Does holding the add near the boss buff the boss in some way? Our damage on Kalunga was very low tonight, and someone floated the idea that maybe the boss gets buffed if add is close in a reverse of the add getting buffed if the add is far.
It's certainly possible it's something else, like the geo not using Idris or something, but we want to cover all our bases.
Odyssey R25 Confirmed ATM Now Maybe 30?...
Odyssey R25 Confirmed ATM Now Maybe 30?...
So I have a bit more info to add about the tier 3 nms.
First off, it appears the fight is literally the Veng 15 NM with an add. The stats on the main NM have not increased beyond what we've previously seen. We gave Xevioso an attempt and took him down to 18% pretty easily mostly ignoring the add, but then people died to some TP moves and things went south really fast. We tried again with a dual team setup "A team to kill and B team to soften it up" and chunked it down to 76% with 525k damage on the first attempt, and that math puts him smack dab at 2.3 mil, just like veng 15. The nm itself also felt identical to veng 15. I've fought this guy countless times and I know how he damage numbers look on him with various buffs, and I can say with 90% certainty that his other stats have not changed either.
Second...going in with a two team strategy is probably a bad idea. Xevioso spawned his aura twice with us on our B team jobs, and that complicated the fight when we went back in. he used his aura THREE more times, and the aura strengthening is cumulative. By the 4th and finally 5th aura it took too many crits to proc blue and we couldn't drop it anymore, so we ultimately wiped. Used moogle amp for both halfs of the fight and got 1500+ RP both times though, so 3k rank points topward our ikengas stuff. That's a plus.
The clear hint is that you just wanna assemble a team that's capable of dealing with the veng 20 fight and kill it in one single go. The nm itself is not any more challenging as far as we can see, it just has an extra mechanic. The regen is also not THAT significant. We measured it to be approximately 1% of the main Nm's HP every 30 seconds. It's possible it scales upward when the nm has lower HP, but even then it doesn't appear to be much of a difference. The tier 2 nm's had vastly stronger regen potencies than the tier 3 Nms do.
Also I can confirm the adds on veng 20 appear to have the same amount of HP as the boss themselves. They're massive hp sponges so killing them is a waste of time. And with the regen on tier 3 being so weak you're best off finding a way to contain them while just going to town on the big guy.
Other notes. We also tried ongo V 20 and a red mage had zero issues controlling the tulfaire add. Our cor was a pickup and did some very silly stuff (wasted resets and died multiple times) and it was a very unoptimal rotation because of it and we still took it down to about 54%. With a proper effort this fight looks very winnable. It's still Ongo though, but at least the regen potency isn't enough to be too much of a factor. Also based on the damage we dealt as far as I can tell his max HP is the same as veng 15 as well. Further supporting the idea that V 20 is just "V 15 NM with add attatched and a fairly weak regen on the main boss"
First off, it appears the fight is literally the Veng 15 NM with an add. The stats on the main NM have not increased beyond what we've previously seen. We gave Xevioso an attempt and took him down to 18% pretty easily mostly ignoring the add, but then people died to some TP moves and things went south really fast. We tried again with a dual team setup "A team to kill and B team to soften it up" and chunked it down to 76% with 525k damage on the first attempt, and that math puts him smack dab at 2.3 mil, just like veng 15. The nm itself also felt identical to veng 15. I've fought this guy countless times and I know how he damage numbers look on him with various buffs, and I can say with 90% certainty that his other stats have not changed either.
Second...going in with a two team strategy is probably a bad idea. Xevioso spawned his aura twice with us on our B team jobs, and that complicated the fight when we went back in. he used his aura THREE more times, and the aura strengthening is cumulative. By the 4th and finally 5th aura it took too many crits to proc blue and we couldn't drop it anymore, so we ultimately wiped. Used moogle amp for both halfs of the fight and got 1500+ RP both times though, so 3k rank points topward our ikengas stuff. That's a plus.
The clear hint is that you just wanna assemble a team that's capable of dealing with the veng 20 fight and kill it in one single go. The nm itself is not any more challenging as far as we can see, it just has an extra mechanic. The regen is also not THAT significant. We measured it to be approximately 1% of the main Nm's HP every 30 seconds. It's possible it scales upward when the nm has lower HP, but even then it doesn't appear to be much of a difference. The tier 2 nm's had vastly stronger regen potencies than the tier 3 Nms do.
Also I can confirm the adds on veng 20 appear to have the same amount of HP as the boss themselves. They're massive hp sponges so killing them is a waste of time. And with the regen on tier 3 being so weak you're best off finding a way to contain them while just going to town on the big guy.
