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Gunmen Storm Office Of Satirical Magazine In Paris
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Gunmen storm office of satirical magazine in Paris
Gunmen storm office of satirical magazine in Paris
Funny thing is that when we, meaning anglophones, use the word "we" in English, the speaker is assumed to be a part of that. Moreover, even if we exclude you from your statement, you're still saying that not only have Jews been riling people up in France, but that their slaughter is deserved. You may as well just delete your original post before I start quoting it because you're not gonna be able to back out of what you wrote.
And I have no real interest in trying to understand whatever you're trying to say when the intent is to justify genocide.
And I have no real interest in trying to understand whatever you're trying to say when the intent is to justify genocide.
I was merely trying to be objective. I do not think they should be killed, I was just explaining how people think, and why it may happen.
Trying to understand things with an objective mind is pretty fun, and kinda needed if you want to open your mouth about something.
You sound pretty butthurt for an ignorant.
Trying to understand things with an objective mind is pretty fun, and kinda needed if you want to open your mouth about something.
You sound pretty butthurt for an ignorant.
a.) There's no such thing as objective.
b.) Type it in French, since apparently you have issues with English.
c.) I'm not buying your *** for one second.
I have a strong suspicion you're Muslim.
b.) Type it in French, since apparently you have issues with English.
c.) I'm not buying your *** for one second.
I have a strong suspicion you're Muslim.
If you think that was a matter of objectivity I don't even know what the ***
You literally said you're not sure if genocide is deserved
You literally said you're not sure if genocide is deserved
Hahaha, you are pretty racist, I didn't know that part of you.
Objectivity is an utopia, but you can try to come close. You're not even trying.
My English is good enough for me to type with it. Why you'd attack me on this specific field is pretty surprising considering what you are. And yes, I said "what".
Whether you buy it or not, does it matter? Who are you? What are you? You don't amount to anything regarding the topic at hand and what happens in this country.
I'm not Muslim, you'd know that if you had a memory worth anything as I've mentioned it in a past thread you were a part of. I'm not religious at all, anyway.
In the way that people would think it's deserved.
Do you think any of the genocides that happened was deserved? If so, why? If you think it wasn't deserved, can you try to understand why people actually did it?
As simple as that. Doesn't mean I think there should be a genocide, or anything said by that other person.
Objectivity is an utopia, but you can try to come close. You're not even trying.
My English is good enough for me to type with it. Why you'd attack me on this specific field is pretty surprising considering what you are. And yes, I said "what".
Whether you buy it or not, does it matter? Who are you? What are you? You don't amount to anything regarding the topic at hand and what happens in this country.
I'm not Muslim, you'd know that if you had a memory worth anything as I've mentioned it in a past thread you were a part of. I'm not religious at all, anyway.
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
If you think that was a matter of objectivity I don't even know what the ***
You literally said you're not sure if genocide is deserved
You literally said you're not sure if genocide is deserved
Do you think any of the genocides that happened was deserved? If so, why? If you think it wasn't deserved, can you try to understand why people actually did it?
As simple as that. Doesn't mean I think there should be a genocide, or anything said by that other person.
[+]
I'm racist for suspecting that you're a member of a religion that has a recent history of anti-semitism in France after you've attempted to justify genocide of French Jews? Not only is "Muslim" not a race (idiot), but your sympathies clearly lie in that direction regardless of your religious affiliation or lack thereof.
I offered for you to speak in your native tongue because I'm francophone. But you're determined to reach the mantle layer, so keep digging.
I offered for you to speak in your native tongue because I'm francophone. But you're determined to reach the mantle layer, so keep digging.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
If you think it wasn't deserved, can you try to understand why people actually did it?
Psychopathy
That's still a racist stance as we both know that when you call me a Muslim, you perfectly not expect me to be whiter than you are. Let's be real one second. I'd understand if I called you a racist for no reason, but you're full blown racist here, period. But hey, I don't mind, we're all racists, I just expected you to be a bit more open minded in that regard.
I attempted to explain what people think. No wait, I didn't attempt anything, I literally did it. I justified why, one day, people are going to go too far. Now, when it'll happen, you'll actually barge in a thread posting something relevant, unless your first quoted post.
