The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos

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The Parthenon: A Warrior's Kyklos
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 07:57:48
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Not trying to be rude, but unless your other buff from bard and geo are super gimp, they are bad for basically all levels of content.
Hunters is doing you nothing, rogues is doing next to nothing and tact is doing slightly more than nothing (it is okay in dyna runs if you can 1 shot everything, does basically nothing in 2 shot scenario).

Your sets that I see look good. just your choice of buffs. if you are going to be using a WS frequently the king of rolls for war is sam/fighters in 99% of content. for most of the other DD for that matter as well.
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-08-29 08:02:59
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Fenrir.Kaldaek said: »
My warrior tends to only come out and play in zerg situations. I never get fighter's roll either.

Warrior tp gives -15DT -20PDT
Body has 5DA 26acc
67DA(gear)+28(gifts)+5(merits) = 100DA

ItemSet 368315



Warrior Hybrid gives -45DT -50PDT
51DA(gear)+28(gifts)+5(merits) = 84DA
(back has -5DT)

ItemSet 360783


So even in my hybrid setup I hit 100DA with fighter's roll.
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 08:23:24
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Yeah the beauty of fighters roll is you can swap extra DA for STP to get some really nice builds. on chango you can hit 3 hit builds with 100 DA. Not to mention the fact that the DA from fighters roll also applies to your WS which is nice.

The new hja gear is exremely nice for hybrid stuff. Id swap out the ammo for ginsen though.

ItemSet 367131

My only advice would be making a TP set specifically for when you have fighters roll up.

If you want to go the extra mile you can make an 11 rostam cor fighters roll tp set. and if you are nutz like me you can make a crooked 11 fighters roll set.
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By Ragnarok.Galiber 2019-08-29 09:24:05
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Spaitin said: »
as far as census "BIS". no such thing on generic TP set atm. there are a few that are really good and work well though. The one you posted is great.A number of sets are extremely close in TP gain. Swap chirichi and moonlight depending on if you feel too squishy

Cool thanks, I try not to make more than 3 tp sets + hybrid on jobs, and use the same GS comands to swap between them.

I'll consider making a specific fighters roll set or work it in the high acc (which usually considers high level buffs) and the hybrid ones.
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 09:25:57
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with my lua i have 6 TP sets that I swap between depending on weapon and buffs. then the hyrid and super turtle sets.
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-08-29 09:46:31
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I scratched out the full turtle set in favor of 3 total sets.

STP/DA/hybrid

the DA is my normal TP set and the STP will favor 11rostam


STP is a toughy though... because anything thats less difficulty ill just come on like cor for savages lol
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 10:04:00
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id replace your STP set with a fighters roll set. fighters roll sets usually resemble STP sets anyway.
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-08-29 10:04:47
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Spaitin said: »
id replace your STP set with a fighters roll set.


Is there any code written that will apply that set while buff active?
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 10:07:03
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There is, but i dont use it anymore. and i dont remember it. I have it set manually so I can toggle between 6 TP sets.
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By Ragnarok.Galiber 2019-08-29 10:08:06
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Spaitin said: »
with my lua i have 6 TP sets that I swap between depending on weapon and buffs. then the hyrid and super turtle sets.

I was doing something like that, with sets swapping depending on buffs and haste levels buuuuut.... With all the lag in dyna, and zerg variables, I found myself better off controlling everything manually, and making good, but simple sets. Usually 3 levels of Acc/Variables, a Hybrid and an Ohshi turtle set for DDs
Thanks again
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By Asura.Saevel 2019-08-29 10:20:44
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Spaitin said: »
weird. i use fighters roll ESPECIALLY in zerg situations. on helms chaos does literally nothing. Even on wave three we have found no need for chaos on war. Sam and chaos on war is equal to just sams roll. do you use a different roll on the second roll? monks roll?

If your not using chaos in dyna D then your gimping yourself. Geo frailty had a massive-75% nerf, meaning idris is only around 11% defense down. PDL raised the attack cap which in return raised the required attack by a huge amount. We need over 4x the attack as the monster's defense to be capped. Monsters have north of 2-3k defense with champions having 3k+.

Normally bolster frailty and dia renders a mobs defense so low that attack becomes really easy to cap. After that idris frailty and dia makes attack cap possible with a little consideration towards attack. Without Idris frailty we're back to pre SoA tactics of throwing as much attack as possible.