Other notes. We also tried ongo V 20 and a red mage had zero issues controlling the tulfaire add. Our cor was a pickup and did some very silly stuff (wasted resets and died multiple times) and it was a very unoptimal rotation because of it and we still took it down to about 54%. With a proper effort this fight looks very winnable. It's still Ongo though, but at least the regen potency isn't enough to be too much of a factor. Also based on the damage we dealt as far as I can tell his max HP is the same as veng 15 as well. Further supporting the idea that V 20 is just "V 15 NM with add attatched and a fairly weak regen on the main boss"
[+]
Fenrir.Melphina said: »
I've fought this guy countless times and I know how he damage numbers look on him with various buffs, and I can say with 90% certainty that his other stats have not changed either.
Interesting thing I noticed but hadn't seen mentioned is that Veng+20 bosses possess a version of all three mechanics that Sheol ABC NMs have
Sheol A NMs use a geomancy debuff aura (attack down, etc)
Sheol B NMs spawn two copies of themselves
Sheol C NMs ignore the #1 person on the hate list and attacks the #2
Also the Fetters/Halos in every zone that lead up to the bosses, which T3s and Bumba have access to. All of the mechanics were right there the whole time, and I personally never put it together. Kind of neat way to tie it all together
Sheol A NMs use a geomancy debuff aura (attack down, etc)
Sheol B NMs spawn two copies of themselves
Sheol C NMs ignore the #1 person on the hate list and attacks the #2
Also the Fetters/Halos in every zone that lead up to the bosses, which T3s and Bumba have access to. All of the mechanics were right there the whole time, and I personally never put it together. Kind of neat way to tie it all together
[+]
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Interesting thing I noticed but hadn't seen mentioned is that Veng+20 bosses possess a version of all three mechanics that Sheol ABC NMs have
Sheol A NMs use a geomancy debuff aura (attack down, etc)
Sheol B NMs spawn two copies of themselves
Sheol C NMs ignore the #1 person on the hate list and attacks the #2
Also the Fetters/Halos in every zone that lead up to the bosses, which T3s and Bumba have access to. All of the mechanics were right there the whole time, and I personally never put it together. Kind of neat way to tie it all together
Sheol A NMs use a geomancy debuff aura (attack down, etc)
Sheol B NMs spawn two copies of themselves
Sheol C NMs ignore the #1 person on the hate list and attacks the #2
Also the Fetters/Halos in every zone that lead up to the bosses, which T3s and Bumba have access to. All of the mechanics were right there the whole time, and I personally never put it together. Kind of neat way to tie it all together
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Veng+20 bosses possess a version of all three mechanics
They are identical mechanics, just watered down.
The Sheol A mechanic (aura list) is reduced
The Sheol B mechanic (copies) is reduced from 2 to 1, and it's not an exact copy, but its the same bestiary family. Imagine fighting 3 Mbozes. Also, the adds give the boss a Regen buff, which is a skimmed down version of what Sheol B NM adds do for NMs.
The Sheol C mechanic appears when the boss SPs, which is the same as the Atonement 3 NMs. The hate of the main target is reset.
So we've cleared all the T3s and have been trying for Bumba. We haven't actually used Rdm at all, so maybe people may find this useful. It's a lot of text though, so yeah.
To recap T3 stuff:
Our general strats for the V20 T3s really haven't differed much from the usual strats you'd see for V15; however, we basically included some defensive buffs (mainly a Minne or two) on the backline and made sure to keep the add debuffed with what we had available (Elegy, Slow, Para, Bio) and just let it whack whoever. I can't remember all the specific songs as I wasn't Brd, but our dear sweet Reain told me he'd list the songs specifically; maybe he'll make an appearance here soon. >;) Our general thought process on songs though was to be more defensive on the backline than usual and only add in defensive songs on DD when we felt it necessary to survive.
Also just wanted to add that we have a truly excellent Whm in our group who really saves our *** a lot on the regular with these fights, so we may be a little lucky in that regard!
These are some quick briefs on each T3:
Kalunga
Whm/Run/War/Brd/Cor/Drk
Pretty typical strat. Run tanks, debuff the add and just let it hit whoever; it seems to consistently go after whoever was second on the hate list as it stayed up with the DD. Before changing to Drk, I did try Drg because Drg Naegling with Angon/Fly High eats Kalunga alive, especially on V15, but I found it more of a pain keeping my wyvern alive on V20 due to mata's AoE autos and changed to Drk for more simplicity. Soul Enslave is quite nice to prevent TP moves from firing too for a bit post 25%. The Bio II from Drk on the add was a nice plus. Overall, not too bad of a fight and somewhat fast.
