Drk/nin - No Dream Crushing Please :P

Lol well, i get the idea :P ill just use Mkris for zerging fun, at the moment ive been trying to keep GS scythe and GA all capped as i go along (which is *** hard) lol

Yah, i think i may just scythe it up with a bit of GS and GA and worry about otherways to be different or amazing lol, btw how much haste does hasso give?

Did you even read that lud? It only said the str was based on lvl the acc and haste are independent. It's been accepted to be 10% forever. Thats how drk/sams were getting 93% before they gimped total haste

There are plenty of low man situations where /sam just makes you an mp sponge and worst then useless. It's for survivability that you should /nin.

Not very clear to me >=\

Yay for someone thinking about the big picture and not just the big numbers...

Well, where would you want /nin lowman? Nyzul is debatable; I never have any issues whatsoever as /sam there. Dynamis /sam, Einherjar /sam ... Limbus /nin perhaps but I'd rather come on another job that being the case.

/nin is far from useless on DRK, but use it as a Last Resort!

WOah woah wait... hasso would give me 10% haste on drk/sam as soon as i get it?! if so thats insane

yep! drk\sam is a really good mp-sponge pre-70 tho:P but it's fun as hell when you get guillo and can use \sam at 60!

yeah, when Hasso dropped /Sam became the main 2hand sub. and with Seigan/Third Eye, you get a mini Utsu (remember Hasso and Seigan will overwrite each other). /Nin has its use for lowman stuff, heavy AoE NM/HNMs where Utsu will block dmg and meripos where the mage is lazy and cant handle Seigan/Third Eye. as far at /Nin being gimped, that's more just personal opinion. most subs have a use at some point in time for some situation.

Happy hunting!

Just jumping in on the sam-sub debate, but truthfully as SAM main there's hardly ever a time that I can use Hasso and not cause sponging. Usually it's just something to pop on pre-WS and take off right after. I think the one time I was able to leave it on was during merits and the mage said he was bored. lol

what do you all mean by mp sponge lol, that i wont use mp at all?

that you get hate all the time, lose alot of hp and that the healer waste all his mp on curing you! lol
after 70 you'll probably use seigan and third eye pretty much fulltime, but it's awsome too, you get mini-utsu + counter!

Usually limbus. Usually had less then 1 pt. In nyzul depends but we generally wouldn't even think of bringing a drk/sam ate too much mp.

You will eat all the healers mp and fast without a tank to keep it off you. Even with seigen + third eye constantly on which most drk/sams wont do. You'll eat massive dmg from mean AOEs. You will destroy the possiblity of low manning something.

yeah, while we're going /nin on DRK, lets go /nin on everything else, that way our survival rate and noobness will increase.

DRK/NIN? no

Go ahead and ruin the entire thing were trying to do. I'm not gonna plug myself into you to keep you alive. I will let you die and let the unselfish players live

Especially when everyone's sitting there /sigh'ing and getting impatient cause you gotta rest back all your MP...yeah, it's the healers fault they had to cure bomb, right...

1) Most /SAM only use it for Hasso and rarely if ever use Seigan + 3rd Eye
2) Even if they do it's too unreliable
3) When I'm out of MP and have 5 minutes on convert because the idiotic /SAM "OMGLOOKATMYDMG!" melee can't be arsed to lower their damage a little so that the party can continue without MP rests then they are doing something wrong.

Your damage might be slightly less /NIN but your survivability is far far better and it allows much easier chaining. I am sick to death of /SAM melee who make me sit there spamming cure after cure and then being out of MP with Convert still on cool down.

anyone else ever been tempted to have a 5xdrg/nin and either healer or thf pt, hate would bounce alot through everyone shadows by which time it probly be dead lol- something like that would be incredibly fun anyway

drg\magex5 + brd = win

Actually more tempted with a 5 or even 6X drg/mage probably blu or rdm maybe whm on certain mobs.

mmm, i think i might jus log on and get 6 drg/mage together and have some fun XD

would be such rape, 6 drgs 6 wyverns... would be like 400+ dmg a turn... (in a lvl 10-40 pt for example) would take like what... 4 turns to kil a mob?

Yeah drg/blu has crazy potential. I duod simmurgh so many times like that and only thing I had to do for the drg most the time was haste erase protect and for fun debuff simmurgh... well and grav it during 2hr. He easily did all the dmg in 12-15min and tanked and his wyvern did 90% of the healing... hell I refreshed myself more then him and I had composure lol.

Those are faults with the players, not the subjobs. Equally you can expect that most SAMs and WARs etc you see are gonna be severely gimped in some way, doesn't mean SAM and WAR are bad jobs.

Shouldn't sponge in nyzul at all really... most mobs are far too low end and a more offensive setup will kill NMs faster making them less dangerous. Fanatic's Drink on the boss is normally enough.

SAM and WAR don't lose a huge deal by going /nin (though it is weaker); DRK and DRG however require /sam (or /war) to do good damage. As a 2handed melee, you need either heavy TP gain (Store TP, Meditate, Hasso, Aggressor) or heavy damage (Berserk, Hasso, Double Attack, Aggressor) in order to pump out respectable damage (just comparing the abilities from /war, /sam and /nin here). WAR and SAM still have access to some from each category so they do fine with /nin, but DRG and DRK are kind of boned.

This.
And well, \sam have more defensive stuff than \war, so \sam -> \war.
Just remember to use seigan!

Nice im training blu Atm, what spells did u use for tanking Cocoon and? is metallic body worth it to help tank as/blu, it seems pretty crap when i use it...

Pretty much just cocoon. Thats enough to get the dmg into reasonable lvls and the ability to cure4ish for only 5 mp at .5 sec fills in the rest. Especially since a good tp setup on drg generally has decent hp/mp/def on it... ie homam. As for other spells str vit stat spells and the fast casting offensive ones that cost little for healing breathe activations. Head butt and sprout smack nice on the mobs it works on too. Though on some mobs even lol /rdm phalanx will outdo the dmg reduction from cocoon.
As far as nyzul. Unless you static you cant count on people being good players and not sponging. And while most the mobs are DC-EMish the others it helps to be /nin. I still make my sams/nin or /dnc for survivability... then again unlike most people who insist you can only do it with 2 healers we always bring just 1 rdm for support rest DDs unless we can get a cor... though she usually goes /rng anyways and throws some DD buffs up and shoots alot.

im trying to get simurghs ToD, not so heavily camped on my server anymore i hear, so i just run by his spawn like twice a day till hopeullfy i find him up... if he is up it will involve me dieing and getting some ls friends down to help though lmao

so i'd like to ask ... if war and drk are getting into /sam .. and i see it happening on my server alot lately ... does this mean that monks like me don't have to go /nin anymore cause war and drk are just doing out of this world dmg with /sam? and let's not forget sam main job.

ahhh ... a mnk could only hope so :)