Killer Instinct: The Beastmaster Compendium

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Killer Instinct: The Beastmaster Compendium
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By Vankathka 2020-01-17 09:21:31
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Because of /nin malignance gear and snarl, Rages defense loss is great, but its manageable, anything truly damaging is usually magic Apex/Wave1/wave2 dynamis can all be blocked with shadows, maybe Wave 3 fell cleaves or circle blades could kill you though.

I wouldn't use it though without Malignance built in -DT for that extra layer of defense, or using a 3k TP 9 minute Rage and then summoning Crab/Pugil for Guard/WaterWall

You definitely do feel paper defense thin and are very aware about your shadows.
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 Asura.Sirris
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By Asura.Sirris 2020-01-17 10:30:14
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Yeah with Snarl we can dump enmity more effectively than any other job. Just keep shadows up. I wouldn't use Rage lowman but for Dyna I absolutely would.
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By Nariont 2020-01-17 10:35:13
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Still quite the heavy trade off though, id say it also limits you as far as subs go but what else would you sub anyway sides maybe dancer
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By Asura.Sirris 2020-01-17 10:41:42
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You're pretty much always going to sub NIN for party play, yeah.
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-01-17 16:08:50
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-60% defense is +150% damage taken. Defense down scales the same as haste, really awesome debuff to use on monsters.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk 2020-01-17 20:34:29
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
-50 or 60% defense is too dangerous and will get the master turned into a red smear on anything worth taking about.

Just to follow up on that, MNK counterstance ,which is super hard to maintain for the same reason even with 80% counter rate and MNK huge HP pool, is -50% def. So yeah..

This is my bad, but the Rage effects on the player are +50%/-50%.

Sorry for the mix-up.

Rage on the Sheep is still definitely +60%/-60% though:


Remove the +10% attack adjustment,
646 / 1.1 = 587.27
The +10% and +60% stack additively for a +70% bonus:
floor(587.27 * 1.7) = 998
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By Asura.Saevel 2020-01-17 20:46:58
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-50% is still too harshe, it basically doubles the damage monsters deal to you. We're not worried about the regular attacks, it's the OMFGWTFBBQ TP moves that ignore/wipe shadows and hit you anyways.
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By Asura.Outlawbruce 2020-01-17 21:42:53
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Aerix said: »
shamgi said: »
Also, I find it incredibly interesting that we get the guard buff from the boar even though it should technically do nothing.

As weird as it is, BST is actually on quite a few HTH weapons including Karambit from Ambu. I guess SE thinks BST/MNK is viable for something lol.

By the way, what kind of numbers can BST put out using Fernagu with R15 Aymur Primal Rend or R15 Farsha Cloudsplitter and BiS MAB gear as well as no other buffs? Obviously those WSs won't be useful everywhere, but given that an Idris GEO can nearly double magic WS damage with Malaise it might honestly perform better in party settings than Decimation/Mistral/Calamity even with Rage+Frailty because of the PDIF cap and lack of abilities and traits that jobs like WAR have. And you won't risk dying as easily from the -60% Defense.

Of course, it'd be kind of a shame to waste the buffs from your pets, but at least you aren't reliant on Charmer's Merlin anymore and you can melee to your heart's content while firing off Ready moves every 10s.

I'm also interested in this. Still didn't see anyone say anything about the numbers of the magical weaponskills.

I'm not master or have a cape. But on warrior I'm getting about 18k cloudsplitters. I definitely like it more fencer. This is with wizards roll, Herculean etude, sinewy etude, logical etude. Probably better with the tp bonus axe off hand going /nin.

Love to still know what primal rend is doing. Saw someone say 20-30k with tp bonus axe.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Derk 2020-01-17 22:32:20
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Is there a new simple lua for beastmaster (like the one beaztmaster made)? Since ready is now instant, I haven't been able to adjust the old lua. Any guidance would be appreciated!
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By Vankathka 2020-01-17 22:42:47
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Okay so messing around with Waterwall its either bugged or Falkirks testing was off cause I've had Waterwall last over 8 minutes but the duration seems...wierd, almost like TP doesn't matter or its choosing it randomly.

