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ARME Weapons
By Kodaijin 2016-09-08 10:34:07
Also if you want to argue that because of the meta Ochain isn't as needed, then I should lower all PLD weapons to A-Tier because RUN is more useful in ~80% of situations.
PLD weapons and shields shouldnt be compared to run weapons. Thats where this tier system breaks down.
I am ??? job and I don't know what weapon to make, let me see what is best a majority of the time for my job.
This is why your list should be broken down by Job and not by an arbitrary weapon classes.
By Nocki 2016-09-08 10:39:22
Added a list (still based mostly on my opinion) of job only weapons and their priority order if you were to make all of them.
By eliroo 2016-09-08 10:40:39
I actually have a question in regards to mythics.
So my wife is going to start making a Terp pretty soon and I'm going to be helping her get it made, problem is I have no idea what weapon I should start on (And eventually finish) while helping her.
I was wondering if I could get some honest opinions on which job would benefit the most from a mythic.
The jobs I "main":
RDM - Making an Excal for solo situations and eventually an Almace, so Murgleis doesn't seem like a viable option.
SMN - Is Nirvana really going to make a difference?
NIN - Making a Kikoku.
Jobs I am somewhat interested in gearing:
RNG
DRG
BRD
So it looks like I am going to have pick from the jobs that I am only some what interested in. I've already thought about it but I'm not sure what the solid answer is.
BRD seems like it takes a lot of commitment to gear up, I'd have to make another relic and another empyrean just to be viable so I'm not sure if making a Carn is even worth it. My LS currently has no geared BRD what-so-ever though and my wife has a GEO that will be getting an idris once we get legend coalition rank.
DRG - I have no gear for, and still a little wishy-washy on the job itself. It is really fun and interesting but is the mythic worth it?
RNG - Gastra seems excellent but it looks like RNG is in the same place as BRD in regards to weapons where I need to get a slew of different ARME weapons to make them viable.
Does anyone have any suggestions? I get the whole "get what you want to play" but my range of what I want to play is pretty huge and the main jobs I want to focus on first don't have worthwhile mythics.
 Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-09-08 10:41:52
1st The way I wanted this list to be used:
I am ??? job and I don't know what weapon to make, let me see what is best a majority of the time for my job. (refers to S-Tier list) Ah, okay cool I'm going to put effort towards blah weapon. It is not meant to compare S-Tier weapons with eachother, which is specifically why I divided them by job.
2nd to those of you talking about Priwen and Dunna, Arktoi etc...
This is for ARME only, if you were arguing that I should lower ochain because aeonic shield was good then fine but Ochain statistically outpreforms Priwen and the latter shouldn't even be considered here. Also if you want to argue that because of the meta Ochain isn't as needed, then I should lower all PLD weapons to A-Tier because RUN is more useful in ~80% of situations.
3rd
There was one guy when Aeonics came out who proposed we say ARME because it means weapon in French, and if anyone has noticed my character names are in french. I just like french...
This is all opinion. ARME BRD is just as powerful PAIRED with an Idris GEO. Why isn't DP COR on the top either? You're the 2nd person to mention this, DP is in S-Tier o.o
Okay but again, it's all subjective. There's no quantitative justification for this tier list and I don't think there ever will be. Already people have pointed out how they would rank different RMEA and you've demonstrated your intent to ignore them. It's very much your own personal tier list. You can't give anybody meaningful advice this way.
Ragnarok.Rydal
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By Ragnarok.Rydal 2016-09-08 10:45:38
RDM - Making an Excal for solo situations and eventually an Almace, so Murgleis doesn't seem like a viable option.
SMN - Is Nirvana really going to make a difference?
Both very viable mythics for their jobs.
@Nocki: Mandau is missing from the RDM list :P
[+]
Leviathan.Stamos
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2016-09-08 10:45:47
Added a list (still based mostly on my opinion) of job only weapons and their priority order if you were to make all of them.
Aeonic club is WHM's best dd weapon spamming Judgment/Black halo. So, probably would change up Thor's Hamma and that.
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-08 10:46:29
just get aeonic for drg, seems to be just as good and "free".