The entire 'ignore attack' mentality is 100% based on Idris frailty working at full power.
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-08-29 10:34:01
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are you guys actually seeing good DPS with axes? Seems like more nostalgic to me than actually high parse?
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 10:58:41
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Fenrir.Kaldaek said: »
are you guys actually seeing good DPS with axes? Seems like more nostalgic to me than actually high parse?
dolichenus is good. but certainly not the best option. behind stuff like GS and shining one and GA.
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 11:20:56
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Spaitin said: »
weird. i use fighters roll ESPECIALLY in zerg situations. on helms chaos does literally nothing. Even on wave three we have found no need for chaos on war. Sam and chaos on war is equal to just sams roll. do you use a different roll on the second roll? monks roll?

If your not using chaos in dyna D then your gimping yourself. Geo frailty had a massive-75% nerf, meaning idris is only around 11% defense down. PDL raised the attack cap which in return raised the required attack by a huge amount. We need over 4x the attack as the monster's defense to be capped. Monsters have north of 2-3k defense with champions having 3k+.

Normally bolster frailty and dia renders a mobs defense so low that attack becomes really easy to cap. After that idris frailty and dia makes attack cap possible with a little consideration towards attack. Without Idris frailty we're back to pre SoA tactics of throwing as much attack as possible.

The entire 'ignore attack' mentality is 100% based on Idris frailty working at full power.
gooey gerad -33% defense. box step -23% Dia III -20% geo frail -11% for a total of -87%, can swap out gooey gerard if you dont know a bast and just do ageha or armor break. They all stack which is nice. Just have to think outside of the usual mechanics and it becomes pretty easy. add light shot and it becomes even easier. You have to think about it a bit more sure. But gooey gerard also decreases enemy attack by 33% so it is pretty awesome. But you can do the same thing with just ageha or armor break. so 79% before light shots if you dont use gerard.

Lets assume the mob has 4k defense. 4000x.13 = 520 defense. pretty easy to hit 4x that. Absolutely dont need chaos roll to hit 2k attack.
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By Asura.Gesetz 2019-08-29 11:56:03
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Spaitin said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Spaitin said: »
weird. i use fighters roll ESPECIALLY in zerg situations. on helms chaos does literally nothing. Even on wave three we have found no need for chaos on war. Sam and chaos on war is equal to just sams roll. do you use a different roll on the second roll? monks roll?

If your not using chaos in dyna D then your gimping yourself. Geo frailty had a massive-75% nerf, meaning idris is only around 11% defense down. PDL raised the attack cap which in return raised the required attack by a huge amount. We need over 4x the attack as the monster's defense to be capped. Monsters have north of 2-3k defense with champions having 3k+.

Normally bolster frailty and dia renders a mobs defense so low that attack becomes really easy to cap. After that idris frailty and dia makes attack cap possible with a little consideration towards attack. Without Idris frailty we're back to pre SoA tactics of throwing as much attack as possible.

The entire 'ignore attack' mentality is 100% based on Idris frailty working at full power.
gooey gerad -33% defense. box step -23% Dia III -20% geo frail -11% for a total of -87%, can swap out gooey gerard if you dont know a bast and just do ageha or armor break. They all stack which is nice. Just have to think outside of the usual mechanics and it becomes pretty easy. add light shot and it becomes even easier. You have to think about it a bit more sure. But gooey gerard also decreases enemy attack by 33% so it is pretty awesome. But you can do the same thing with just ageha or armor break. so 79% before light shots if you use gerard.

Lets assume the mob has 4k defense. 4000x.13 = 520 defense. pretty easy to hit 4x that. Absolutely dont need chaos roll to hit 2k attack.

Do you normally do Dyna and helms with a bst, dnc, and rdm in addition to the two cors, a brd, and a geo you were already assuming?
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-08-29 12:00:31
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we normally do it with 4-6 darks that think they are tanks (no DT gear) and acouple of whm bots....

ya know... the standard setup
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By Asura.Gesetz 2019-08-29 12:13:14
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Fenrir.Kaldaek said: »
we normally do it with 4-6 darks that think they are tanks (no DT gear) and acouple of whm bots....

ya know... the standard setup

Ratri is technically DT gear, just on the opposite side of the spectrum.
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By Fenrir.Kaldaek 2019-08-29 12:14:42
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 12:21:28
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Asura.Gesetz said: »
Do you normally do Dyna and helms with a bst, dnc, and rdm in addition to the two cors, a brd, and a geo you were already assuming?


well lets seperate this into the two proper categories. Helms then Dyna.

on dyna the answer to your question is yes. I always have a dnc and a bst in my group with atleast 1 bard and rdm multiple geo and cor. Specifically because of the geo nerf. I should clarify that i find chaos mostly useless on wave three boss. It is okay on wave three trash mobs. But with a coordinated group there is no need. This is t he wrong thread, but bst is a bit of a hidden hero on dyna D. that 33.33%attack/defense is really nice. tank mobs in your TP sets. and a great pull because of how durable that pet can be. I will admit i dont do DYna as often as i used to . For me it is kind of dead content without much reason to keep doing it.