Arebati
Sch/Run/Rng/Cor/Brd/Geo
Standard V15 strat, except we used Indi-Barrier and saved Bolster at 75% as well to help keep the backline safer. Our Brd did give the Geo/Sch/Brd a Minne or two as well; I'm sorry I can't remember specifics here. Combined with a good Regen/Embrava, the pig wasn't much of a threat as it pounded the backline although they did need an occasional cure. We found the regen on this one to be particularly awful and really dragged the fight on. Having a strong Rng/Cor seems rather key to help end the fight afap. Ideally take down the aura, but I don't believe we did on ours. However, it did have MDB- aura, which seemed to really rock our Run. I had to work my *** off overtime to keep the Run alive post 50%, and our Run is quite strong. Tank needs Panas, a lot of them. Time was crunched a bit due to the regen.
Xevioooosa, not Xevioso
Whm/Sch/Sam/War/Cor/Brd
This one wasn't so bad; we found we really like double healer on this one for V15 and it seemed to work well on V20 too. Brd did standard DD songs with Wind Carol and I believe Scherzo on the Sam/War to help with any random one-shots. In addition to March/Ballad, he did some Minnes on the backline to help with the Chapuli randomly hitting us. Chapuli hate seems pretty random, so to help cover the Whm; I did some AoE Blink/SS and Aquaveil as Sch to help prevent any random spell interrupts. Sch is basically there to help cover the Whm while also providing Regen/Embrava/random cures/enmity buffs etc. After making sure the backline was defensive, the fight was pretty standard and cleared with plenty of time.
Ngai
Whm/Cor/Brd/Blu/Mnk/War
As usual, we didn't stray much from our standard set up on this. Be sure to use Scherzo on DD. Our Blu opened with AoE MG and then AoE Barrier Tusk when reset. If further resets, would AoE Nature's Med provided the aura was not Att down (Nature's Med won't work otherwise). Blu would also assist with possible AoE cures when necessary to help cover Whm. I don't recall precisely how the add's hate was, but it definitely went after the backline eventually so you'll want to help buff the backline with a Minne or two. Our cor Tact'd the backline to help assist with auras like usual. Thinking about it now though, it'd probably be nice to Gallant's roll the backline as well for further protection. Overall wasn't too bad, but during our clear a couple of our DD did die right near the end and our Blu just solo'd it down with help from the Whm.
Mboze
Whm/Cor/Brd/Blu/Bst/Drk
Standard strat of no TPing; however, be sure to buff the backline with a couple Minnes. To help combat the regen, our Brd/Cor/Bst would occasionally run in to Savage; Icarus wings are nice for free dmg. Since it's so unlikely to TP from 100% -> 75%, this is a good time to try to get extra dmg from the non-drk. You could potentially TP off the add to help with this, but I don't think we ended up doing so. It is a race against the clock somewhat, so you'll want to be rather aggressive on Drk and be sure to make good use of Scarlet and Armor Break. You will need to reapply Armor Break mid-way so be sure to do so and be sure to keep Wind Thren up to help ensure it lands. I've grown pretty accustomed to being the Drk on Mboze and a couple things that might help others that I've found I really like to do are...
--Turn around, take off Cureskin, Scarlet in 0 armor and hope the Tree does one of its physical auto attacks (it seems like 2/3 are physical while one is magical? You'll want an attack where it whips you basically; the magical auto attack is quite weak). This consistently results in a heavy hit but has never killed, allowing for a huge Scarlet boost. Coordinate with your Whm so they don't Cureskin you right before the hit and are ready to cure you afterwards. I haven't tried any Dmg+% gear myself yet; I think it might get a little too risky then. It's safe to do this tactic on Mboze with LR up.
--I like to DS/NV Absorb-Vit at the start to help push dmg, but then I'll try to land Absorb-Agi (and other Absorbs during Invince). If a reset gets DS (and NV), I've found I really like doing Absorb-Agi to give us a greater safeguard from TP attacks. Post 50%, I prioritize that DS/NV Absorb-Agi is up and then go for Absorb-Vit with possible resets of DS. Judging from Soul Enslavement tp drains on auto hits, I've noticed the dAgi bonus from DS/NV Absorb-Agi seems to be about 9 tp fed less per hit (can't speak to its potency with Lib, but might be especially worth doing after reapplying Armor Break if you have it).