Edit- Had it last anywhere from 2-8 minutes all with random amounts of TP.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk 2020-01-17 23:17:12
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Quetzalcoatl.Derk said: »
Is there a new simple lua for beastmaster (like the one beaztmaster made)? Since ready is now instant, I haven't been able to adjust the old lua. Any guidance would be appreciated!

Try this out. It's pretty much the same file, but the pet stuff is all in the job_precast function now.

Did a little test to confirm it works as intended:


I don't have the same gear, but the important parts swapped correctly for precast (the hands and legs).

Vankathka said: »
Okay so messing around with Waterwall its either bugged or Falkirks testing was off cause I've had Waterwall last over 8 minutes but the duration seems...wierd, almost like TP doesn't matter or its choosing it randomly.

Edit- Had it last from anywhere from 2-8 minutes all with random amounts of TP.

Thanks for investigating this. I encountered the same thing years ago when trying to pin down its duration. My old notes had these amounts:

1500 TP = 2min25sec
1500 TP = 3min
2000 TP = 5min50sec
2500 TP = 5min50sec
2500 TP = 4min
3000 TP = 3min50sec
3000 TP = 3min30sec

And I gave up at that point. You're right, it does seem random-ish.
Many of the Ready moves are just copy+pastes of each other so it's kind of baffling how they messed this one up.
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By Vankathka 2020-01-18 00:12:14
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Shame it isn't easier to make it last longer, if WaterWall could mirror Rages duration it would be alot easier to swap between the two. Ah well.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Derk 2020-01-18 20:43:40
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Thanks Falkirk!

I can confirm that new one works well!!!

https://pastebin.com/raw/EurGG9bW

It's too bad we have to wait to see if we can have ungimpy 10 sec ready charge.

HUGE THANK YOU!!!
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By Onimaru 2020-01-20 14:05:06
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So in conclusion all the self buffs from pets come from

-Sheep,= rage
-Hog = zealous snort
-Crabs = scissor guard, bubble curtain
-Lizards = secretion
-Pugils = Water wall
-Beetle = rhino guard

Is this it?
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-20 14:41:49
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I don't believe beetles are included but adamantoise's harden shell is.

https://www.bg-wiki.com/bg/Category:Jug_Pets
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 Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk
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By Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk 2020-01-20 15:07:07
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The editor does an amazing job keeping that page up to date.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-20 15:43:10
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The entire beast guide and wiki pages are some of the most expansive and detailed guides in all of the forums. And that's not taking anything away from other guides; I have basically gone from zero BST knowledge to a fairly thorough understanding of the job in about a week, all from reviewing the various pages. They are that good. Kudos to the editors. Also had to look up the word "compendium" and it couldn't be more appropriate

Anyways, question about monster correlation: does it not affect pet magic damage bonus vs the appropriate predation? I ask because i was trying out Patrick last night vs vermin and beasts and noticed the same damage. Even using empyrean+1 mask net the same damage. Or does monster ecosystem correlation only affect intimidation and damage is not included?
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By Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk 2020-01-20 15:47:52
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Anyways, question about monster correlation: does it not affect pet magic damage bonus vs the appropriate predation? I ask because i was trying out Patrick last night vs vermin and beasts and noticed the same damage. Even using empyrean+1 mask net the same damage. Or does monster ecosystem correlation only affect intimidation and damage is not included?

It's just for physical damage:

Quote:
Ferine Cabasset +2/Nukumi Cabasset/Nukumi Cabasset +1:
Wearing Ferine Cabbaset +2/Nukumi Cabasset/Nukumi Cabasset +1 when monster
correlation is favorable will grant a Pet: Attack and Accuracy bonus.

CabassetPet: Attack+%Pet: Accuracy+
ferine cabasset +110%10
ferine cabasset +220%20
nukumi cabasset22%22
nukumi cabasset +124%24
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-20 16:03:02
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Thanks, but what about just normal correlation? Shouldn't lizard fire damage deal more vs vermin than beasts? Or magic damage exempt from the calculation. According to the empyrean, it may very well be just physical but I wanted to be sure.

