good event too. Its not laggy, I havent seen any bugs too and I self farmed around 30k scales, so I have done quite a lot of it. I really like that its designed in the way that you can do it efficiently solo or in group and farm in many various ways. Its also fast and can be done in relaxing pace or you can challenge yourself and try to push it as much as possible within time limit. There is something for everyone too. You can just mindlessly farm trash, go for NMs or even dont kill anything and just farm chests on thf trying to avoid everything. Imo they squeezed a lot of fun in it.

IDK about that. We do Dyna the same time twice a week, and it almost feels like a lag roulette. Some days it's a lag ***-show, and other days it's perfectly fine. The Jeuno courtyard comes to mind, and for some reason the whole Windurst run for me. Dyna has never been consistent with lag in my experience.

I think Dynamis has an additional/special source of artificial lag.
Someone (was it Comeatmebro? Byrth? Multiple people?) hypothyzed that to be caused by the extreme load of network data flux that goes between server and clients because of RP.
To keep RP constantly updated on every player (doesn't matter if you're actually getting RP or not, the data-stream is still there) there are additional packets that are sent constantly, very very fast. This creates an additional strain on the already limited network communication protocol of FFXI and is the main source of the additional lag most of us experience in Dynamis zones.

This is a special thing for Divergence but of course it's still under the effect of "normal" causes of lag, like the overload of people in the same zone and so on.
Specifically for Divergence I *think* it's number of people inside of Divergence zones (any zone) and not number of people inside the same divergence zone as you.

Did they “hypothesize” it or did someone monitor network traffic from the pol process port and found that there were a significant number of additional packets being sent and/or received while in divergence zones? Literally no reason to play a guessing game with this. Either it’s there or it isn’t.

Odyssey is by far one of the best designed content in all of the game. Its only real flaw is it hasnt been updated as planned due to corona.

You must be doing a different Odyssey than the one I do.

Hah. Right? If there were time extensions I’d maybe like it more but damn I hate it

Its great because it doesnt have time extension. Its fast, rewarding and can be done on many various ways to accomplish different things. Its a great daily even with just enough randomness.

Pleaae explain to me what are the flaws of Odyasey? Other than typical "its not empy reforge".

I find it lacks substance. There's nothing you get out of it aside from scales. Sure, there's a few pieces of Unity gear that are worth upgrading, but then what? I mean, it takes zero effort to go in, toss on sneak/invis/reraise and to open chests and come out with 200+ scales.

It's hard to get amped about an event when it's still half-assed.

People are going to debate this but there's really nothing about Odyssey that would make people WANT to do it. It's not challenging content (yet). It provide no real rewards (yet). The moogle mastery is questionable because people were expecting it to be group content but you can do everything you need to do alone. Farming scales is redundant after you get the items you want. There is zero incentive to do the content long term at it's current stage. it's a daily chore that can easily be replaced by something else for thirty minutes. It's no real surprise why people don't enjoy it. I've recently gotten bored with it, though I still do it to maintain MM and monster kills.

They are going to find a way to cockblock a LOT of players very soon, though. Whether it's NM clears or chests opened or nostos killed or MM level, people who didn't do the content are going to be annoyed when they lock something really good behind it. This is classic SE playbook. People can cry about it so they want but don't be surprised when they slap something really good to the content and you didn't earn the progress ahead of time.

Dynamis D is noticeably more laggy than every other zone. Once I entered and soloed wave 1 boss with ranged attack. There were only 2 characters in the entire zone. My /ra <t> macros occassionally won't work. I'd say it fails at least twice in 5 min fight. If we go with 18 people then fail rate greatly increases too.

This has never happen in zones outside of dyna. I can do schah with 10-18 people and not a single /ra macro would fail.

I'm pretty sure dyna is just different from other zones.

Scales should have been ex/rare and 200+ scales per run should be rewarded to a well coordinated party.

No but instead 200+ scales per run are rewarded to solo THFs, and they are buyable from AH too. So most people just use their KI as THF opening chests or merc and buy scales.

As a result nobody wants to pt for this, in a MMORPG. If this isnt bad design then idk what is.

I'm aware that people still team up to upgrade their moogle mastery faster. But as for now, there are no real incentives to upgrade them since content doesn't have NM that needs higher mastery level. If mastery actually enhances your character in Odyssey and content offers higher difficulty NM that high mastery level offers some advantages fighting them, then grouping up would be justified.

But no, Odyssey doesn't offer any incentives. In an era that scales costs 1m a stack but 2.5 hr of merc dyna makes 16-18m per run per character, doing odyssey just isnt justified. It's much more efficient to make gil in other group content then buy scales.

SE really needs some design changes to future Odyssey because it's really bad design atm.


