IiPunch - Monk Guide

I know TA is generally very nice for them herc feet and i was going for some TA with DM event being on but got a pair that although didnt have TA was rather nice or maybe im just wrong. ACC+16 STP+5 DA+5 should i just keep them for some other job and go farm a new pair ?

An LS Member explained it to me easily.

Go outside a starter city and attack LVL 0 mobs.
Get 100 data samples (i didn't care for exact numbers so I killed 3) this is without crit damage.
Record your dmg numbers (you will kill in 1 shot, my monk did like 1130, 1155, and 1144)
Average those data samples, that is your PDL.
You are attack capped also, so that average dmg number is also you being attack capped. If you are fighting anything else in the game, and you are hitting for a lower amount, you are NOT attack capped.

So my monk, around 1100 damage, maybe a little more, and I am attack capped.

if you're attack capped, your low and high will only be 5% in difference. the numbers you get on a level 0 mob will not be the same you get on an endgame one.

Why not?

Not counting buffs, debuffs, food, anything that increases attack, and the exact same gear, why wouldn't it?

Yes, the 5% difference looks about right, I was hitting for 1110 through about 1154 on the high side.

Actually maybe answering my own question:

a higher level mob would have more defense, which means you would need more attack to be attack capped, which in turn would also mean your damage would go up. Is that correct?

However, one can determine that if you are not hitting for how much you hit against a lvl0 mob, you definitely are NOT attack capped. No matter what mob it is in game.

And even if you are right at those numbers, you have more to go to be attack capped.

no. attack/defense are just multipliers of your base damage. higher level mobs will have higher VIT which will lower your base damage, where on a level 0 mob you have maximum base damage. when your attack is high enough to where your upper and lower ranges are at the maximum multiplier, then your damage variance will only be 5% on a melee hit.

mobs can also have other things as well, such as blunt resistance or weakness, or a natural physical resistance in general. the easiest way to know if you're capped would be the 5% difference between lowest and highest hits.

Just to add the obvious, but maybe not for everyone. 5% difference between normal hits and 5% difference between crit hits separately, not between lowest normal and highest crit.

A-ha! TY for explaining that. We were speaking about the same thing I think, in a roundabout way, but while the statement "higher level mobs will have higher vit which will lower your base damage" is true, so is: higher level mobs will have higher vit, which will give them more defense. In turn, it will raise the attack needed to hit the cap.
But I think we're talking about someone with no buffs, etc, going to swing at an ilvl150 mob, which never happens. Buffs and debuffs will always be in play.

So it seems like the play, to determine if you are attack capped before going into Warder of Courage, is to stack as much attack as possible, and looking at the 5% difference, if it is your first time fighting it, to get an idea?

(This question started because I was finally making Adhemar gloves, and was wondering if I should go path A or path B. I shouldn't go Path B if I am attack capped. Since this was my first pair, I wanted to make the best decision possible, but then the overthinking and overanalyzing began. LOL)

For stuff where Geomancy isn't nerfed, having Dia3 empowered by Light Shot and Idris Bolster Frailty are so powerful and they bring an enemy's defense so much on the ground that you're gonna cap att with a relatively small amount of Att buffs.

Normally more att above that would be completely useless, but stats like PDL come into play allowing a certain % of excess Attack above the cap to be accounted for in the damage formula.


This doesn't perfectly answer your question though.
Because at this point you can start wondering which targets have a nerf to debuff geomancy, or you could wonder about normal Idris Frailty without Bolster (there's other forms of def down you can stack in addition to the ones mentioned btw, like Tourbillion or Tenebral Crush or Box step or one of the Defdown WSs etc)

I don't think there is an absolute and ultimate answer allowing you to know for sure when you're gonna be capped no matter the target.
You can only have guesstimates and, for specific targets, a rough measurement of their stats which would allow you to know the approximate amount of att required to cap given a specific amount of def down to that target.
We already do that for Accuracy, which is way easier to measure thanks to a binary value of "hit / miss", whereas for the att cap value we need a wider set of more variegated numbers, alas.

For instance for the target you asked for, Warder of Courage, we know approximate stats and they are reported in the majority of spreadsheets. So you can play around adding att to your char or def down to the target to see when exactely you reach the point where adding more att or furtherly reducing the def produces no result, meaning you're at the att cap.

That's assuming your geo's gearswap is functioning properly, lol

You assume +10 frailty and you're getting +0 sometimes

“You can never be killed in your precast set”

“Sorry guys got caught in my casting set”

Casting and precast are two different things tho

A little notice in case u dont know, u can change the aug on Escha - Ru'Aun as many times u want at npc, with no charges;)

I've been playing this game badly for 19 years. I have finally started swapping out sets for WS etc. Eventually getting 2 Adhemar Hands is the best choice, but ya, you can swap out augments too. :)

Thank you all for explaining it. Maybe I was confusing PDL with Attack Cap on those lvl0 mobs.

