IiPunch - Monk Guide

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 Phoenix.Oyama
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By Phoenix.Oyama 2020-06-17 22:10:36
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I think he'll probably get the most use out of Howling Fist, as far as straight damage WS goes, because of the attack bonus on it. Raging is disappointing without high buffs, as is Victory Smite without impetus and empy body, and kick WS without footwork and kick boots.

The main takeaway from the HTH WS changes is that most of your WS are multi-hitters with scaling, replicating ftp, like Resolution and Stardiver. So generally you're going to prioritize multi-attack in your WS sets, and hold tp instead of WS at 1k. Victory Smite you can spam at 1k for Skillchains.

Personally I use DA for tp cape.
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By tyalangan 2020-06-18 15:43:18
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Going to make several assumptions so please correct me if I'm wrong:

1. Kick Attacks work on WS (not talking about Kick weaponskills like Tornado/Dragon as I understand how that works with Kick Damage and Footwork. I'm more referring to all other WS) since I cant find anywhere saying they dont. I looked on BG kick attack/footwork pages, on Monk updates from the last 4 years and on this guide and BG guide.

2. A Kick Attack is like a Double Attack as it adds an extra hit

2a. A Kick Attack is an extra attack on top of all other attacks/multi-attacks. I.E. You did a normal hit/DA/TA/QA/OAT this round now you have an x% chance for KA on top of it.

2b. Or A Kick Attack is a separate attack in the hierarchy of all MA. I.E. You did no MA so now you have an x% chance for KA (ex: QA > TA > DA > OATorT > KA)
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By SimonSes 2020-06-18 15:57:27
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1. Nope
2. Extra Kick, is not the same as extra hit. kick has different damage and tp return (unless you are barehand and wear no kick attack damage, then they are the same)
2a.
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By tyalangan 2020-06-18 16:06:55
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SimonSes said: »
1. Nope
2. Extra Kick, is not the same as extra hit. kick has different damage and tp return (unless you are barehand and wear no kick attack damage, then they are the same)
2a.

1. I believe you but I want to update BG. Do you know where I can find this info so I can source it.

2. Can I assume less TP return than a hit? If so, then it may be a wash on if its better than a DA, right? It can happen no matter what type of attack you do but it gives less TP. More chances to do it but not as rewarding towards getting 1000TP?
 Asura.Friedrik
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By Asura.Friedrik 2020-06-19 01:33:34
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Kicks are a third MA-type roll on an attack round, their value is very high.
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2020-06-19 02:59:17
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kicks give the same tp return as a punch
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By SimonSes 2020-06-19 13:42:56
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tyalangan said: »
2. Can I assume less TP return than a hit? If so, then it may be a wash on if its better than a DA, right? It can happen no matter what type of attack you do but it gives less TP. More chances to do it but not as rewarding towards getting 1000TP?

Ramuh.Austar said: »
kicks give the same tp return as a punch

Holy ***Austar is right. It's actually the same TP as punch with weapon. Really sorry for misinformation.

Now idk if Kick Attacks on WS really need any source. Its super easy to test. Go with 100% kick rate and 0% QA/TA/DA and make a WS and you will notice you dont get any additional hits. I actually did that. Without switching equip, with 101TP per hit and 88% Kick attack rate all Final Heavens were returning 202TP. Then just in case I added Footwork on top of it overcapping Kick Rate way above 100% and nothing changed, still 202TP return.
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-06-19 14:31:04
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I think Kick attacks used to give more TP back when Footwork made you autoattack with Kicks only, the first and old version of the JA.
During WS you had full TP return from the first TWO hits of the WS instead of just the first.

I'm not sure if this is still the case when Footwork is active uh, but I don't think so.
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By SimonSes 2020-06-19 14:53:21
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Asura.Sechs said: »
I think Kick attacks used to give more TP back when Footwork made you autoattack with Kicks only, the first and old version of the JA.
During WS you had full TP return from the first TWO hits of the WS instead of just the first.

I'm not sure if this is still the case when Footwork is active uh, but I don't think so.

Nope, after they changed Footwork, nothing you mentioned work anymore.