On helms the answer is you dont need RDM DNC or BST to cap attack. geo and bard do that for war. I posted the party set ups i use for most helms 1 page back.
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By Asura.Gesetz 2019-08-29 12:49:31
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Spaitin said: »
Asura.Gesetz said: »
Do you normally do Dyna and helms with a bst, dnc, and rdm in addition to the two cors, a brd, and a geo you were already assuming?


well lets seperate this into the two proper categories. Helms then Dyna.

on dyna the answer to your question is yes. I always have a dnc and a bst in my group with atleast 1 bard and rdm multiple geo and cor. Specifically because of the geo nerf. I should clarify that i find chaos mostly useless on wave three boss. It is okay on wave three trash mobs. But with a coordinated group there is no need. This is t he wrong thread, but bst is a bit of a hidden hero on dyna D. that 33.33%attack/defense is really nice. tank mobs in your TP sets. and a great pull because of how durable that pet can be. I will admit i dont do DYna as often as i used to . For me it is kind of dead content without much reason to keep doing it.


On helms the answer is you dont need RDM DNC or BST to cap attack. geo and bard do that for war.

I just don't see the logic in assuming debuffs from non-standard sources (the BST) or by using ageha/armor break (sacrificing a stronger WS) when it is much easier to swap a single roll. DNC and RDM were only mentioned to highlight how many jobs you are adding to justify not using chaos roll. As you even have said, SAM roll is the only one that is essential. Fighter's does add a lot, especially to other dds. After that, is monks/allies/rogues/tacts etc. really better than chaos when it would potentially require you to use a weaker WS to make up for it? Regardless, none of it really matters, go with what you want. As previously mentioned, just grab 6 full ratri drks and wing it like the rest of Asura.
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By Asura.Saevel 2019-08-29 13:16:50
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Asura.Gesetz said: »
I just don't see the logic in assuming debuffs from non-standard sources (the BST) or by using ageha/armor break (sacrificing a stronger WS) when it is much easier to swap a single roll.

Cause it makes his epeen bigger, harder, stronger and better then all of you mere peasants. Seriously that's a big issue in online communities because it obscures real strategies and inhibits team growth with a giant penis sign masquerading as advice.

Our group setup depends on our goals, if it's regular farming then it's something like

Magic PT (except Jeuno)
BLU
BLU
COR (leaden guy)
GEO Acumen + Barrier
RDM/WHM/SCH
BRD (scherzo is a hero, rest can be ghetto)

DD PT (this is where Warriors and this this thread is concerned)
DD
DD
COR (savage guy) (Chaos + Sam)
BRD (can be DD BRD if healer is strong)
GEO Fury + Barrier
WHM

Then the Tank pt which can be a bit random sometimes (this is where we fit members who need RP or clears on unusual jobs)

Tank (Puller)
Tank (Camp)
RDM/WHM/SCH
<Empty>
<Empty>
<Empty>

Smash's through most zones and we'll usually end after doing one or two fetters worth of Wave3.

Wave3 clear configuration swaps out the magic PT for another DD PT and fills up the tank PT with another GEO and a WHM + RDM team. RDM is mostly idle during Wave 1~2 but is a god for what they can do in Wave3. Wave3 clear also involves sloting in Dirge and focusing on extra Minni's and Madrigals. We usually can do a full wave3 zone clear with a little over 30m left on the clock, that's a good buffer for when people get really bad luck with a Corsair add or some mass death due to lag and the Geomancer champion.

As for ole boys setup, yeah he's trashing the alliance for either his personal damage or because there is BST-onry in their group. The normally accepted amount is between 12~25% defense down (Full Break is 12.5 and opens a sweet four step Radiance) and either Dia II (15%) or Dia III (20%). The geomancer has Fury and Barrier because of how ridiculously fast stuff happens and not wanting people to die, so around 30~45% defense down depending (if BLU's are aoeing they might be able to tag a Tenebral during one of their timed sequences).