Thanks
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By Shiva.Malthar 2020-01-20 16:10:18
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Thanks, but what about just normal correlation? Shouldn't lizard fire damage deal more vs vermin than beasts? Or magic damage exempt from the calculation. According to the empyrean, it may very well be just physical but I wanted to be sure.

Thanks

He just said it doesn't affect magic. You should also consider the resist the beasts you're fighting has.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-20 16:17:28
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I assumed his response was to the empyrean piece since he included that part from the guide, which I got that part. I'm asking about just monster correlation in general to understand how it works. It may not affect magical damage vs the appropriate type since the empyrean piece also doesn't, but I'm asking since none of the pages indicate anything about it.

As far as resists go, I stated I used fireball vs both vermin and beasts, which lizards have both a positive and negative correlation to. It was the same damage every time, and we're talking Reis fodder, so I'm not sure I had resists in a high mab/macc set. If there were possible resists, I would have seen higher or lower values depending on what I was fighting at the time, but i got neither.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk 2020-01-20 16:52:34
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Ecosystem advantage is limited to intimidation procs (5%) outside of the Empyrean headgear.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-20 17:00:01
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Thanks
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By FaeQueenCory 2020-01-24 08:42:26
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Yoji_Fujito said:
As of the January adjustments, gear swapping cannot keep up when used after “/pet” commands. This isn’t limited to just beastmaster, but rather tied to equipment that apply effects at a specific timing. Even if a particular macro functions correctly, (for instance, equip recast reduction gear, then execute a command, then swapping to another gear are all executed) it doesn’t go as far as to guarantee the activation of equipment effects. However, in this case there were some pet abilities where there was enough time to change equipment, which currently don’t function as they had before. This particular change wasn’t intended and will be addressed.

Next is the question of determining the activation time.
“/equipset” has always been a command that takes time between execution and actually applying the equipment. Changing the activation time to match this would mean a delay of 75 frames, which would be the same as summoner.
However, this would make the overall activation time slower than before, and would result negatively for players who don’t change equipment.

On the other hand, “/equip” command executes in 60 frames and is considerably faster than “/equipset”. There have been many abilities that were 60 frames, and so this would probably feel similar to how it was previously.

This time we’re planning to make adjustments using the latter idea. Should we receive a large amount of feedback that gear swapping doesn’t work or players who prefer to use /equipset instead, we’ll consider changing it to be the same as summoner, at 75 frames. Please give it a try and let us know what you think.

Regarding ability ranges, as we’ve mentioned multiple times in the past, we are not considering making changes. The January 2020 adjustments are meant to encourage beastmasters themselves to fight on the frontline, so we’d like you to find a way to work together with your pets.
So....... congrats, BSTs?
Gearswap people would be fine, so long as they suppress the equipset defaulting. Everyone else, <4 changes per TP move lol

So I guess BST will have the 1.25s delay like SMN does in the March update.

EDIT: I did just think of a workaround though. But it's a little weird.
So if the vanilla player makes their ready move damage set as normal, but has Desultor Tassets in the leg slot...
Code
/equipset [damage+Tassets set] echo <wait 0>
/pet [readymovecommand] <me> <wait 0>
/equip legs [the damage pants]

Then that should function within the parameters of the 60f delay come February update in ~2wks.

Quetzalcoatl.Falkirk said: »

The editors does an amazing job keeping that page up to date.
Why thank you. Though I can't take all the credit, I mostly just make it look nice.
I'm also uncertain of Lucani ready moves. No one updated it for those pets, and I only vaguely remember that their moves are the same as the ladybugs? So that very much could be wrong.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-24 09:28:45
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FaeQueenCory said: »
EDIT: I did just think of a workaround though. But it's a little weird.
So if the vanilla player makes their ready move damage set as normal, but has Desultor Tassets in the leg slot...
Code
1
2
3
/equipset [damage+Tassets set] echo <wait 0>
/pet [readymovecommand] <me> <wait 0>
/equip legs [the damage pants]

Then that should function within the parameters of the 60s delay come February update in ~2wks.