Brd obviously benefits a lot from ythic, but like you said You need the other 2, while only what like 70m~ tops to finish relic, emp may give you a good time sink. Your brd would be pretty awesome though at that point :D
rng... cant comment much on, but I am sure you have seen the #s mythic can put out, still a unused job though, so cool weapon for town? doesnt seem to great.
If you tank on nin much, nagi can be cool, other than that idk why I would get it at this stage, especially with kikoku already in works, forgo it.
I have rdm friends that rave about how good murg is. Idk.... I am not a rdm by any stretch, but they seem to like, prefer, it over other options.
SMN, if this is a main job of your, and no nirvana, just do this. It does help the job a lot on what its there for. You will use it, and use it quite often. It may not have the appeal it once had, but it is still very useful on smn.
my vote, SMN
By Nocki 2016-09-08 10:56:30
Okay but again, it's all subjective. There's no quantitative justification for this tier list and I don't think there ever will be. Already people have pointed out how they would rank different RMEA and you've demonstrated your intent to ignore them. It's very much your own personal tier list. You can't give anybody meaningful advice this way.
I made 4 adjustments based on people's suggestions. I'll admit sometimes I do disregard when 1 guy says something and has no numerical evidence, but the point of this thread was not to impose my opinions on any newcomers or people who have questions about what they should make.
Quit bashing the concept of the thread and actually contribute some changes if there's anything you disagree with.
The jobs I "main":
RDM - Making an Excal for solo situations and eventually an Almace, so Murgleis doesn't seem like a viable option.
SMN - Is Nirvana really going to make a difference?
NIN - Making a Kikoku.
Jobs I am somewhat interested in gearing:
RNG
DRG
BRD
So it looks like I am going to have pick from the jobs that I am only some what interested in. I've already thought about it but I'm not sure what the solid answer is.
BRD needs at least 3 of the ARME to be usable over a GEO for anything other than sleeps, so if you don't already have 2 others that's out of the equation. RDM and NIN mythics, yea... So it's ultimately between SMN, RNG, and DRG.
Nirvana only makes a large difference on overall performance if you find yourself using Physical BPs very often. It's also the best perp/avatar TP staff as well but you can manage without it. Whether you should make this or not is entirely dependent on frequency of using the job.
The reason I placed Gastra in S-Tier is because if you had only that weapon you could function pretty well in most situations (and also because Trueflight). Obviously there's times where having a bow and using Jishnu's is beneficial as well, along with gun in enmity control situations. But if you're just going after 1 weapon I'm not sure this would be the best job for that either.
Ryuno contributes quite a lot to DRGs dps, the only weapon that's close to it is aeonic. Getting AM3 isn't really that bad because of jumps and the ws is pretty good as well.
By eliroo 2016-09-08 10:56:52
just get aeonic for drg, seems to be just as good and "free".
Brd obviously benefits a lot from ythic, but like you said You need the other 2, while only what like 70m~ tops to finish relic, emp may give you a good time sink. Your brd would be pretty awesome though at that point :D
I'm not necessarily turned off by the fact that I would need to farm up a relic(Getting the Dura to 99 is a big turn off though), as I don't feel they are very hard to get. I just don't know how viable my BRD would be to my team at that point. I hear BRD isn't that useful these days and hardly see any around. I also saw a post stating that SE thinks BRD is fine the way it is.
SMN, if this is a main job of your, and no nirvana, just do this. It does help the job a lot on what its there for. You will use it, and use it quite often. It may not have the appeal it once had, but it is still very useful on smn.
Nirvana was my original gut choice but I keep reading that it is hardly used. Main SMNs that have it still use Grio for magical pacts and apparently grio is good for physical pacts too. The oboro weapon also seems really good for idle. I just don't know how big of a different Nirvana will make. I will be by no means a career SMN in terms of 100% completing SMN, or well any job for that matter. I prefer to be versatile and would rather have 5 85% jobs then 1 100% job.
Thank you for taking the time to answer my question btw, I know it is a weird one.
By Nocki 2016-09-08 11:01:43
Both very viable mythics for their jobs.
@Nocki: Mandau is missing from the RDM list :P
I forgot that RDM could equip Mandau, and so should everyone else.
Aeonic club is WHM's best dd weapon spamming Judgment/Black halo. So, probably would change up Thor's Hamma and that. Ah, true didn't really think about it. Thanks!