Normally we run a Scherzo on Drk jic a non-Timber TP move does fire off, but we eventually settled on an extra Minuet and just banked on no TP moves. Might be interesting to try an Agi Etude in place though, especially if you don't have Dagon or Father Time Path B. Try to keep Bio II on the add as well, a good time to apply could be during Invince.
Ongo
Sch/Cor/Brd/Geo/Blm/Run
Same deal, we did a standard Ongo but gave some Minnes to the backline to help deal with the Tulfaire, which was bouncing among the backline. The Bird is mostly harmless as long as defensive buffs/gear/debuffs are present. As Sch, be sure to make sure to keep up AoE Aquaveil to help ensure no spells are cucked by the Tulfaire. If you do get into danger on the backline, turtle up, cure or vile elixir if you have to. This one was surprising to us. We did first try going on Earthsday for the additional dmg and managed to get it to less than 10% a couple times, largely due to some scuffed SCs and lack of resets. We did give it a shot on Watersday though and won np with a few minutes to spare. I don't believe we had a 5/6 WC either, but we did have some good Rayke resets and our SCs weren't scuffed (Sch makes Grav, Run Steel Cyclones, Cor closes with WF; the Cor and Run would SC together if strats were down).
Side note: our Blm was using Raetic +1 and helped supplement MP at times with Coalition Ethers.
And then Bumba...
This thing just sucks ***. We did about 8~ attempts on it before getting tired; we're gonna shoot to try again tomorrow. There appears to be an absolute boatload of RNG involved and can't be simply steamrolled like on V15 (although some runs we kind of were steamrolling it still...? More on that.)
A few notes:
--It only appears to have 3 possible 2hrs it can use at V20, we only saw the following:
Yaega
Brazen
PD
-Yaega obv sucks ***. We saw this one the most, followed by Brazen, and only one PD out of our several attempts; RNG is RNG tho. Odds seem tho you aren't going to get the "good" 2hr. Bumba's 2hr does not appear to be linked to the type of add it spawns.
--It only seems capable of spawning 3 types of adds, we only saw one of the following:
Chapuli
Matamata
Craklaw
-The Mata appeared to stay on the second person with hate, so it'd stay up with the DDs for us. The Chapuli and Craklaw appeared to have erratic hate though.
--Important!-- Unsurprisingly, it seems you WILL have to deal with fetters at some point, often around 50% or later. There wasn't nearly as much time to just kill it without worrying about fetters like on V15 (maybe about 2min roughly from pull on V20. It seemed to vary though for us; there might be other factors at play).
-Around post 50%, be ready for it to summon fetters if it hasn't already. At times though, there would just be one wave of fetters and they would go away for a while without us hitting any procs. It was pretty strange. Eventually though there would be fetters that would have a prolonged stay where you would need to try to proc it properly.
--All DD should bring several Panas at least to help the Whm. We noticed the fetters seemed to inflict an Att down effect that would bring your Att to 1 (believe this was present at V15 too), along with other parameter reductions (or maybe they're from a TP move from Bumba during fetters, really not sure); just bring Panas and use em, especially after Fetters.
-Denounce sucks, not really sure what causes it. It seems to use either Chastise or Denounce when fetters pop, so sometimes you won't see Denounce, at least not right away.
--Important!!-- SOMETHING appears capable of wiping RR, so try to be prepared for that. Not really sure what it is. Thought it was Denounce but doesn't seem to be. If you aren't ready though, it is possible to wipe with no RR, which happened to us on a run.
-One time after a wipe, I got up from Arise and my Reraise effect was immediately removed. Someone in our group said Bumba appeared to roar upon one of us getting back up, so maybe that triggered it? I wasn't looking at Bumba at the time, so totally unsure. At the time, Bumba was completely idle.
Party Setup:
Started with: War/Drg/Brd/Cor/Whm/Blu.
Then tried: War/Drg/Brd/Cor/Whm/Run
Settled on: War/Drg/Brd/Cor/Whm/Geo.
We basically tried to emulate a more defensive standard V15 setup and just kill it fast with brute force. It... kind of worked. You'll likely want a set up with more finesse if you're aiming for a consistent clear.
Buffs we settled on:
-Food: Everyone ate Miso Ramen.