What you described here doesn't make a good "MMO content". What kind of MMO that greatly rewards solo THF playing metal gear solid opening chests lol. I want to fight challenging NMs with 5 other real people, and obtain unique rewards for every participant. And have this "yes we beat it and all done a good job" feeling in the team. Not running around opening chests for something that I can buy from AH.

I agree with both of you...sorta.

This event is awesome when you don't have a ton of time to sit in town and yell for a group. Keep in mind not everyone has the time nor do they care to make friends in this game. Ya blah blah MMORPG style I get it. Not everyone wants to play the same way and until the game is FTP keep your play style opinions to yourself.

I personally use this event as a wind down when I get off work. It is great to grab a few job points/merit points without X amount of bots around while also grabbing some decent gil and its nice in the fact that is last 30 minutes max.

I've never say Odyssey cant be a solo content though. I only said the reward:effort ratio should be appropriate for groups. That does not have equal meaning as no reward for solo players.

Its fine if someone wants to solo for 30 min, Odyssey never restrict players from doing that, and I'm not against players entering a content solo at all.

I only said that the reward has to be worth it for groups. If solo THF run in naked with keys can get 200-300 scales per run, then a group of 6 real players with maximized efficiency and max gears should get 3000-4000 scales total. I'm not sure such numbers are obtainable as a group atm.

If a maximized group is only getting the same amount of scales as a naked THF without gears after splitting 6 ways, then from design POV something is seriously wrong.

Ahh ya I get what you are saying with that. Currently going in solo THF is the way to go if you are just looking for a higher scale count. But don't forget at some point this content is SUPPOSED to get added onto.

I would imagine as the ILVL of the content goes up the need for a group will also go up.

I am looking forward to this.

So basically you say event is bad because you dont like the rewards. So with good reward this event would be awesome suddenly? Lol. I would think you play the game to enjoy gameplay too, not only to collect stuff.


Well coordinated group gets more than solo thf btw and i mean good equiped thf, because naked thf gets maybe 70 scales on avg. You can basicaly recover once from mimic, then 2nd mimic your are dead. You need good meva gear to resist or at least partially resist stun from mimic and/or high evasion to survive long enough to engage and let trust tank. Some chests are also deep between mobs and if you get mimic inside them, it might be game over even for full malignance thf. Naked thf getting 200-300 scales on avg is total bs and idk where you got that number. I have 2 naked thf mule I farmed like 5000 scales on each probably and some runs I got 200 scales but some runs ended on first chest because mimic and i couldnt pop perfect dodge on time. Most ended at floor 4 on 2nd mimic. Its a little better with skeleton keys but then you need to invest around 700k to get 200 scales, so in reality you get like 130-150 depends on price of stack in your server.

Assuming you would take 6 people and split to kill 4 fetters then pop all chests and kill 3-4 mimics and several NMs, you would get around 250-350 scales per person. On avg thats for sure more than thf solo.

Lastly in group you get progress with moogle mastery, chests and NMs. Solo thf only gets very slow chests progress.

Its a great designed event with few completely different gameplay experiences. Great for groups and solo. Dont require much time investment, which is very nice with the amount of daily farm events available atm.


FFXI is no longer typical mmorpg. Trust system was designed to even out the field a little for solo players, because game doesnt have enough people to team up for everything, especially if you have less time to play. Imo the reward ratio for group vs solo players is way to big in something like ambuscade (im talking about normal players, not top players being able to solo d/vd runs in some months) solo player should get maybe 2 time less points in same amount of time. Instead solo player gets usually 3 time less hallmark doing the fight 2 times longer and getting 0 gallantry. That is bad imo and Odyssey giving around 2 times more scales for well coordinated group is imo better ratio.
This was probably still because of people in other dynamis instances. I did aroud 50 dynamises 3 boxing and I had lags maybe in 2 of them, both during JP prime time.

iv killed 3 nms before and only got 58 scales not sure if i did it wrong, was after ki's

Hell the *** no scales shouldn't be rare/ex. This is a dumb 30 minute event that is time-gated like hell. I would be absolutely pissed if I was forced to add yet another mandatory event to my daily rotation just to upgrade my stuff.

You want to incentives it? Sure, but pick another way and for Christ's sake stop making stuff daily events.

People are too impatient. Too much criticism over an event thats incomplete and have good potential.

That remmind me when ambu weapons were first introduced. Dev said clearly the process would take lots of steps before the final stage still there were people complaining how Toko weapons were weak.

Right now there is zero incentive to do the event. Zero. You can buy the scales from the AH and never have to enter Odyssey. Sure, the event might become better, but right now it's a half-assed attempt at content.

Sky, Sea, Limbus, Assaults, Salvage, Nyzul, Legion, Einherjar, ANNM, HTMB, Omen, Dynamis both old and new, Abyssea, Unity, Voidwatch, ZNM all had gear rewards that required doing the event to obtain.