[+]
By eliroo 2016-09-08 11:05:24
BRD needs at least 3 of the ARME to be usable over a GEO for anything other than sleeps, so if you don't already have 2 others that's out of the equation. RDM and NIN mythics, yea... So it's ultimately between SMN, RNG, and DRG.
Nirvana only makes a large difference on overall performance if you find yourself using Physical BPs very often. It's also the best perp/avatar TP staff as well but you can manage without it. Whether you should make this or not is entirely dependent on frequency of using the job.
The reason I placed Gastra in S-Tier is because if you had only that weapon you could function pretty well in most situations (and also because Trueflight). Obviously there's times where having a bow and using Jishnu's is beneficial as well, along with gun in enmity control situations. But if you're just going after 1 weapon I'm not sure this would be the best job for that either.
Ryuno contributes quite a lot to DRGs dps, the only weapon that's close to it is aeonic. Getting AM3 isn't really that bad because of jumps and the ws is pretty good as well.
Thank you for answering.
Really curious on the BRD situation. If did make an Aeonic, Relic and Mythic would my BRD be a pretty good asset or do I need to the 99 Empyrean as well?
Also how is DRG fairing, dps-wise for lower Tier content where you can actually bring a melee?
By Verda 2016-09-08 11:09:50
RNG - Gastra seems excellent but it looks like RNG is in the same place as BRD in regards to weapons where I need to get a slew of different ARME weapons to make them viable. RNG is sort of like WAR in that you get a slew of options. Gastra is per pound the best investment though, and unless pdif is capped, using abrasion bolts with last stand and am3 is a good physical option too. Min maxing everything takes multiple weapons though that is true.
rng... cant comment much on, but I am sure you have seen the #s mythic can put out, still a unused job though, so cool weapon for town? doesnt seem to great. Depends entirely on two things: the company you keep and how willing to lead you are. If the company you keep is open minded and/or you're willing to lead, it will see a lot of use. Mochi for example has used my mythic RNG 3 times to clear zi'tah now, in record event times for those events. Almost everything in the zone can be killed with sch fusion -> trueflight skillchains with mages magic bursting fire. It's very rare a mob lives through more than one of those. The exceptions seem to be coeurl, cerberus, and the white pixie. Everything else we killed this way.
SMN - Is Nirvana really going to make a difference? Yes, especially for flaming crush and physical pacts. The acc/attack and 40% bp damage vs alternatives are huge, grio can get 35 acc/attack and 10% bp damage and 15 str best case, nirvana will get about double the acc/attack as well as str for fstr, and 30% more bp damage, as well as an additional 100 attack if you use aftermath. With current mab staves it's very hard to compete with physical bp on most anything, but with nirvana you can find it often pulling ahead. Volt Strike vs something weak to blunt for example you can do 32k to 48k damage if frailty + beast roll. That is going to be far less without nirvana. A lot of stuff isn't strong vs magic, but for stuff that is, like a lot of reisenjima t1 and some t2 (Flayer, Scorpion, Corse, Cerb) it's hard to even win some of those without nirvana on SMN, at least low man/solo. It's a great staff, but situational rather than all in. It's also the the best stats + perp staff for avatar, though if you're going for strict DT or smn skill there are other staves/clubs for that. I've heard Old Shuck can be done with non Nirvana SMN, but never seen it. Nirvana definitely makes it easier, I have a video of two mythic SMN + idris geo killing it in about 25 seconds, but one smn didn't even use 1 hour... so I'm thinking maybe it can be duo'd with just idris geo + mythic smn. That said it's definitely for a Summoner that wants to max all situations on the job, rather than a required piece to be an effective summoner as many have said before.
[+]
By Boshi 2016-09-08 11:15:22
Both very viable mythics for their jobs.
@Nocki: Mandau is missing from the RDM list :P
I forgot that RDM could equip Mandau, and so should everyone else.
Eh not saying that I'm advocating for it, but if someone already has it it's probably best mainhand on rdm when fighting piercing weak things. It's just way better than the next best dagger. Also mercy stroke is unique in that rdm goes from not beung able to make any level 3 self sc with dagger to being able to mercy>mercy>dark.
Also evis ws set is identical to cdc, mercy is pretty much the same as savage.