-Songs: SV/CC Honor/Minuetx3/Madrigal
-Rolls: Crooked Chaos + Sam
-Geo: Indi-Attunement + Geo-Fury, entrust Barrier/Str
When it comes to the traditional melee set up, the main issue we found with this fight is RNG regarding the fetters, specifically when it would use Denounce with the Fetters. Some runs, we would just be steamrolling it well past 50% and even past 25%. Eventually they would spawn and the results would be a mixed bag. Sometimes we could survive them without issue (Bolster Attunement appeared to help quite a bit). Other times, Bumba would use Denounce with the fetters, cutting our HP by 90% and then fetters would clean us up (with gear/buffs though, some of us could survive this combo still; again the swap to Geo helped a ton). The MEva- aura (and I'd imagine MDB- aura) really sucked though for this kind of strat however.
A couple oddities/reaching theories:
LASTLY, a Tale of Woe:
We strongly think a typical melee set up could work on Bumba V20 (with some defensive adjustments in gear/food/geo buffs), as we did get close a few times out of 8~ runs/attempts, and ONE TIME we absolutely would have won BUT the Matamata add decided to use Debilitating Spout literally when Bumba was at 7% and it hit all of the melee (full dispel and zombie). It was the only TP move it used during the fight, completely caught us off guard, and we honestly think it was pure RNG that it just so happened to use its worst move at truly the worst time. It did not appear to be scripted. We even actually survived (minus the Cor), but simply couldn't rebuff properly to finish it off; it was truly one of the worst feelings we've had in recent years playing FFXI. Next time, we'd just account for this possibility and have the DD who has the Mata's attention go to the other side of Bumba or something, just keep it not facing all the other DD.
Possible setups/jobs to try:
To recap T3 stuff:
Our general strats for the V20 T3s really haven't differed much from the usual strats you'd see for V15; however, we basically included some defensive buffs (mainly a Minne or two) on the backline and made sure to keep the add debuffed with what we had available (Elegy, Slow, Para, Bio) and just let it whack whoever. I can't remember all the specific songs as I wasn't Brd, but our dear sweet Reain told me he'd list the songs specifically; maybe he'll make an appearance here soon. >;) Our general thought process on songs though was to be more defensive on the backline than usual and only add in defensive songs on DD when we felt it necessary to survive.
Also just wanted to add that we have a truly excellent Whm in our group who really saves our *** a lot on the regular with these fights, so we may be a little lucky in that regard!
These are some quick briefs on each T3:
Kalunga
Whm/Run/War/Brd/Cor/Drk
Pretty typical strat. Run tanks, debuff the add and just let it hit whoever; it seems to consistently go after whoever was second on the hate list as it stayed up with the DD. Before changing to Drk, I did try Drg because Drg Naegling with Angon/Fly High eats Kalunga alive, especially on V15, but I found it more of a pain keeping my wyvern alive on V20 due to mata's AoE autos and changed to Drk for more simplicity. Soul Enslave is quite nice to prevent TP moves from firing too for a bit post 25%. The Bio II from Drk on the add was a nice plus. Overall, not too bad of a fight and somewhat fast.
Arebati
Sch/Run/Rng/Cor/Brd/Geo
Standard V15 strat, except we used Indi-Barrier and saved Bolster at 75% as well to help keep the backline safer. Our Brd did give the Geo/Sch/Brd a Minne or two as well; I'm sorry I can't remember specifics here. Combined with a good Regen/Embrava, the pig wasn't much of a threat as it pounded the backline although they did need an occasional cure. We found the regen on this one to be particularly awful and really dragged the fight on. Having a strong Rng/Cor seems rather key to help end the fight afap. Ideally take down the aura, but I don't believe we did on ours. However, it did have MDB- aura, which seemed to really rock our Run. I had to work my *** off overtime to keep the Run alive post 50%, and our Run is quite strong. Tank needs Panas, a lot of them. Time was crunched a bit due to the regen.
Xevioooosa, not Xevioso
Whm/Sch/Sam/War/Cor/Brd
This one wasn't so bad; we found we really like double healer on this one for V15 and it seemed to work well on V20 too. Brd did standard DD songs with Wind Carol and I believe Scherzo on the Sam/War to help with any random one-shots. In addition to March/Ballad, he did some Minnes on the backline to help with the Chapuli randomly hitting us. Chapuli hate seems pretty random, so to help cover the Whm; I did some AoE Blink/SS and Aquaveil as Sch to help prevent any random spell interrupts. Sch is basically there to help cover the Whm while also providing Regen/Embrava/random cures/enmity buffs etc. After making sure the backline was defensive, the fight was pretty standard and cleared with plenty of time.