I was talking about the design, not my personal feelings about the reward. Strictly speaking about personal feelings I love that I can purchase the scale from AH and done with upgrades in a day. Yeah fast gears :)))))

Basic game design 101: If you want players to do A, A must offer rewards that's satisfying so players want to do A. The purpose of the reward is to make people do content. So my personal feeling about the reward has nothing to do with it if other people doesn't feel the same way.

Since I came back I've been looking for people to form a party for Odyssey, and not even a full party, just a small party of 2-4 people. So far I haven't been successful with the recruitment. I have much better recruitment success rate with Lilith and ambuscade content. There are almost always people needing malig gears or ambu points. Then when I asked people why they wouldn't team up for Odyssey, they were like "too lazy".

Well, or course they are. Since they can use merc money to purchase the scales.

Dev spent the resources to create party contents, and people refuse to do them or skip them because rewards arent ex/rare so pt cant be formed. This is failed design and waste of resources. I dont see how it can be justified. It isnt about MY* feeling about the reward, but about the goal of releasing a new content (something for players to do) gets accomplished.

When this content was just out, Asura had some Odyssey shouts but they seem to die recently too. So I dont see how Odyssey offers good grouping incentives atm. If it does there should be even more shouts going on.



I explained in last post why moogle mastery reward atm isnt good incentive. It needs to enhance your character in a more noticable way and it can only be a good incentive if future NM are tougher to beat.



I highly doubt THF sneaking up to open chests was the original intention for design. If it's intended then it should be available to all jobs.

So no, it doesn't meant to offer different gameplay experiences. Sneaking up is a playstyle discovered by the community. I'm quite certain the original design intention is to have a party enter the zone and kill NM/fetters/trash mobs in any order/combination they want. THF chest mechanics is just extra bonus for the party to invite this job. So far that main design goal hasn't been accomplished.

You enjoying solo doesn't matter here. If content is designed to provide a fun solo experience then party restriction should be 1, not 6. If people find it hard to recruit for a party due to the lack of reward, then it's better to fix this issue.



In FFXI, if grouping only has 2x more points than solo, then literally nobody would group up. Because forming a party frequently takes much longer than that. It's not uncommon for me to take 30 min to make a 6/6 ambu party, and that's ONLY during none event times when people are on.

The reward difference in ambuscade between solo and groups arent 3 times. Its bigger than that. Solo VE gets 200 points, VD with groups gets 3600, that's more than 10 time the difference. When you use seals the gap gets bigger, 600 v.s 10k+ points. So ambuscade is a bad example to demonstrate the balance between solo and grouping rewards since ambuscade does strongly favor grouping.

I think 3-5 times more reward for grouping up is a more reasonable range.


Then the issue is time gate, not ex/rare rewards. And this issue can easily be solved with KI storage like omen so people can do this as ls event once or twice per week.

If people had no issue with ambuscade, omen ex/rare rewards then there shouldn't be an issue with odyssey reward being ex/rare.


Isnt gathering feedback being the point of releasing a "beta" version of a content? That's what we are doing now.

Odyssey may have "potential" design wise, the idea of going in with a group to fight NM/fetter or trash mob farming sounds fun. But if people just prefer to purchase the scale or bring keys to open chests, then all these effort into design gets wasted if mobs arent being killed.

The whole point of Moogle Mastery (at least, so far) is to power up trusts, so I think making it good for solo/a couple people was one of the main focuses of the event. You don't have to party up to clear NMs, nodes or fodder to get a good number of scales.

Personally I like Odyssey. I just don't like doing it solo (or maybe I still haven't found a way to do it that's suitable for my tastes).
I wish more of my friends would do it or more people would shout for it.
Also wish you could store more tags (like Omen) to do like 3 runs in a row and then forget about it for a few days.

There are multiple things that prove this statement wrong:
1-Moogle Mastery is tied to opening coffers (not tied directly to thf)
2-Is also tied to killing mimics, which can only be obtained by thieves using keys
3-killing mimics grants large box at the final conflux

#2 and #3 strongly show that thieves using keys on chest was part of their original design.

And gtfo with this "available to all jobs", what the hell lmao. God forbid that after 15 years THF's ability to pick coffers has some form of utility (other than getting AF hands without needing to farm a key or astral rings), why does it have to be available to all jobs?!?


If you dont have thief leveled, it takes 2 hours to 99 it and slap your herculean on. Its not like you have to fight anything when picking chests.

MM doesn't make a whole lot of difference atm though. Not when solo THF opening chests being the most efficient way to farm scales. The idea of freely choosing between killing NM, nodes or fodder in a battle content just flat out doesn't work atm.