Then again Murgleis is piercing. For caturae I just go murg/demers+1 and use requiscat. I think for targets like birds tho mandau on rdm only holds a unique niche
By Nocki 2016-09-08 11:17:36
Thank you for answering.
Really curious on the BRD situation. If did make an Aeonic, Relic and Mythic would my BRD be a pretty good asset or do I need to the 99 Empyrean as well?
Also how is DRG fairing, dps-wise for lower Tier content where you can actually bring a melee?
100% yes, I only have Relic and Aeonic (almost done with carn) and find that I do fine on sleeps and having honor march for any DD that isn't BLU is quite wonderful. If you had those 3 weapons I'd definitely take you to intense ambu + aeonic runs!
DRG does just about as well as warrior does unless the content is piercing weak, in which case the WS numbers are higher than unstacked thf in the same situation. So yea DRG is quite viable, imo.
Leviathan.Stamos
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By Leviathan.Stamos 2016-09-08 11:19:29
Oh my reasoning for bringing KKK a few tiers is pretty much it has very limited use. In most cases you're not even meleeing, you're tanking on PUP so you don't use KKK. Where KKK shines is low buff situations, because the 50 martial arts is pretty hard to replace. However, if you actually buffed, it is pretty awful. You become way overcapped and hurt your tp gain by a bit. AM3 for the pet is nice when you can use it, but times you're actually meleeing on pup are few and far between.
The overload part of KKK is practically useless.
By eliroo 2016-09-08 11:25:21
Yes, especially for flaming crush and physical pacts. The acc/attack and 40% bp damage vs alternatives are huge, grio can get 35 acc/attack and 10% bp damage and 15 str best case, nirvana will get about double the acc/attack as well as str for fstr, and 30% more bp damage, as well as an additional 100 attack if you use aftermath. With current mab staves it's very hard to compete with physical bp on most anything, but with nirvana you can find it often pulling ahead. Volt Strike vs something weak to blunt for example you can do 32k to 48k damage if frailty + beast roll. That is going to be far less without nirvana. A lot of stuff isn't strong vs magic, but for stuff that is, like a lot of reisenjima t1 and some t2 (Flayer, Scorpion, Corse, Cerb) it's hard to even win some of those without nirvana on SMN, at least low man/solo. It's a great staff, but situational rather than all in. It's also the the best stats + perp staff for avatar, though if you're going for strict DT or smn skill there are other staves/clubs for that. I've heard Old Shuck can be done with non Nirvana SMN, but never seen it. Nirvana definitely makes it easier, I have a video of two mythic SMN + idris geo killing it in about 25 seconds, but one smn didn't even use 1 hour... so I'm thinking maybe it can be duo'd with just idris geo + mythic smn. That said it's definitely for a Summoner that wants to max all situations on the job, rather than a required piece to be an effective summoner as many have said before.
Interesting, I guess this makes the decision a bit harder. Since I enjoy SMN.
100% yes, I only have Relic and Aeonic (almost done with carn) and find that I do fine on sleeps and having honor march for any DD that isn't BLU is quite wonderful. If you had those 3 weapons I'd definitely take you to intense ambu + aeonic runs!
This makes Carn seem like a more impressive option. Considering that the group of people I'm playing with do not have a single geared BRD.
Given all the feedback here it seems that SMN and BRD are my best options. So then it is just about figuring out which one will make the biggest difference for me. Relic is easy to make for BRD(Spet about 1 week and I'm already halfway done w/ 2 relics while working), not sure how I will get myself an Aeonic but that shouldn't be too difficult with the right people.
I will have to take some time to figure out what I want to do.
Thank you everyone for the feedback!
Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-09-08 11:33:55
Okay but again, it's all subjective. There's no quantitative justification for this tier list and I don't think there ever will be. Already people have pointed out how they would rank different RMEA and you've demonstrated your intent to ignore them. It's very much your own personal tier list. You can't give anybody meaningful advice this way.
I made 4 adjustments based on people's suggestions. I'll admit sometimes I do disregard when 1 guy says something and has no numerical evidence, but the point of this thread was not to impose my opinions on any newcomers or people who have questions about what they should make.
Quit bashing the concept of the thread and actually contribute some changes if there's anything you disagree with.