Only thing that footwork does to WS is adding Kick Attack Damage to calculation for Tornado and Dragon kicks.
 Asura.Aller
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By Asura.Aller 2020-06-20 03:18:35
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Can you guys critique this set?
Code
sets.precast.WS['Spinning Attack'] = set_combine(sets.precast.WS, {
		ammo="Knobkierrie",
		head="Ken. Jinpachi +1",
		body={ name="Adhemar Jacket +1", augments={'STR+12','DEX+12','Attack+20',}},
		hands={ name="Adhemar Wrist. +1", augments={'DEX+12','AGI+12','Accuracy+20',}},
		legs="Ken. Hakama +1",
		feet={ name="Herculean Boots", augments={'Accuracy+23','"Triple Atk."+3','STR+5','Attack+8',}},
		neck="Fotia Gorget",
		waist="Moonbow Belt +1",
		left_ear="Sherida Earring",
		right_ear="Brutal Earring",
		left_ring="Gere Ring",
		right_ring="Niqmaddu Ring",
		back={ name="Segomo's Mantle", augments={'STR+20','Accuracy+20 Attack+20','Crit.hit rate+10',}},
	})

Tried to cleave Omen and was getting really poor numbers.
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-06-20 03:35:59
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Other than the adhemar being A instead of B you're not really going to move the needle that much. Change cape if you're using multiple capes to DA or wsd

Spinning Attack isn't going to do 50k per mob, it's going to do 50k total. If you want to bop some ***look at a cataclysm set.
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-06-20 12:53:36
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Segomo's mantle could use another +10STR and DA+10 instead of crit.
I'd go with Path B on Adhemar hands.
Other than that, it looks cool.
 Asura.Aller
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By Asura.Aller 2020-06-20 18:44:30
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Thanks guys!

Eiryl, can you share average numbers for Cataclysm? vs Spinning? I will search forums for a proper set.
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-06-20 18:58:00
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I don't have any numbers to post, all the cata talk is in here somewhere though
 Siren.Mosin
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By Siren.Mosin 2020-06-20 21:15:02
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someone posted 27k on omen fodder, as E said in this thread somewhere
 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2020-06-20 22:20:44
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Buukki has a good cata set I believe.
 Shiva.Applesmash
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By Shiva.Applesmash 2020-06-20 22:42:09
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sets.precast.WS['Cataclysm'] = {
ammo="Pemphredo Tathlum",
head="Pixie Hairpin +1",
body={ name="Herculean Vest", augments={'Mag. Acc.+14 "Mag.Atk.Bns."+14','MND+2','Mag. Acc.+1','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+15',}},
hands={ name="Leyline Gloves", augments={'Accuracy+15','Mag. Acc.+15','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+15','"Fast Cast"+3',}},
legs={ name="Herculean Trousers", augments={'Mag. Acc.+20 "Mag.Atk.Bns."+20','Crit. hit damage +1%','Mag. Acc.+5','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+15',}},
feet={ name="Herculean Boots", augments={'Mag. Acc.+18 "Mag.Atk.Bns."+18','"Fast Cast"+2','INT+8','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+8',}},
neck="Baetyl Pendant",
waist="Hachirin-no-Obi",
left_ear={ name="Moonshade Earring", augments={'Accuracy+4','TP Bonus +250',}},
right_ear="Friomisi Earring",
left_ring="Archon Ring",
right_ring="Shiva Ring +1",
back={ name="Segomo's Mantle", augments={'STR+20','Accuracy+20 Attack+20','STR+10','Weapon skill damage +10%',}},}

Obviously Orpheus sash whenever you don't have day/weather, and if you're really hardcore you can make a MACC/WSD cape
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-06-21 00:56:31
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Xoanon weapon is pretty impressive for MNK Cata, Alber Strap in sub ofc. And I think Shiva Ring +1 is dethroned in virtually every set by R15 Metamorph Ring +1. I wouldn't go out of my way to make MAB herc for MNK Cataclysm unless you already have it, WSD gear should suffice. Not sure about Knob vs Pemphredo, but that set above looks good.
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By tyalangan 2020-06-22 22:20:29
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To perform solo radiance with Godhands I need to start with Shijin at 3k TP before I go into VS > VS and that will hold until the Lv3 aftermath wears? From then on I will just perform double light?
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By Bahamut.Khimeria 2020-06-22 22:46:24
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That's right (just tested with 2500 tp), though noting that you only need 2250 tp with godhands/moonshade earring.
 Sylph.Excalin
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By Sylph.Excalin 2020-06-22 22:55:23
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tyalangan said: »
To perform solo radiance with Godhands I need to start with Shijin at 3k TP before I go into VS > VS and that will hold until the Lv3 aftermath wears? From then on I will just perform double light?

