Nashira Turban Vs Elite Beret

Pretty much. 15 > 6 > 5 > 4. AF2+1 would be a bit more accurate than NQ for MND enfeebles if you're lucky enough to have one.

Pchan being banned made me smile when I noticed it while searching.

It was one of my first, as I registered last April and that post was 26th of May, so probably in my first 100. Back when I didn't do melee maths and there was still a standard/advanced section.

If you don't get them you won't be able to land enfeebles on anything out of your tier man!

Seriously though, I would like to say it was a noticeable increase but my sample size without them is nowhere near significant and of course I would be LOOKING for an increase. I do believe they are incredibly useful. Normally I wouldn't see why not remitting Enfeebling Magic made any sense, but you have BLM and BLU <_> complicating things.

Just a little >_< Demeriting blue magic was always out of the question, but I'm even more firm on that position now that we have an idea of how the blue magic pDIF function works. There's no way I'm dropping two damage tiers and 16 attack for physical spells, much less the macc for debuffs/nukes. My blue attack is low enough even with those merits... Elemental merits are more open to change but they'd be useful for both BLM and RDM, so I'm inclined to think I'd lose more than I gain in that swap.

Enfeebling merits is like sticking an AF body in your boxers; it helps a lot with the ladies :P

But seriously, enfeebling merits was the first thing I caped and RDM was my first jobs. So I can honestly say I never did any end game without 8/8 merits so I can't really comment about how thins are with out them

But the best analogy I can come up with is; when other RDM are happy using errant body etc for their MND build you will be stuck using AF (or suffering a lower land rate). Outside of soloing and maybe sleeping Wyrms, there isn't much need for an amazing sleep/bind set (although they obviously help).

So you might struggle soloing, you won't be as potent a de-buffer and you might die occupationally from a resisted sleep. It all comes down to how seriously you want to take RDM.

IMO you need enfeebling merits for BLM, as there are a few places where BLM will struggle (with or without merits) to sleep, bind, grav stuff (my BLM was normally for Sea and Limbus in lowman runs). But again if you only take BLM to big alliance events then some one else will be able to cover you

Edit: ninja'd.

Well it all comes down to what you use RDM and BLM for. Enfeebling is the one they both use the most, but only if your BLM has to cast enfeebles (which isn't always the case in big events)

Don't forget Crimson/Blood Mask for 10/11 Skill, albeit with Dragon Affinity.

In part that does fall into the "it depends" category as well. Depends on your gear, depends on the mob in question, and so on.

You're not crippled without them, but they certainly don't hurt, and at worst allow you to more readily drop skill/MAcc gear out for MND gear on Para/Slow or things of that sort.

No i'm not comparing it to blu magic lol
I'm going off of this

"wiki"
"Enfeebling Magic skill is the skill base from which Enfeebling Magic derives. It is most synonymous and most importantly relational to the resistance rate of all attack spells therein. In short, Enfeebling Magic Skill is the largest factor which determines if an Enfeebling Magic Spell is resisted or not. The skill also helps defend against spell interruptions for any spells in its category."

"Raising Magic Accuracy directly increases the chance that a spell will land on the target without resistance. However, the potency of the spell (e.g. the potency of paralyze or duration of another status effect spell) is not affected by simply raising Magic Accuracy."

"Paralyze:Spell accuracy (the chance of the spell successfully paralyzing the enemy) is primarily affected by Enfeebling Magic Skill and Magic Accuracy. Potency (the chance for each enemy's attack to become paralyzed) of this spell is primarily affected by MND"

This is what makes me believe my theory and I believe its is similar to how Enhancing magic works w Stoneskin.

This is the part that concerns me most. While I'm also considering leveling it as a utility job, the biggest reason I'm interested in RDM is for solo purposes. I'm not going for the zomg epeen soloist look I killed x y and z all by myself angle, but I'd like to be able to get more done when I can't or would rather not rely on others. If lack of enfeebling merits severely impairs my ability to solo/lowman for myself, friends, and potentially for profit, that's going to be an issue that warrants evaluating 1) if I need to remerit and 2) if RDM would even be worthwhile if I choose not to remerit. I've no intention of playing more than 3-5 jobs at 99 or even 75; I'd rather contribute as much as possible rather than bring jobs that I can't pump general category merits into.
>_<
This is completely up in the air at the moment. I've been running with a bodies shell of late, but I recently picked up a pearl to a smaller group so what I do and how I do it has the potential to change drastically if I decide to drop my old shell completely and commit to the new one. If enfeebling merits end up being a lifesaver for the group as opposed to a bonus (which is essentially what ele merits are), I'd remerit without hesitation. Just trying to get a feel for how that might play out beforehand.

/sigh... why can't they up magic merits to 20 so I can at least go 8/6/6 :(

I suspect we'll see higher merit caps with the level cap increase...but obviously, if we're getting ~100 or so skill added, merits will add relatively less. Plus we may see some stronger gear to boot.

IMO, just take what you have and try it. The standard level of gear is higher now, sure, but that doesn't mean that the only RDMs that can stick spells anymore are those of us with Relic +1 n' full merits. If you're talking Limbus or something, then a lot of that is pretty low level anyway.

16 macc will still be 8% to land rate, though if you're talking about how often the merits would be applicable then I agree.
Limbus, SCNM, VNM, ZNM, miscellaneous NMs, Salvage, maybe one or two sea NMs, potentially some new NMs with the coming updates, and probably something else I didn't think of. I'm aware the raised level cap will probably makes some of these manageable to the point where I could wait a few months and go BLU, BLM, or DRG, but I doubt solo RDM will be useless in the future so it still has long-term value in addition to its uses in group play.