Ngai
Whm/Cor/Brd/Blu/Mnk/War
As usual, we didn't stray much from our standard set up on this. Be sure to use Scherzo on DD. Our Blu opened with AoE MG and then AoE Barrier Tusk when reset. If further resets, would AoE Nature's Med provided the aura was not Att down (Nature's Med won't work otherwise). Blu would also assist with possible AoE cures when necessary to help cover Whm. I don't recall precisely how the add's hate was, but it definitely went after the backline eventually so you'll want to help buff the backline with a Minne or two. Our cor Tact'd the backline to help assist with auras like usual. Thinking about it now though, it'd probably be nice to Gallant's roll the backline as well for further protection. Overall wasn't too bad, but during our clear a couple of our DD did die right near the end and our Blu just solo'd it down with help from the Whm.
Mboze
Whm/Cor/Brd/Blu/Bst/Drk
Standard strat of no TPing; however, be sure to buff the backline with a couple Minnes. To help combat the regen, our Brd/Cor/Bst would occasionally run in to Savage; Icarus wings are nice for free dmg. Since it's so unlikely to TP from 100% -> 75%, this is a good time to try to get extra dmg from the non-drk. You could potentially TP off the add to help with this, but I don't think we ended up doing so. It is a race against the clock somewhat, so you'll want to be rather aggressive on Drk and be sure to make good use of Scarlet and Armor Break. You will need to reapply Armor Break mid-way so be sure to do so and be sure to keep Wind Thren up to help ensure it lands. I've grown pretty accustomed to being the Drk on Mboze and a couple things that might help others that I've found I really like to do are...
--Turn around, take off Cureskin, Scarlet in 0 armor and hope the Tree does one of its physical auto attacks (it seems like 2/3 are physical while one is magical? You'll want an attack where it whips you basically; the magical auto attack is quite weak). This consistently results in a heavy hit but has never killed, allowing for a huge Scarlet boost. Coordinate with your Whm so they don't Cureskin you right before the hit and are ready to cure you afterwards. I haven't tried any Dmg+% gear myself yet; I think it might get a little too risky then. It's safe to do this tactic on Mboze with LR up.
--I like to DS/NV Absorb-Vit at the start to help push dmg, but then I'll try to land Absorb-Agi (and other Absorbs during Invince). If a reset gets DS (and NV), I've found I really like doing Absorb-Agi to give us a greater safeguard from TP attacks. Post 50%, I prioritize that DS/NV Absorb-Agi is up and then go for Absorb-Vit with possible resets of DS. Judging from Soul Enslavement tp drains on auto hits, I've noticed the dAgi bonus from DS/NV Absorb-Agi seems to be about 9 tp fed less per hit (can't speak to its potency with Lib, but might be especially worth doing after reapplying Armor Break if you have it).
Normally we run a Scherzo on Drk jic a non-Timber TP move does fire off, but we eventually settled on an extra Minuet and just banked on no TP moves. Might be interesting to try an Agi Etude in place though, especially if you don't have Dagon or Father Time Path B. Try to keep Bio II on the add as well, a good time to apply could be during Invince.
Ongo
Sch/Cor/Brd/Geo/Blm/Run
Same deal, we did a standard Ongo but gave some Minnes to the backline to help deal with the Tulfaire, which was bouncing among the backline. The Bird is mostly harmless as long as defensive buffs/gear/debuffs are present. As Sch, be sure to make sure to keep up AoE Aquaveil to help ensure no spells are cucked by the Tulfaire. If you do get into danger on the backline, turtle up, cure or vile elixir if you have to. This one was surprising to us. We did first try going on Earthsday for the additional dmg and managed to get it to less than 10% a couple times, largely due to some scuffed SCs and lack of resets. We did give it a shot on Watersday though and won np with a few minutes to spare. I don't believe we had a 5/6 WC either, but we did have some good Rayke resets and our SCs weren't scuffed (Sch makes Grav, Run Steel Cyclones, Cor closes with WF; the Cor and Run would SC together if strats were down).
Side note: our Blm was using Raetic +1 and helped supplement MP at times with Coalition Ethers.
And then Bumba...
This thing just sucks ***. We did about 8~ attempts on it before getting tired; we're gonna shoot to try again tomorrow. There appears to be an absolute boatload of RNG involved and can't be simply steamrolled like on V15 (although some runs we kind of were steamrolling it still...? More on that.)
A few notes:
--It only appears to have 3 possible 2hrs it can use at V20, we only saw the following:
Yaega
Brazen
PD
-Yaega obv sucks ***. We saw this one the most, followed by Brazen, and only one PD out of our several attempts; RNG is RNG tho. Odds seem tho you aren't going to get the "good" 2hr. Bumba's 2hr does not appear to be linked to the type of add it spawns.