Where's the numerical evidence for your tiers? Why did you decide to accept some suggestions and reject others? You're stating you're not trying to impose your opinion on newcomers yet you have no process for ranking weapons that isn't based on your own opinion or your take on what others think.
Sylph.Braden
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By Sylph.Braden 2016-09-08 11:55:45
Ryuno contributes quite a lot to DRGs dps, the only weapon that's close to it is aeonic. Getting AM3 isn't really that bad because of jumps and the ws is pretty good as well.
One weapon nobody ever mentions anywhere on Earth is Rhongomiant, which I actually have as being sorta close to Ryunohige despite only having AM3 going for it (which doesn't even work on Jumps, let alone WS).
Anyway, Trishula is great but dependent on either Stardiver spam or closing Umbra. Still highly recommended for anyone interested in DRG if they've got Aeonic access and don't wanna invest in a mythic.
By fillerbunny9 2016-09-08 12:09:01
Dragoon has the easiest management of Mythic AM3 of potentially any job out there provided they are keeping their rat alive. courtesy of the changes to Breaths, the Wyvern is now a perpetual TP battery. AM3 about to go down? Spirit Link for an instant 1500 TP, followed with Jumps, the winddown of AM3, use of Meditate if /SAM, etc. main job SAM can meditate if necessary due to poor timing or not wanting to 'recharge' AM3 prior to its loss, but it has a bit more windup than DRG does.
By Kodaijin 2016-09-08 13:34:29
I am having a hard time seeing how conquerer would equal Chango. I would assume it would be above chango but I don't have either. Can someone comment who has experience with both?
 Leviathan.Andret
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By Leviathan.Andret 2016-09-08 15:07:35
There is something I am not too sure about Mnk ARME - How do you read this? ARM-ME? Army? AYE-ARR-EMM-ME?
Does aftermath lv1 overwrite aftermath lv3 on Mythic? It seems to do so on Relic. If it does then Vere Mnk can only maintain aftermath lv1 because it's sort of like the go-to WS on mnk.
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2016-09-08 15:09:00
People need to remember that all of this is opinion.
By Nocki 2016-09-08 15:15:24
There is something I am not too sure about Mnk ARME - How do you read this? ARM-ME? Army? AYE-ARR-EMM-ME?
Does aftermath lv1 overwrite aftermath lv3 on Mythic? It seems to do so on Relic. If it does then Vere Mnk can only maintain aftermath lv1 because it's sort of like the go-to WS on mnk.
I pronounce it like Arm, the e is silent. Also, nothing overwrites mythic or empy AM3. You just have to wait for it to wear and then reapply it. I (and many others) wish that AM3 would at least overwrite itself lol.
Ragnarok.Sekundes
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2016-09-08 15:16:11
There is something I am not too sure about Mnk ARME - How do you read this? ARM-ME? Army? AYE-ARR-EMM-ME?
Does aftermath lv1 overwrite aftermath lv3 on Mythic? It seems to do so on Relic. If it does then Vere Mnk can only maintain aftermath lv1 because it's sort of like the go-to WS on mnk.
Any AM level will overwrite no AM or Afterglow from other players. AM2 overwrites AM1. AM3 overwrites am2. Nothing can overwrite AM3. Not even AM3. You have to wait for it to wear off regardless of if you want to put AM3 back up or put AM1 or AM2 up.
 Bismarck.Snprphnx
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By Bismarck.Snprphnx 2016-09-08 15:24:34
Can we call them REAMs?
Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-09-08 15:41:03
MAREs
By Morihei 2016-09-08 15:52:36
I like your BST wep order. While Guttler probably doesn't compare to the damage an Aymer helps your pet dish out, it's a great source of DD when you don't have the money for the Aymer. And it's better for meleeing with your pet, if you're going to do that kind of thing.
But it's all or nothing. If you're not going to put those 10k Plutons in, don't even start it. Arktoi, Merlin, and Skullrender will do just fine.
By Wolfen 2016-09-08 16:06:00
so odd the OP uses RMEA properly and yet named the thread ARME Makes it sound like ARMY, ARMY Weapons lol
By Nocki 2016-09-08 16:12:26
There was one guy when Aeonics came out who proposed we say ARME because it means weapon in French pronounce it like Arm, the e is silent.