My sympathy goes toward humans. I don't have more sympathy for a religion over another. Judging people too fast is a mistake.
In this case, I merely explain that the Jewish community has earned a lot of hatred in the country over the past 14 months. I also explained that due to this, the attention and overall racism has shifted from Muslims to Jews. From there, I explain that, given the escalation we're now facing, when the election happen in 2017 and the far right wins (low chance they won't), what will happen? Well, maybe there will be an uproar, and maybe the Jews will be killed because of all this built hatred. And if it happens, you know where the hatred came from.
Would I kill Jews over what happened? No. Would I support and say it's right? No. Am I "upset" at all the bad stories around Jews right now? Yes, both ways: it's bad that they're being attacked all the damn time and what some of them have done is plain inhuman and it needs to be fixed, within the law, obviously. Am I the kind of person who ever gets angry and would commit an atrocity? No. Here, you've got your answers.
Why would I speak French when this is an English forum? I just don't see the point, it would actually be rude and superfluous. Why would you want to go away from the lingua franca just because you happen to understand my mother tongue, on this forum of all places?
PsychopathyToo shallow, think deeper.
See it as if you were an actor. You want to play the role of a person who led a genocide, or a mass murder in general. What reasons can bring you to do this that have nothing to do with mental disorder? Think of a logical train of actions.
I attempted to explain what people think. No wait, I didn't attempt anything, I literally did it. I justified why, one day, people are going to go too far. Now, when it'll happen, you'll actually barge in a thread posting something relevant, unless your first quoted post.
My sympathy goes toward humans. I don't have more sympathy for a religion over another. Judging people too fast is a mistake.
In this case, I merely explain that the Jewish community has earned a lot of hatred in the country over the past 14 months. I also explained that due to this, the attention and overall racism has shifted from Muslims to Jews. From there, I explain that, given the escalation we're now facing, when the election happen in 2017 and the far right wins (low chance they won't), what will happen? Well, maybe there will be an uproar, and maybe the Jews will be killed because of all this built hatred. And if it happens, you know where the hatred came from.
Would I kill Jews over what happened? No. Would I support and say it's right? No. Am I "upset" at all the bad stories around Jews right now? Yes, both ways: it's bad that they're being attacked all the damn time and what some of them have done is plain inhuman and it needs to be fixed, within the law, obviously. Am I the kind of person who ever gets angry and would commit an atrocity? No. Here, you've got your answers.
Why would I speak French when this is an English forum? I just don't see the point, it would actually be rude and superfluous. Why would you want to go away from the lingua franca just because you happen to understand my mother tongue, on this forum of all places?
Leviathan.Kaparu said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
If you think it wasn't deserved, can you try to understand why people actually did it?
Psychopathy
See it as if you were an actor. You want to play the role of a person who led a genocide, or a mass murder in general. What reasons can bring you to do this that have nothing to do with mental disorder? Think of a logical train of actions.
[+]
There is no logical train of actions - it all stems from Sociopathy or psychopathy.
Rooted primarily in a superiority complex, or anger management issues that drives a person to the point of being beyond reason, and instead, thinking the only solution is a permanent one of eradicating and entire race of people who simply refuse to be subjugated.
Rooted primarily in a superiority complex, or anger management issues that drives a person to the point of being beyond reason, and instead, thinking the only solution is a permanent one of eradicating and entire race of people who simply refuse to be subjugated.
You're the one who is focused on race, ergo you assume I am, too. This is a very typical human behavior: assuming other people are the same as oneself. I don't care if your family is from Algeria or Alsace-Lorraine.
And, no, you neither attempted to explain nor were you able to do so. You straight up said that Jewish manipulation of the media was going to cause them to be justifiably killed by the non-Jewish population of France. As Jewish emigration from France has been escalating in light of continued anti-semitic violence and death, for you to try to claim they're somehow responsible and asking for it is, as Kaparu pointed out, psychopathic. You've literally said, "Of course she got raped, look what she was wearing."
And, again, the reason I keep inviting you to use your native tongue is because your English is mediocre. My spoken French is mediocre, but I've had no problems reading the articles about Charlie Hebdo and the rise in Jewish aliyah from France. Meanwhile, though, about 30% of your sentences are literally incomprehensible to me.
