String Theory: A Puppetmaster's Guide *NEW*

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String Theory: A Puppetmaster's Guide *NEW*
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 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-03-11 08:56:47
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Shame Se didn't take the chance to "fix" the elemental alignment of some attachments.
Tranquillisers should be water. Most in game stuff that give ma c is aligned to water.
Amplifiers should have been another element too. That would have given us more space to use loudspeakers and finally get some decent damage even without ice maker.


Well whatever, not like magic damage is relevant these days anyway. It's good they gave us a damage boost to the pets at least.
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 09:03:06
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Yeah, I like the buffs, but none of it fixes any of the fundamental issues PUP has in many aspects. It'll probably take at least another 2 years before SE bothers to look at the job again :/
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By Nariont 2019-03-11 09:04:23
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yup, all this did was nudge its DPS ahead some, aswell as just make c a further case on how limiting 12 slots is, with the new ones added in
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 09:12:56
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At least Truesights is a semi-decent solution to the lacking damage of the VE/SS Automaton outside of OD, since that's when Wind Maneuvers are typically useful.
 Cerberus.Jiko
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By Cerberus.Jiko 2019-03-11 09:28:02
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So as someone just returning to the game, with the new attachments, what're we looking at for latest attachment setups for frames?(1100jp+, of course)

[Edit: I know testing is still going on, but might as well ask just incase.]
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 09:40:46
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As far as skillchaining with your Automaton for things like CP goes, I'd say go with the following for maximum damage:

- VE/SS
- Turbo Charger 1+2
- Truesights
- Optic Fiber 1+2
- Auto-Repair Kit IV
- Inhibitor 1+2
- Attuner
- Magniplug 2
- Speedloader 2
- Coiler 2 (or Speedloader 1 if you have KKK AM3)

If Accuracy is an issue, replace the Magniplug 2 with Target Marker. If you need more, replace the Coiler 2 with Stabilizer V.

Spam Shijin Spiral > Armor Piercer > Victory Smite > Armor Shatterer > Victory Smite ad infinitum, preferably on Apex Bats as they take extra piercing and Light SC damage.
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 Shiva.Spathaian
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By Shiva.Spathaian 2019-03-11 10:03:38
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So what kind of a DPS improvement are we seeing at the moment? I'm sure it's not a huge bump but would love to see where the Automaton is sitting now.
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 10:11:34
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I posted several damage comparison screenshots on the previous page. The new attachments increase melee and ranged damage by roughly 40% altogether with Light/Wind/Fire and no OD.
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By Shiva.Spathaian 2019-03-11 10:21:40
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I saw the screenshots, was hoping for a harder number rather than having to eyeball it. Suppose I can do that myself when I get home from work.

40% seems like it won't add too much though, disappointing.
 Cerberus.Jiko
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By Cerberus.Jiko 2019-03-11 10:50:16
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Aerix said: »
As far as skillchaining with your Automaton for things like CP goes, I'd say go with the following for maximum damage:

- VE/SS
- Turbo Charger 1+2
- Truesights
- Optic Fiber 1+2
- Auto-Repair Kit IV
- Inhibitor 1+2
- Attuner
- Magniplug 2
- Speedloader 2
- Coiler 2 (or Speedloader 1 if you have KKK AM3)

If Accuracy is an issue, replace the Magniplug 2 with Target Marker. If you need more, replace the Coiler 2 with Stabilizer V.

Spam Shijin Spiral > Armor Piercer > Victory Smite > Armor Shatterer > Victory Smite ad infinitum, preferably on Apex Bats as they take extra piercing and Light SC damage.

I do have KKK, so that all helps. Thanks much:)
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 Asura.Tuko
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By Asura.Tuko 2019-03-11 10:52:04
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I'm a Kenkonken PUP. Earlier I was at Dho Gates, and enjoyed the much faster killing speed. My gear isn't that great, but the combination between me and my Nora made the experience really enjoyable. Yes, some AI improvements would have been awesome. But I am happy with the update.