I peruse reddit as often as FFXIAH pretty much, and someone asked which RMEA were viable these days. So, I decided to make a tier list...
God-Tier:
GEO: Idris
S-Tier:
WAR: Ragnarok, Ukonvasara
THF: Twashtar
WHM: Yagrush
PLD: Aegis > Burtgang
DRK: Ragnarok, Liberator
BST: Aymur
BRD: Gjallarhorn > Marsyas
RNG: Gastraphetes
SAM: Masamune
NIN: Heishi Shorinken > Kannagi
DRG: Ryunohige > Trishula
SMN: Nirvana
BLU: Almace > Tizona
COR: Death Penalty
PUP: Kenkonken
DNC: Terpsichore > Twashtar
RUN: Epeolatry
A-Tier:
WAR: Chango = Conqueror
THF: Vajra > Aeneas
MNK: Godhands > Verethragna
WHM: Gambanteinn
BLM: Laevatinn
PLD: Ochain
DRK: Apocalypse = Anguta
BRD: Carnwenhan > Daurdabla
RNG: Gandiva > Yoichi, Fomalhaut > Annihilator
SAM: Dojikiri Yasutsuna > Kogarasumaru
NIN: Kikoku
BLU: Sequence
COR: Armageddon = Fomalhaut
PUP: Godhands
DNC: Aeneas
SCH: Tupsimati
RUN: Lionheart
B-Tier:
WAR: Farsha
MNK: Spharai > Glanzfaust
RDM: Murgleis
BLM: Hvegelmir
PLD: Srivatsa
DRK: Caladbolg
RNG: Fail-Not
SAM: Amano
SMN: Claustrum
SCH: Hvegelmir
Everything else is pretty bleh... This list considers job usefulness in the current meta, along with how much the weapon contributes to the job itself. Idris is God-Tier because it affects literally the entire party and essentially delvls anything you're fighting. Anything that is S-Tier I would recommend having if you take the job seriously, anything A-Tier is situationally good, B-Tier will still beat out non-269 weapons in most cases, and anything else will lose to well augmented reisen weapon or is too situational to even matter.
If you disagree with the placement of anything, or think I forgot something I'm curious about other people's opinions of the weapons. Please avoid turning this thread into anything negative about other people or their individual weapon decisions, genuinely just curious what y'all think!
Things we don't need to consider: Difficulty of obtaining the weapon/price
Things we should consider: Overall usefulness of the weapon, if you have x weapon would you still aim to get something better?
All ARME Weapons Format:
WAR: Ukonvasara > Ragnarok > Chango = Conqueror > Farsha > Bravura
THF: Twashtar > Vajra = Aeneas > Mandau
MNK: Godhands > Verethragna > Spharai > Glanzfaust
WHM: Yagrush > Gambentinn > Tishtrya > Mjollnir
RDM: Almace > Murgleis = Sequence > Excalibur
BLM: Laevatinn > Hvergelmir > Khatvanga > Claustrum
PLD: Aegis > Burtgang > Ochain > Sequence > Almace = Srivatsa > Ragnarok > Caladbolg > Excalibur
DRK: Ragnarok = Liberator > Apocalypse > Caladbolg = Anguta > Redemption
BST: Aymur > Guttler > Farsha = Tri-Edge
BRD: Gjallarhorn > Marsyas > Carnwenhan > Daurdabla > Twashtar > Mandau
RNG: Gastrophedes > Gandiva > Fail-Not = Yoichinoyumi = Armageddon = Fomalhaut = Annihilator
SAM: Masamune > Dojikiri Yasutsuna > Kogarasumaru > Amanomurakumo
NIN: Heishi Shorinken > Kannagi = Kikoku > Nagi
DRG: Ryunohige = Trishula > Rhongomiant = Gungnir
SMN: Nirvana > Hvergelmir = Claustrum > Khatvanga
BLU: Almace > Tizona = Sequence
COR: Death Penalty > Armageddon = Fomalhaut
PUP: Kenkonken > Godhands > Verethragna
DNC: Terpsichore > Twashtar > Aeneas
SCH: Tupsimati > Hvergelmir > Khatvanga
RUN: Epeolatry > Lionheart
GEO: Idris > Tishtrya
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