I find it curious that you would accuse a polyglot inviting you to write with greater clarity in your mother tongue of being a racist. I guess that you have grasped one particularly loathsome aspect of modern American English: use a mindlessly inflammatory word and say it means whatever you think it means.
Hey, by the way, let's pretend that you're not a vicious anti-semite being backed into a corner and lying out your ***: I'm still waiting for you to explain how glorious France, the place that abhors violence and is untroubled by sex, is culturally justified in wanting to kill Jews. Murder is pretty violent, last I checked.
And, no, you neither attempted to explain nor were you able to do so. You straight up said that Jewish manipulation of the media was going to cause them to be justifiably killed by the non-Jewish population of France. As Jewish emigration from France has been escalating in light of continued anti-semitic violence and death, for you to try to claim they're somehow responsible and asking for it is, as Kaparu pointed out, psychopathic. You've literally said, "Of course she got raped, look what she was wearing."
And, again, the reason I keep inviting you to use your native tongue is because your English is mediocre. My spoken French is mediocre, but I've had no problems reading the articles about Charlie Hebdo and the rise in Jewish aliyah from France. Meanwhile, though, about 30% of your sentences are literally incomprehensible to me.
I find it curious that you would accuse a polyglot inviting you to write with greater clarity in your mother tongue of being a racist. I guess that you have grasped one particularly loathsome aspect of modern American English: use a mindlessly inflammatory word and say it means whatever you think it means.
Hey, by the way, let's pretend that you're not a vicious anti-semite being backed into a corner and lying out your ***: I'm still waiting for you to explain how glorious France, the place that abhors violence and is untroubled by sex, is culturally justified in wanting to kill Jews. Murder is pretty violent, last I checked.
I don't know, I'd like to think that one of the persons responsible for any genocides that happened actually did it on a whim without thinking too deep about it or because it was part of a strategy, without involving any of what you mentioned.
I don't think it's impossible, some people who have committed murders did match this description.
I don't think it's impossible, some people who have committed murders did match this description.
[+]
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
You're the one who is focused on race, ergo you assume I am, too. This is a very typical human behavior: assuming other people are the same as oneself. I don't care if your family is from Algeria or Alsace-Lorraine.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
And, no, you neither attempted to explain nor were you able to do so. You straight up said that Jewish manipulation of the media was going to cause them to be justifiably killed by the non-Jewish population of France. As Jewish emigration from France has been escalating in light of continued anti-semitic violence and death, for you to try to claim they're somehow responsible and asking for it is, as Kaparu pointed out, psychopathic. You've literally said, "Of course she got raped, look what she was wearing."
"Yo, you're a Jew, but are you a Zionist?". Not gonna happen.
Once again, I won't be the one to set them on fire, but if Jean-Charles, yeah, that guy who's 60yo+ and has had enough of that ***set them on fire, I will of course say/think he shouldn't burn his rapists, as it's better to punish them through law, but I will understand why.
You are literally wondering why a girl who has been raped 30 years straight by her uncle is angry toward said uncle. That's why I'm mind blown, and said you had no clue about the topic. And you still have absolutely zero clue.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
And, again, the reason I keep inviting you to use your native tongue is because your English is mediocre. My spoken French is mediocre, but I've had no problems reading the articles about Charlie Hebdo and the rise in Jewish aliyah from France. Meanwhile, though, about 30% of your sentences are literally incomprehensible to me.
I'm fine with mistakes being done here and there, but you'll understand that you being anal about it is hardly a good justification to shift.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
I find it curious that you would accuse a polyglot inviting you to write with greater clarity in your mother tongue of being a racist. I guess that you have grasped one particularly loathsome aspect of modern American English: use a mindlessly inflammatory word and say it means whatever you think it means.
I don't like to use this kind of word actually, I really dislike it even. I only used it in a very specific way because you are the only person that gave me a racist vibe between that last Palestine/Israel thread and now on these forums.