-Pat

3k Escha silt isn't no charge but it might as well be. Just for completion sake.

Okay I have another question now. I've been reading the pDIF section of bg wiki, and am confused about something. So, I want to just pose a question to see if I can derive a formula from it.

If I am Level 99, a 1 handed weapon user, and my mob's defense is 1088 (Apex Eft), what is the number that would be attack capped on this mob?

(not taking into account PDL+ just a normal 1 handed weapon guy)

My confusion lies in Pre-Randomizer pDIF Caps by Weapon Type vs attack vs defense ratios. My current formula to get a "basic" cap is attack vs defense ratio multiplied by defense. For instance, the 1hander has a ratio of 3.625, and when multiplied by the apex eft's defense 1088, I get 4684, which seems a little high to me. So should I be using the pre-randomizer pDIF caps instead? Or am I completely wrong about this all together?

It seems high because everyone assumes they're capped attack on literally everything, literally always. As much as they spout it off one assumes it's a trivial feat.

Also when you're lowering mob defense it comes down faster than raising your attack. and of course seems much more reasonable. as for the exact numbers, someone else has to confirm.

It's 3.25 for 1h without PDL. Anything past that would result in being capped at 3.25

3536 attack might still feel like a lot, but with CC +8 Chaos roll IV and Marcato Honor March and Minuet V I have 3719 attack on MNK in TP set and 3955 in WS set (That being said h2h has 3.5 base cap and 3.8 with MNK native traits, so I would still be slightly uncapped). Also with DiaIII from trust and Shell Crusher and that target's def drops from 1088 to ~595 and you suddenly need 1933 attack only.

The Pre-randomizer pDIF cap is 3.25. If I factor that into my equation the attack cap number becomes: 3536. I'm just not sure which one it is. :)

I agree Eiryl. A lot of people kind of "freak out" about numbers amongst a million other things. I'm more of a "reality" type of guy and want to know, closer to, exactly how to calculate some of these.

There it is right when I was posting, TY!

I have a 6 character team, and am finally getting into some decent savage blade numbers (45k). I wanted to see how much higher I could get.

Edit: Something just clicked when reading your diaIII and shellcrusher comment. 1088 defense is the beginning number, with my application of dia III and whatever 812skill applies as frailty, the attack cap will be lower. Good to remember.

My team has an 812 skill geo, +3 songs bard (no gjallerhorn), but dia III, minuet x2, frailty, fury, etc etc. 45k shocked me with a warrior fencer build, but I guess my gear is finally getting better. :)

Also I might be wrong and you might need +0.375 ratio more to be completely capped, but tbh I have no idea how exactly this works with per weapon caps and with PDL trait and PDL gear.

One of the things that probably required re testing, but none care enough to do it :)

LOL Okay, for my calculations I will go with the higher number number still, and not worry about it.

Using the higher number even on that poor apex eft, I need 1918 to attack cap. That is with a 900skill geo no idris with geo frailty, and Dia III (no light shot improvement). I am attack capped with 2300 attack on my warrior, so thats good.

In your example of 1088 defense with H2H, and using H2H, you'd need 3.875 x defense to cap to the lower and upper range. PDL just multiplies the cap after the addition of the weapon specific and job trait caps, it's been tested and was tested and verified the day those traits and items came out

1088 * (3.5 + 0.3 + 0.375) = 4543 attack to cap

with 10% PDL

1088 * ((3.5 + 0.3) * 1.1 + 0.375) = 4956 attack to cap

Okay, so you are using the higher number (attack vs defense ratio). Gotcha, ty!

There are two values, you have an upper and a lower. If you are not capped, it will select a random value between the upper and lower. If you are completely capped, the upper and lower values will be the same and the only random value will be the 1-1.05 multiplier at the end, which is why when you are attack capped, you only have 5% difference between lowest and highest damage hit.

R15 Vereth
R25 Coiste
R0 Mpaca head
R25 Mnk neck +2
R25 Schere
Sherida
Bhikku Cyclas +3
R0 Mpaca hands
Niqmaddu
Gere
Segomo 30 Dex 20 acc 20 attk 10dbl attk
Moonbow +1
Bhikku hose +3


My question is continue to use af +3 kick feet or Herculean boots I just rolled Acc +23 Attack +20 Quadruple attack +3%. (Side note also got fast cast 6% mab +6 mac +6 lol). Thanks guys.

Herc boots probably with its mix of 2 TA, 3 QA now, even regular well augmented(TA+3~4 acc/atk+25+) herc boots were the go-to for TP, unsure if this changes for FW but think the same applies there too.

if you're uncapped what will the % in difference be?

Depends on your ratio

For example at 2.75 it will be
upper (2.75+0.375)*1.05 = 3.28125
lower (2.75-0.375)= 2.375

So in this case highest will be ~38% higher than lowest.