Note, on Wave 1~2 champion mobs each DD will solo one with multistep SC's. Wave 3 has everyone gang up on the Champion after the adds are dead. Using the above our puller becomes suicidal and brings 5~6 statues worth of mobs at a time and starts the next pull about 10s after he brought the last one in. The entire run becomes a game of that guy trying to MPK us while we're trying to kill everything ASAP.
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By SimonSes 2019-08-29 13:43:22
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Asura.Saevel said: »
giant penis sign masquerading as advice

Epeen or not, isnt that actually a valid advice? Wouldnt BST be a better buff job than geo in dynamis? Wouldnt -33% def/attack beat Fury/Barrier? For me it looks like BST can replace GEO as buff/debuff job in party in dynamis, if that -33% def/att isnt gimped like geomancy.

Also you completely ignored DNC in his setup. I wouldnt call bringing DNC as something egoistic, if he actually doesnt forcing anyone to it. I wouldnt assume full box step lv 10 on every mob tho, but full -23% on NMs should be easy as it only takes 15sec.

So if you replace GEO with BST and bring DNC, then 33+20+13=66% should be possible on most wave 3 trash. That would still put those mobs at like 800 def tho? So you would still probably need Chaos roll on some jobs. Still concept of BST seems interesting.
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By Asura.Gesetz 2019-08-29 14:00:19
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
giant penis sign masquerading as advice

Epeen or not, isnt that actually a valid advice? Wouldnt BST be a better buff job than geo in dynamis? Wouldnt -33% def/attack beat Fury/Barrier? For me it looks like BST can replace GEO as buff/debuff job in party in dynamis, if that -33% def/att isnt gimped like geomancy.

Also you completely ignored DNC in his setup. I wouldnt call bringing DNC as something egoistic, if he actually doesnt forcing anyone to it. I wouldnt assume full box step lv 10 on every mob tho, but full -23% on NMs should be easy as it only takes 15sec.

So if you replace GEO with BST and bring DNC, then 33+20+13=66% should be possible on most wave 3 trash. That would still put those mobs at like 800 def tho? So you would still probably need Chaos roll on some jobs. Still concept of BST seems interesting.

Slot a DNC in one of the 4 DD slots that Saevel lists, nothing needs to drop for that. Saevel also lists BLU. Tenebral Crush for 20% def down or Tourbillion for 33% when MG isn't needed or during unbridled wisdom use.

BST may be an interesting idea, but the debuff doesn't add anything not already provided for by Saevel's setup.
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 14:51:28
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
giant penis sign masquerading as advice

Epeen or not, isnt that actually a valid advice? Wouldnt BST be a better buff job than geo in dynamis? Wouldnt -33% def/attack beat Fury/Barrier? For me it looks like BST can replace GEO as buff/debuff job in party in dynamis, if that -33% def/att isnt gimped like geomancy.

Also you completely ignored DNC in his setup. I wouldnt call bringing DNC as something egoistic, if he actually doesnt forcing anyone to it. I wouldnt assume full box step lv 10 on every mob tho, but full -23% on NMs should be easy as it only takes 15sec.

So if you replace GEO with BST and bring DNC, then 33+20+13=66% should be possible on most wave 3 trash. That would still put those mobs at like 800 def tho? So you would still probably need Chaos roll on some jobs. Still concept of BST seems interesting.
1 bst can actually replace a geo since it has better attack down and defense down. saevel just runs into his weird narcissism that he believes his strat is the only strat. basically the same build as his is the most common strat. just add a bst into the empty slot and a dnc. bst makes a really good puller with gerard and AOE debuff. not saying bst is the ONLY job to swap in. just the one we use. saevel just cant count and didnt realize his own strategy doesnt even require chaos roll. Just ad a dnc to his empty slots and you have the same thing with no need for chaos. His strat works just fine. My strat also works for all clears in all zones.

Ironically with saevels 4 step talk he is directly contradicting his weird talk about not being able to do SC damage he goes on a rant about every few months for the boss. has two in the last 30 pages.

I would like to know his logic on how it trashes the party dps to add 2 jobs in what he describes as empty slots. That would be great.

Its this simple with Saevel, if you suggest something he didnt think of he will go on some weird rant. Read back through all the pages. If you suggest something a bit outside of the box and it sucks for some reason only he understands. He usually ends up being wrong as well. Just seems to have giant insecurities. He used to give pretty good advice between his rants. But now even that is gone.
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By SimonSes 2019-08-29 14:58:26
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Asura.Gesetz said: »
Slot a DNC in one of the 4 DD slots that Saevel lists, nothing needs to drop for that. Saevel also lists BLU. Tenebral Crush for 20% def down or Tourbillion for 33% when MG isn't needed or during unbridled wisdom use.

BST may be an interesting idea, but the debuff doesn't add anything not already provided for by Saevel's setup

How is forcing someone to come BLU for Tenebral Crush different than bring BST for AoE. Seriously.