I was going to suggest using a wait 1 previously for non- GS users, but that would mean you have to delay your actions by a second (similar to how precast sets are <wait 1> for vanilla users on certain faster casting spells). The macro you suggested is exactly what I would have had in mind when I get around to making it (non GS user here), but may I ask why you are including <wait 0> and how does that function? It should fire off after the proposed changes to 60fps without that wait 0 included, but I just want to know what is the difference between <wait 0> and no wait (for my own personal knowledge, please).

Thanks Fae
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By Shiva.Malthar 2020-01-24 10:40:38
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Quote:
Regarding ability ranges, as we’ve mentioned multiple times in the past, we are not considering making changes. The January 2020 adjustments are meant to encourage beastmasters themselves to fight on the frontline, so we’d like you to find a way to work together with your pets.

Translation:
Regarding the range issue, we mentioned several times in the past that we are absolutely deaf to facts that Beastmasters have played this way for over a decade, but we want to force you to do it our way. And we don't care that even when you're playing the way we're forcing you to play /pet abilities still don't go off. We gave you the buffs your pets put on itself, regardless of whether the /pet command activates. Why aren't you satisfied? Figure it out!

That about sums it up.
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By FaeQueenCory 2020-01-24 11:22:45
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
The macro you suggested is exactly what I would have had in mind when I get around to making it (non GS user here), but may I ask why you are including <wait 0> and how does that function? It should fire off after the proposed changes to 60fps without that wait 0 included, but I just want to know what is the difference between <wait 0> and no wait (for my own personal knowledge, please).
Wait 0s in vanilla basically function as a "when this is finished" clause when you add it to an end of a line. Waits in halves are not accepted and default to wait 1s, but wait 0s are "immediate when finished" cues.

Given that there's a bit of a electron level delay in equipping a whole equipset, which I think this is the first time they've confirmed that on the OF? Then having no waits and immediately following the equipset with an /equip line can often have the /equip not fire (or more accurately be overwritten by the /equipset).

Wait 0s usually remedy this issue, unless there's a lag spike or something.
For example: I save from having to make a second equipset just for refresh+ gear on RDM by following my base enhancing duration equipset with a <wait 0> and single line /equips of the refresh+ stuff.
(Only time I ever have an issue is right after a zone and there's sometimes a delay from lag in when wardrobes have actually loaded after the loading icon is gone.)

Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Thanks Fae
Any time. ;^*
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-01-24 11:39:27
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FaeQueenCory said: »
wait 0s are "immediate when finished" cues

Never knew this and been playing since 04. Mind=blown. Can't tell you how many times my macro didn't put on my next line's /equip because /equipset preceded it. I was using /wait 1 in some instances to correct the delay, but Wowwwww very helpful
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By FaeQueenCory 2020-01-24 12:11:08
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You can see <wait 0>s are 0sec as the game's hard delays will nix a job ability use, so you need a <wait>/<wait 1> between job ability commands at a minimum.
So like:
Code
/equipset WSdmg echo <wait 0>
/jobability "warcry" <me> <wait 0>
/weaponskill WS <t>
Will return an error on the WS command, that second wait 0 needs to be a 1s wait.

But aside from that conflict, <wait 0> should always follow your /equipsets IMO if you're vanilla. It helps keep everything where and when it needs to be.
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By Felgarr 2020-01-24 17:00:08
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Has anyone tried stacking Pet Buffs on self, via Bestial Loyalty AND Call Beast?

I know it's not very prudent to waste the second pet call, but what are your general thoughts?

It it were up to me:
1.) I'd increase distance to 10 yalms just to accommodate job activation during "large" Pet AoE ranges and large-sized mobs
2.) I'd give Beast Affinity 5/5 to everyone so pets are your native i-level, not some arbitrary cap.
3.) I'd replace Beast Affinity with a Diffusion JA that gives your pet buffs to your party within range.

Combined with Call Beast and Bestial Loyalty, you could give your party 2 sets of pet Buffs. Thoughts?
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