3K TP is needed in order to do back to back WS to get Radiance. Which means WS1 activates it but you won't have the Light SC property on Shijin Spiral the first time. So either you do Shijin two more times or another Light/Dark Property WS twice to get the effect. Like wise you could just make it a 3 WS SC

2k+ TP Shijin>VS>(VS or Shijin) will result in Light followed by Radiance.

Aeonic AM isn't quite like other REMA AM so if you do a 4 WS SC, Shijin doesn't have to be the first WS to end up with a chain that resolves with Radiance. Tornado Kick>Shijin>Shijin>(VS or Shijin) for example will give you Frag Light Radiance with the AM activating on the first use of Shijin and being consumed upon Radiance.

If you don't want to consume the AM, than you will need to not perform the required steps in a SC to activate Radiance.
1k = 4 WS
2k = 3 WS
3k = 2 WS
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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-06-22 22:58:19
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Bahamut.Khimeria said: »
That's right (just tested with 2500 tp), though noting that you only need 2250 tp with godhands/moonshade earring.

Aftermath is not affected by TP Bonus traits. You should only need AM2 to perform a 3-Step Radiance of Shijin > Smite x2. If you use initial Shijin at 3000, you should be able to 2-step radiance afterwards since you have AM3.
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 Asura.Melonlord
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By Asura.Melonlord 2020-06-25 22:38:00
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Is Counterstance worth using without Spharai? Do you mainly use it for trash or can it safely be used in content if enough PDT is packed in?
 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-06-25 22:55:00
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I don't use it at all even in 50% pdt it never feels safe lol. Get demolished by pretty much any tp move... a regular trash mob tiger in omen will do like 4k fangs and claws. ***is crazy.

Unless you're gonna have bio/wilt etc
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-06-26 00:02:07
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To be clear, Counterstance isn't worth using WITH Spharai.

I haven't found anything that I needed to counter that much where I couldn't just pop Inner Strength to survive. Just sitting in Malignance with trusts curing me is far safer method. Something like Odyssey or Omen Fodder, yeah sure It would be fine to use on, but mobs that are considered trash are not threatening to begin with, what purpose does Counterstance really serve there? Counter is only super fun with Spharai for those beefy 3k+ counters when you have a gang of monsters in your face (which is the only true use I have found for that weapon).

If you wanted to use Counterstance, you could sub BLU for cocoon or offset the defense loss somehow another way. I wish Qultada would use Gallant's roll if your defense was at a certain ratio below your attack, as that would be a useful way to handle it.
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By Valefor.Yandaime 2020-06-26 02:18:40
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Asura.Melonlord said: »
Is Counterstance worth using without Spharai? Do you mainly use it for trash or can it safely be used in content if enough PDT is packed in?

SE will need to do some tweaking before anyone comes back to Spharai for anything other than funzies imo because other weapons will outshine it even with counters factored in; Kyou is the only fight I can think of that's centered around exploiting counter and you just Malig-Hybrid and proceed to roll it's face.

Outside of that particular fight I almost never use Counterstance cuz it's just so risky.

Asura.Eiryl said: »
a regular trash mob tiger in omen will do like 4k fangs and claws. ***is crazy.

I don't think I've ever had an Omen Tiger hit me with a 4k though so I almost think he might have forgot to remove berserk? Maybe? idk, Monster pDIF adds up FAST though.
 Asura.Friedrik
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By Asura.Friedrik 2020-06-26 12:10:19
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I use counterstance on Quetz on the offchance I get to dunk charmed people. That's about it though.
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By SimonSes 2020-06-26 12:24:38
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Counterstance is golden on Alexander HTBF too.
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-06-26 13:41:37
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I have been hit by a Mandy Headbutt for 2800 in Omen. It's a Deathwish on MNK for most things.

Alexander has a very potent defense down move, and paired with Counterstance you can eat a few thousand damage quick if you're not careful.
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By SimonSes 2020-06-26 15:44:25
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
I have been hit by a Mandy Headbutt for 2800 in Omen. It's a Deathwish on MNK for most things.

Alexander has a very potent defense down move, and paired with Counterstance you can eat a few thousand damage quick if you're not careful.

Not on Normal. I was leaving Counterstance MNK few times for like 2 min afk and it was never even close to be killed. Alexander is slow and hits for like 300 damage with counterstance if I remember correctly. With 80% counter rate you get hit maybe once per 10 sec or more and most of his TP moves are magic and I dont recall Radiant Sacrament doing any high damage too.
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