I was rolling with these early this morning on my automaton.
Code
<frame>sharpshot frame</frame>
<head>valoredge head</head>
<slot01>optic fiber</slot01>
<slot02>optic fiber ii</slot02>
<slot03>auto-repair kit iv</slot03>
<slot04>magniplug ii</slot04>
<slot05>turbo charger</slot05>
<slot06>turbo charger ii</slot06>
<slot07>magniplug</slot07>
<slot08>truesights</slot08>
<slot09>speedloader</slot09>
<slot10>speedloader ii</slot10>
<slot11>inhibitor</slot11>
<slot12>inhibitor ii</slot12>


I find, speedloader I+II are a must, and the new magniplug+truesight attachments supplement their damage. I did not use the attuner, but I am thinking about replacing Inhibitor with Attuner to see the difference. My automaton gains a surplus of TP pretty quickly so it shouldn't be a problem. Also I toggle between my hybrid and master set to try and keep up with TP fast enough on both of us.
Code
[Tuko] Stringing Pummel ¨ Apex Bats
[Tuko] 8387 Stringing Pummel ¨ Apex Bats

[Nora] Armor Shatterer ¨ Apex Bats
[Nora] 8612 Armor Shatterer ¨ Apex Bats
Fusion: 10420 ¨ Apex Bats

[Nora] Armor Piercer ¨ Apex Bats
[Nora] 6662 Armor Piercer ¨ Apex Bats
Gravitation: 9712 ¨ Apex Bats

[Tuko] Victory Smite ¨ Apex Bats
[Tuko] 6153 Victory Smite ¨ Apex Bats
Fragmentation: 9229 ¨ Apex Bats

[Nora] Armor Shatterer ¨ Apex Bats
[Nora] 10320 Armor Shatterer ¨ Apex Bats
Light: 45232 ¨ Apex Bats


These are my trusts. The only flaw really is Ulmia casting ballads :(. I'm sure someone out there will get way better results.
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 10:58:57
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Cerberus.Jiko said: »
Aerix said: »
As far as skillchaining with your Automaton for things like CP goes, I'd say go with the following for maximum damage:

- VE/SS
- Turbo Charger 1+2
- Truesights
- Optic Fiber 1+2
- Auto-Repair Kit IV
- Inhibitor 1+2
- Attuner
- Magniplug 2
- Speedloader 2
- Coiler 2 (or Speedloader 1 if you have KKK AM3)

If Accuracy is an issue, replace the Magniplug 2 with Target Marker. If you need more, replace the Coiler 2 with Stabilizer V.

Spam Shijin Spiral > Armor Piercer > Victory Smite > Armor Shatterer > Victory Smite ad infinitum, preferably on Apex Bats as they take extra piercing and Light SC damage.

I do have KKK, so that all helps. Thanks much:)

Ah right, I forgot--if you do end up going to Apex Bats, you can replace the Auto-Repair Kit IV with something more offensive as Bats don't have damaging AoE moves.

Tuko's suggestion of replacing Inhibitor 1 is also solid if you have KKK AM3.

So for Bats, you could do something like:

- Turbo Charger 1+2
- Truesights
- Optic Fibers 1+2
- Inhibitor 2
- Speedloader 1+2
- Magniplug 1+2
- Attuner
- Target Marker, Coiler 2 or Barrage Turbine depending on Accuracy

And use double Fire + Wind Maneuvers for maximum damage. My maton was doing something like 55k+ Lights on Apex Bats when I messed around earlier today.
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 Carbuncle.Lunatone
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By Carbuncle.Lunatone 2019-03-11 11:04:57
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Do we have any spreadsheet for Pup?
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 11:15:45
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Asura.Tuko said: »
These are my trusts. The only flaw really is Ulmia casting ballads :(. I'm sure someone out there will get way better results.

I recommend just facetanking Apex Bats yourself. With a solid Trust backline and fast killspeed, you shouldn't have MP issues.

Try SylvieUC, Ygnas or Kupipi, Arciela 1, Joachim and either Shantotto 2 or Ulmia depending on MP. Sylvie is a great off-healer and gives you tons of Attack buffs, Kupipi is very fast on Erases (but Ygnas is better), Arciela will always keep you Haste 2'd and Joachim will March and Elegy reliably.
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 Asura.Tuko
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By Asura.Tuko 2019-03-11 11:21:58
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Aerix said: »
Asura.Tuko said: »
These are my trusts. The only flaw really is Ulmia casting ballads :(. I'm sure someone out there will get way better results.