Also Im not even sure if BLU can land def down with Tenebral on wave 3. Its dark based spell. In theory def down isnt usually dark based debuff, but I have a feeling that when applied by dark spell vs mobs resisting dark, the additional effect might be resisted too.

Also the thing is BST seems to be a good alternative for GEO and Saevel just shitted at that idea without any reason other than personal issues with Spaitin.
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 14:59:37
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Gesetz said: »
Slot a DNC in one of the 4 DD slots that Saevel lists, nothing needs to drop for that. Saevel also lists BLU. Tenebral Crush for 20% def down or Tourbillion for 33% when MG isn't needed or during unbridled wisdom use.

BST may be an interesting idea, but the debuff doesn't add anything not already provided for by Saevel's setup

How is forcing someone to come BLU for Tenebral Crush different than bring BST for AoE. Seriously.

Also Im not even sure if BLU can land def down with Tenebral on wave 3. Its dark based spell. In theory def down isnt usually dark based debuff, but I have a feeling that when applied by dark spell vs mobs resisting dark, the additional effect might be resisted too.

Also the thing is BST seems to be a good alternative for GEO and Saevel just shitted at that idea without any reason other than personal issues with Spaitin.
I offended him awhile ago and now he gets super emotional when i post things. Cracks me up lol. I present a pretty obvious alternative he didnt think of and now he is super interested in my penis. He has some strong hidden feelings. I find it flattering. He once was mad that i didnt have as many posts as him. The wierdest argument ever.


Asura.Saevel said: »
No, it's not stored inside ffxiah and I already told you want it is.

Your just trying to find a use for something new on a thread that was started by someone who thought they *discovered* something new. When you get past 1K posts, or come back with your real account, then we'll take you seriously.


THat was his arguement..... not enough posts. I dont think he realizes you dont gain exp for posting lol. Now he is going to dig through all the threads and find me misspelling stuff to make himself feel better.
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By Asura.Eiryl 2019-08-29 15:01:14
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That's saevel all the time with everyone and everything that he can't take credit for.
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By Asura.Gesetz 2019-08-29 15:06:26
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SimonSes said: »
Asura.Gesetz said: »
Slot a DNC in one of the 4 DD slots that Saevel lists, nothing needs to drop for that. Saevel also lists BLU. Tenebral Crush for 20% def down or Tourbillion for 33% when MG isn't needed or during unbridled wisdom use.

BST may be an interesting idea, but the debuff doesn't add anything not already provided for by Saevel's setup

How is forcing someone to come BLU for Tenebral Crush different than bring BST for AoE. Seriously.

Also Im not even sure if BLU can land def down with Tenebral on wave 3. Its dark based spell. In theory def down isnt usually dark based debuff, but I have a feeling that when applied by dark spell vs mobs resisting dark, the additional effect might be resisted too.

Also the thing is BST seems to be a good alternative for GEO and Saevel just shitted at that idea without any reason other than personal issues with Spaitin.

BLU is a better dd than BST. That is the difference.

The debuff from blu spells, as far as I know, have their own m.acc check. Resisting the dmg from tenebral won't also resist the debuff, which is wind based.
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By Spaitin 2019-08-29 15:09:24
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Asura.Gesetz said: »
SimonSes said: »
Asura.Gesetz said: »
Slot a DNC in one of the 4 DD slots that Saevel lists, nothing needs to drop for that. Saevel also lists BLU. Tenebral Crush for 20% def down or Tourbillion for 33% when MG isn't needed or during unbridled wisdom use.

BST may be an interesting idea, but the debuff doesn't add anything not already provided for by Saevel's setup

How is forcing someone to come BLU for Tenebral Crush different than bring BST for AoE. Seriously.

Also Im not even sure if BLU can land def down with Tenebral on wave 3. Its dark based spell. In theory def down isnt usually dark based debuff, but I have a feeling that when applied by dark spell vs mobs resisting dark, the additional effect might be resisted too.

Also the thing is BST seems to be a good alternative for GEO and Saevel just shitted at that idea without any reason other than personal issues with Spaitin.

BLU is a better dd than BST. That is the difference.

The debuff from blu spells, as far as I know, have their own m.acc check. Resisting the dmg from tenebral won't also resist the debuff, which is wind based.
bst goes in an extra slot and is a puller, not a DD. its AOE lands better on wave three. that pet is quite durable. BLu works great too. BST i would say is better DPS on waves 1-2 though with cursed sphere. IT works really good. I would also mention that decimation bst is now a thing and not bad at all. TP is a touch slow but decimation on bst still hits 35k+
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