--It only seems capable of spawning 3 types of adds, we only saw one of the following:
Chapuli
Matamata
Craklaw
-The Mata appeared to stay on the second person with hate, so it'd stay up with the DDs for us. The Chapuli and Craklaw appeared to have erratic hate though.
--Important!-- Unsurprisingly, it seems you WILL have to deal with fetters at some point, often around 50% or later. There wasn't nearly as much time to just kill it without worrying about fetters like on V15 (maybe about 2min roughly from pull on V20. It seemed to vary though for us; there might be other factors at play).
-Around post 50%, be ready for it to summon fetters if it hasn't already. At times though, there would just be one wave of fetters and they would go away for a while without us hitting any procs. It was pretty strange. Eventually though there would be fetters that would have a prolonged stay where you would need to try to proc it properly.
--All DD should bring several Panas at least to help the Whm. We noticed the fetters seemed to inflict an Att down effect that would bring your Att to 1 (believe this was present at V15 too), along with other parameter reductions (or maybe they're from a TP move from Bumba during fetters, really not sure); just bring Panas and use em, especially after Fetters.
-Denounce sucks, not really sure what causes it. It seems to use either Chastise or Denounce when fetters pop, so sometimes you won't see Denounce, at least not right away.
--Important!!-- SOMETHING appears capable of wiping RR, so try to be prepared for that. Not really sure what it is. Thought it was Denounce but doesn't seem to be. If you aren't ready though, it is possible to wipe with no RR, which happened to us on a run.
-One time after a wipe, I got up from Arise and my Reraise effect was immediately removed. Someone in our group said Bumba appeared to roar upon one of us getting back up, so maybe that triggered it? I wasn't looking at Bumba at the time, so totally unsure. At the time, Bumba was completely idle.
Party Setup:
Started with: War/Drg/Brd/Cor/Whm/Blu.
Then tried: War/Drg/Brd/Cor/Whm/Run
Settled on: War/Drg/Brd/Cor/Whm/Geo.
We basically tried to emulate a more defensive standard V15 setup and just kill it fast with brute force. It... kind of worked. You'll likely want a set up with more finesse if you're aiming for a consistent clear.
Buffs we settled on:
-Food: Everyone ate Miso Ramen.
-Songs: SV/CC Honor/Minuetx3/Madrigal
-Rolls: Crooked Chaos + Sam
-Geo: Indi-Attunement + Geo-Fury, entrust Barrier/Str
When it comes to the traditional melee set up, the main issue we found with this fight is RNG regarding the fetters, specifically when it would use Denounce with the Fetters. Some runs, we would just be steamrolling it well past 50% and even past 25%. Eventually they would spawn and the results would be a mixed bag. Sometimes we could survive them without issue (Bolster Attunement appeared to help quite a bit). Other times, Bumba would use Denounce with the fetters, cutting our HP by 90% and then fetters would clean us up (with gear/buffs though, some of us could survive this combo still; again the swap to Geo helped a ton). The MEva- aura (and I'd imagine MDB- aura) really sucked though for this kind of strat however.
A couple oddities/reaching theories:
One time, Bumba summoned Fetters around 50%~ish and Denounce'd, and the Denounce one-shot us all completely (like 3k+ dmg). No idea why, but it did have the Craklaw as its pet, so maybe that affected the properties of Denounce to be somewhat like Sundering Snip? This was the only Denounce that hit us like this of the night, afawr, and we did fight multiple Bumba's with Craklaw pets, so Idk.
Further, I swear one time against a Bumba with a Chapuli pet, it summoned fetters around 50%~ish and we survived ok, but then it proceeded to spam the hell out of Chastise during the fetters, and this ultimately killed us. Maybe was just TP spam, maybe it was similar to a Chapuli's response to a player WSing it, Idfk. There was some weird *** ***that happened during this fight.
LASTLY, a Tale of Woe:
We strongly think a typical melee set up could work on Bumba V20 (with some defensive adjustments in gear/food/geo buffs), as we did get close a few times out of 8~ runs/attempts, and ONE TIME we absolutely would have won BUT the Matamata add decided to use Debilitating Spout literally when Bumba was at 7% and it hit all of the melee (full dispel and zombie). It was the only TP move it used during the fight, completely caught us off guard, and we honestly think it was pure RNG that it just so happened to use its worst move at truly the worst time. It did not appear to be scripted. We even actually survived (minus the Cor), but simply couldn't rebuff properly to finish it off; it was truly one of the worst feelings we've had in recent years playing FFXI. Next time, we'd just account for this possibility and have the DD who has the Mata's attention go to the other side of Bumba or something, just keep it not facing all the other DD.