I recommend just facetanking Apex Bats yourself. With a solid Trust backline and fast killspeed, you shouldn't have MP issues.

Try SylvieUC, Ygnas or Kupipi, Arciela 1, Joachim and either Shantotto 2 or Ulmia depending on MP. Sylvie is a great off-healer and gives you tons of Attack buffs, Kupipi is very fast on Erases (but Ygnas is better), Arciela will always keep you Haste 2'd and Joachim will March and Elegy reliably.

Oh that's perfect, thank you dude.

Btw, going with @Aerix's great suggestions has doubled my performance. Nora is a little powerhouse! I just need Ygnas...
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 11:31:41
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If you have the Jumbotender memento from Mog Gardens that's also a huge bonus as it will give all your Trusts a permanent Refresh+3 to sustain them better.

Oh and perhaps Koru-Moru would be a better alternative to Ulmia, since he also uses Dia 3, Distract 2 as well as Refresh 2 for your Trusts. Of course only if you can't manage with Shantotto 2, because she's a huge boost to party DPS that you definitely want to have.
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 12:05:44
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Also, if anybody is wondering why Arciela when you already have Koru-Moru:

Arciela is the only RDM Trust that will always cast Haste 2 on you, even if it means overwriting Haste 1. KingofHearts and Koru-Moru will never try to overwrite Haste 1, so if another Trust keeps hasting you, you would have to cancel it repeatedly until you get Haste 2 from them (which is a huge pain).
Arciela is also very quick to Paralyze 2 and Slow 2 enemies, lessening the burden on your healers. Additionally, she has a TP move that will buff your Attack and Defense which she likes to use pretty often.

Koru-Moru, on the other hand, is extremely focused on buffing, usually spending the majority of every fight buffing and rebuffing your entire team. Only after that is done does he usually cast enfeebles or cures.
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 Asura.Geriond
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By Asura.Geriond 2019-03-11 12:20:19
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IIRC, Arciela only casts Haste II when in light mode, so if you're unlucky, you have to wait a bit if it wears when she's in dark mode.
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 12:23:11
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Worst case scenario you'll still have Victory March + Haste 1 from Sylvie UC until Arciela switches modes. Still much more reliable than Ulmia, who constantly switches between Marches and Ballads.
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By clearlyamule 2019-03-11 13:29:14
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Shot some level 0/1 mobs with no piecing weakness with SS frame

no Magniplug: 1533

Magniplug 2 no OF
0 maneuvers -1578
1 fire maneuver-1623
2 fire maneuvers- 1692
3 fire maneuvers- 1758

Assuming it's adding to base dmg somehow that would put 0 maneuvers at +15, 1 at 30, 2 at 53 and 3 at 75

Magniplug 2 with OF 1/2 no maneuvers - 1587. OF seems to be working fine with it

Armor shatterer no maneuvers no magni or OF- 6966
with magni- 7146

the +15 base dmg seems to carryover onto ws dmg if you account for the weird way all ranged ws seem to be only 2/3s of what you should get from based dmg increases based on the ftp values we were given.

So seems to be adding to base dmg but with numbers that are kind of weird especially with what they gave us... except wait those numbers are exactly 1.5x what they gave us which means the values they gave us work out exactly right as far as adding base dmg to ws... ergo maybe ranged ws dmg is fine but regular ranged are actually boosted by 50%? That would explain why raising regular ranged attack by 1.5 only increases ws base by 1... in which case I'm glad SE has ignored my bug reports lol

Either way based on this (I guess could get more samples when I get time) looks like it will just add dmg the number they gave us *pdif * ftp . So we are looking at capped out OF1/2 magni 1/2 OD with light and fire maneuvers with a 3k tp arcuballista they should add about 6.5k dmg.