And Magic Accuracy = Enfeebling Magic Skill. That paragraph also states that Magic Accuracy does increase spell accuracy. No mention of tiers or anything.

The bit you yourself bolded defeats your theory <_< it implies that Magic Accuracy and Enfeebling Magic skill achieve the same thing: accuracy. It makes no difference between their effects.

Lmao I'm using the word tiers so you can understanding what i'm talking about this my termanology lol not something quoted...I'm not saying 1 enfb skll does not give 1 macc i'm saying it gives you 1 macc and it also helps you land enfbles on mobs that would of resisted w/o the added skill...and what i bolded does not defeat my theory because if they were the same there would no use for both it would be either or...so believe what you want...there isn't really any clear info proving me right or wrong its all theorys and imo my theory seems to be correct unless some one know the creator of the game and is willing to ask him o.o

That might be the most fallacious post I've yet seen on these forums.

Opinions are like *** every body has 1.

5 > 4 is an opinion?

Absence of evidence is evidence in itself. I know of no evidence that skill works as you have described. Given the immense amount of data collected over the years with varying amounts of each stat with no oddities suggesting that enfeebling magic skill does anything beyond provide 1 macc... I'm of the opinion that you should take your trolling elsewhere and let the facts speak for themselves.

Take AV's item, the Aureole for instance. Is it more useful if it has 8 Enfeebling Magic Skill or 8 Magic Accuracy? The answer is obviously the latter as the former is like saying Enfeebling Magic: +8 Magic Accuracy. The point of having both is that Magic Accuracy is not as specific and therefore more widely usable (see Omega Ring for Enfeebling/Elemental Magic/Dark Magic etc).

Could somebody who is very bored take (job without enfeebling magic skill)/RDM6 or so out to sea and land a Paralyze/Bind/Anything on one of the fishies please? They won't attack you back and the recast is so short, it wouldn't take long to land one.

Screenshot immediately after you land the enfeeble an action which can only be performed by your job 38+ (eg Rampart on PLD/RDM). This will completely disprove your theory (I'd do it myself if I was activated).

I can do it BLU/mage in a bit... if that's not sufficient evidence either somebody else would need to do this or I need to get 3 levels on DRK and hit up a SMN burn so I can 75BLU/20DRK and Bind one.

Big words for "He's reading too much into it and getting it horribly wrong"

Kalico, the snippets you quote are written by people who understand should understand how magic accuracy works (I hope) but have summarised the theory into 2 lines.

Enfeebling skill is more important in the sense that items offering skill are rarer and offer bigger (normally) than the macc equivalent in most slots where skill is available (head, body, neck, ear, back), but that doesn't mean 1 skill is better than 1 macc, just that more skill is better than less macc (bigger number = better).

So the bits you are reading are basically written to explain to people who don't understand all the test, how to gear. If you want to look into it deeper then you need to read more than 1-2 lines on wiki. If you want links to the testing/data I would be happy to find it.

Wasn't even talking about his mis-analysis at that point...safeface.jpg
Like maybe whichever you can get more of in that slot?
the numbers perhaps?
Scientific method anyone?
I believe the sky is made of a bunch of beans glued together and painted purple. In my opinion, this is correct.
WE KNOW NOTHING

But yes, you're reading way too much into the phrasing there.

@Nightfyre

I didn't mean to scare you, as I said, I have never played RDM out of exp with less than 8/8 so I am not the best person to advise. But I was theorising about what could happen, how often you would see a resist and against what mobs is not something I can say. Just 16 skill is a lot, so I assume there will be an impact somewhere, but not necessarily insurmountable.

I know some RDM that have soloed sky NMs without Relic head (using wise or something) and do fine, which is a similar drop in skill.

Not really scared, was just a bit concerned that it might turn out to be a waste of time. Sounds like I should be ok though... and hey, if it's an issue it would also make a convenient excuse to play BLM less!

Had a better idea concerning the /mage testing: 18MNK/9RDM. Results... sometime this afternoon if somebody doesn't beat me to it XD

Don't waste your time on this guy.

Only reason I would've thought a 75 would be more convenient is if you have to rest before it lands (which is likely at 8MP a cast at lower levels if you get an "average" land rate) due to lack of MP pool.

I did a lot of Sky solo without AF2 hat AND without merits to begin with and it was very painful compared to nowadays. If you can straight tank the mob for a decent amount of time it's not too awful, but on something like Faust... difference is VERY important.

I see this topic has gotten epic since i've last checked it...
/popcorneating.

Sure where are the links...showing enfbling skill only add macc and has no other effect.....

@ night you really should get a job and not play so much you seem to get extremely butt hurt when some one has a different opinion than you thats signs of way too much gaming.

Real life card

SHUT

EVERYTHING

DOWN

Lmao thats not RL card.....thats just a mere observation

Also progression of a RDM gear thread (for some reason) ...

1. Person asks legitimate question
2. People answer question
3. One person answers question incorrectly
4. People explain why person in part 3 is incorrect using theory
5. This person goes on to explain they have their own theory and the proven theories with extensive testing are completely wrong despite having no evidence of their own
6. Try to argue with this person
7. = brick wall

Add rl card or gear/game achievement insults as appropriate to finish.

I think he forgets that when proposing a new theory, it's up to him to prove it's right; not us to prove it's wrong.

Wat

Where are you pulling this tier nonsense from?