Possible setups/jobs to try:
A Rng setup might work really well on this fight. Unsure how much of a DPS race it would be though. Perhaps the Whm could just MB Banish/Holy/Holy II if it's a MB proc? Not sure if MB dmg actually matters, just number of MBs.
Smn might be a great choice for a melee centered fight. I feel like the combination of AF Wind's Blessing with Noctoshield could be a huge boon for fetters. Along with other useful Smn buffs, the possibility of using Perfect Defense (maybe even multiple times provided resets) could be super useful for dealing with the dangerous later portion of the fight.
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Were you trying to proc the aura, or just keep zerging? I don't see any mention of trying to taks it down.
Creecreelo said: »
One time, Bumba summoned Fetters around 50%~ish and Denounce'd, and the Denounce one-shot us all completely (like 3k+ dmg). No idea why, but it did have the Craklaw as its pet, so maybe that affected the properties of Denounce to be somewhat like Sundering Snip? This was the only Denounce that hit us like this of the night, afawr, and we did fight multiple Bumba's with Craklaw pets, so Idk.
This is normal behavior from Bumba and it has access to Denounce/Chastise on V15s during aura. Denounce has two tiers, one that one shots everyone, and one that does not. Never did find out what triggers one vs the other, but it shouldn't have anything to do with the add since the V15 version could do it.
A low TP feed strategy we used to use in the beginning Bumba days with Monk might be a favorable option. If you throw in SMN for mew rotation, you might completely stop the add from doing any additional attacks that might screw up your run, like the way you described it in your post with Debilitating Spout.
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Had some funny interactions with V20 Xevioso.
Seems all debuffs are landable on him. Frazzle III and Addle II seemed to be the only troublesome ones. Frazzle was resisted a lot but it does land occasionally and Addle 2 landed without resist with sab up while it didn't land without it but probably same as Frazzle. Distract III was 2 for 2 and everything else was immunobreaked with and without sab.
Seems all debuffs are landable on him. Frazzle III and Addle II seemed to be the only troublesome ones. Frazzle was resisted a lot but it does land occasionally and Addle 2 landed without resist with sab up while it didn't land without it but probably same as Frazzle. Distract III was 2 for 2 and everything else was immunobreaked with and without sab.
Asura.Geriond said: »
Were you trying to proc the aura, or just keep zerging? I don't see any mention of trying to taks it down.
Not really, we mainly just focused on trying to live through the fetters and TP moves during that phase, while hoping for a possible lucky shark/bee aura and blue proc and keeping up dmg. Based on our attempts and experiences, a group could definitely just get lucky enough to avoid dealing with proc business as long as you can live through it and simply keep pushing.
The fetters felt strange due to the variation of when they were summoned in the fight and the frequency of how long/often they'd stay up/reappear once summoned. We never were able to proc Blue in all the chaos. I'd imagine if you could survive and blue proc, it'd be an easy win.
It seemed like sometimes it would summon fetters, we'd manage to live through them, and then they'd go away for longer than expected despite us not having red/blue proc'd at all (we figured it was likely just a MB/SC aura). Other times the fetters felt more like a normal T3's aura situation with how often they'd go up and down.
Before the aura was based on him healing a certain amount, generally from his timed grace tp move or w/e.
I wonder if its the regen from having add out thats causing your aura to pop up early. If it is this, somehow getting the add away from bumba might lessen the regen and buy you more time but who knows.
I wonder if its the regen from having add out thats causing your aura to pop up early. If it is this, somehow getting the add away from bumba might lessen the regen and buy you more time but who knows.
On V15, Bumba's aura goes up either when it heals too much, or when 4 minutes pass since engaging. His self-heal isn't large enough to cause him to bring up aura before the timed condition is hit, but healing him with magic or skillchains on top of that easily can.
No idea if the regen counts or if that's what's causing the earlier aura if it does. Maybe it just automatically comes up at say, 2 minutes instead of 4 minutes on V20.
No idea if the regen counts or if that's what's causing the earlier aura if it does. Maybe it just automatically comes up at say, 2 minutes instead of 4 minutes on V20.
Getting way ahead of ourselves here but for farming purposes, do we know if the aura timer is changed for V19 bumba?
I've locked this thread. It was never meant to replace this one, https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/54555/the-odyssey-strategy-and-discussion/162/#3608662 , and people are posting in both more so here but it doesn't make sense 2 have strat threads. I should of done this as soon as the update happened.
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