Side note something really weird was happening while doing this testing. the automaton refused to ws a lot. Ended up playing around with setups and yeah it would not every ws first regardless of master tp with inhibitor on. Like it would just sit there and wait for the super long time for shooting recast to be up when I switch to another mob real quick. Speedloader didn't matter
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By eliroo 2019-03-11 16:12:32
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How does the Mythic fair these days? I remember about a year ago people would hardly use it in favor of Ohtas for puppet only combat. Wondering if Puppet/Master is more common now and if the mythic is worth making.

Trying to help my wife figure out which Mythic she should make first. Given the classes that she enjoys playing the DNC and PUP ones seem like the best pickups just don't know which one would add more value to her gameplay. (She has Aeneas for DNC but no Godhands for PUP though those aren't too difficult for us to get either).
 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2019-03-11 16:38:20
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eliroo said: »
How does the Mythic fair these days? I remember about a year ago people would hardly use it in favor of Ohtas for puppet only combat. Wondering if Puppet/Master is more common now and if the mythic is worth making.

Mythic has always been pretty amazing for the puppet (whether pet only, or alongside master).. IF you can get AM3 up. The issue has been that some situations don't lend themselves to the master getting into dangerous AoE range to get TP - for example, that Ambuscade poroggo.

Ohtas was better for pet-only scenarios where it wasn't viable to maintain mythic AM3. But even that has now changed with Xiucoatl C existing.

Master+pet both meleeing, KKK is still your ideal choice.
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 Asura.Fabiano
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By Asura.Fabiano 2019-03-11 16:40:07
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eliroo said: »
How does the Mythic fair these days? I remember about a year ago people would hardly use it in favor of Ohtas for puppet only combat. Wondering if Puppet/Master is more common now and if the mythic is worth making.

Trying to help my wife figure out which Mythic she should make first. Given the classes that she enjoys playing the DNC and PUP ones seem like the best pickups just don't know which one would add more value to her gameplay. (She has Aeneas for DNC but no Godhands for PUP though those aren't too difficult for us to get either).

If you can maintain AM3, it's marginally the strongest weapon, because AM3 double-dips in both the master and automaton's DPS and due to it enhancing Stringing Pummel (+45% at R15) which is arguably our best WS. It's also a fun toy for BLM Automaton since you can spam Ice Maneuvers without fear of overloading.

If you cannot maintain AM3, or if a fight is too short for AM3 to matter, it's beaten by handily by either Xiucoatl(Su5), Godhands(Aeonic), (R15)Verethragna(Empyrean) and maybe even the new Karambit(Ambuscade) that just came out today. Xiucoatl (Path C), in particular, is absolutely monstrous for Overdrive puppet-only setups in comparison to other options, including Kenkonken AM3.

Final Verdict: definitely not needed considering our other options, but I love mine anyways :3
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By eliroo 2019-03-11 16:43:03
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Thanks for the quick replies, I will pass that on to her and hopefully it will help her make a choice!
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2019-03-11 17:17:49
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My feelings on the update it is a slight damage boost, but still so many things wrong with the Auto.
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 19:45:41
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So Magniplugs are pretty wild for ODing. Daze and Arcuballista increased by somewhere around 8k damage each, going from ~26k to ~34k on Selkit with Xiucoatl. Guess SE just wanted to buff the one thing we're already good at <.<
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By tarzan 2019-03-11 21:30:14
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Riddle me this, why does Mnejing (trust magic automaton) get Shield Subverter (AoE silence) and yet SE wont give it to Pup's automatons? In order to expand what content pup only players can do, an AoE voke is really needed or at least something that is AoE to gain some hate.
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By Quetzalcoatl.Xilkk 2019-03-11 22:16:14
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I think it buffs the damage of pup pet to be closer to master. it was falling behind.

and if we gonna get new content even tougher than divergence, we'll need it.

It make me hopeful for bst getting new pets :D
 Leviathan.Stamos
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2019-03-11 23:08:04
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Pet wasn't even close to master in hybrid gear. Which why I was all meh about it lol
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By Aerix 2019-03-11 23:23:15
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Yeah, my maton was only like 20% of my buffed master's total damage, so this update would push it to 28-30% of my total damage at best. Going from like ~13.5% in the parse to ~15% isn't exactly a big deal when heavy DDs and CORs are 20-30%.
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