Don't pull an Olivier Besancenot on me, though, I don't mind, we're all racists by default.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
Hey, by the way, let's pretend that you're not a vicious anti-semite being backed into a corner and lying out your ***: I'm still waiting for you to explain how glorious France, the place that abhors violence and is untroubled by sex, is culturally justified in wanting to kill Jews. Murder is pretty violent, last I checked.
In the US, policemen will kill black people because they want to. That's a plague, but hey, that's the US, anything stupid is expected to happen there.
Then, you have the French equivalent. Here, people get their ID checked on a regular basis. You're black/tanned/asian? Well *** dude, you're gonna get your ID checked 2-20 times per day if you walk in any big city.
Now, I don't know which is worse, but hey, I think it speaks about how racism is handled differently between both countries.
One country is allowed to kill its citizen in the name of racism, the other is allowed to annoy them every day, but let them live.
So, regarding the justification of violence, it doesn't come from the state but the people. While people may enjoy a good Bloodsports, they aren't really into having their black neighbour dead on the ground when they come back from work.
However, when they get angry, and also "thanks to" History teaching us that it happened once, who knows what may happen. As much as protesting in peace is popular, you don't know what may happen when people really have had too much.
When I hear about the antisemitism climbing, I'm worried, so I try to understand why. The issue is, many of the antisemitic things are actually pretty neutral, they merely make the Jewish community angry. Just because you don't like MC Donald's doesn't make it poison, same logic applies.
So, you try to find really antisemitic things happening, and you will find some. Those are worrying, all right. But then, there is Jewish couple that was robbed with the wife being raped because they were Jews. But, wait, they were indeed robbed because they were Jews, as they thought they'd have money, but the rape happened for a completely unrelated reason.
My issue is when you take an incident and try to blame it all on antisemitism to move masses. It just doesn't work with me. And one day, it won't work with people who are actually violent and just need a reason to unleash it with others. Why give them reasons and expect them to stay calm?
The guys killed last morning were killed for a reason, they were fully aware of it. Was it right they died? No, not in any way. Can it be explained, can we say "they died for this reason, it makes sense"? Yes, we *** can.
Don't be an Ostrich.
[+]
And on topic, who is being blamed for what happened? Zionism.
An Israel journalist published on Twitter that suspects had been found, 5 hours before the official French journalist agency.
So it goes from suspecting Al Qaida Yemen, to Syria, to another place I forgot and now, Israel.
See what I mean? The wave has changed directions after the whole Palestine/Israel incident. 10 years ago you had to blame Muslims for anything, even your toilets being clogged, now people target Zionists, and more dangerously, Jews.
http://www.voltairenet.org/article186408.html
An Israel journalist published on Twitter that suspects had been found, 5 hours before the official French journalist agency.
So it goes from suspecting Al Qaida Yemen, to Syria, to another place I forgot and now, Israel.
See what I mean? The wave has changed directions after the whole Palestine/Israel incident. 10 years ago you had to blame Muslims for anything, even your toilets being clogged, now people target Zionists, and more dangerously, Jews.
http://www.voltairenet.org/article186408.html
[+]
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
I'm fine with mistakes being done here and there, but you'll understand that you being anal about it is hardly a good justification to shift.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
Then, you have the French equivalent. Here, people get their ID checked on a regular basis. You're black/tanned/asian? Well *** dude, you're gonna get your ID checked 2-20 times per day if you walk in any big city.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
One country is allowed to kill its citizen in the name of racism, the other is allowed to annoy them every day, but let them live.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
I only used it in a very specific way because you are the only person that gave me a racist vibe between that last Palestine/Israel thread and now on these forums.
But that still doesn't mean that racist means what you want it to mean. I dislike people who follow a monotheistic religion and I don't give a ***where their ancestors came from. Stop being illiterate.
Getting away from your personal nonsense...
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
You are literally wondering why a girl who has been raped 30 years straight by her uncle is angry toward said uncle. That's why I'm mind blown, and said you had no clue about the topic. And you still have absolutely zero clue.
Free preview, though, I'm not going to agree with you, anyhow. Because dance though you try, you keep attempting to justify people slaughtering other people.
And, no, it doesn't "make sense" that a trio of clinically unbalanced, if not outright insane and psychopathic, people would kill a bunch of cartoonists. Charlie Hebdo wasn't even doing very well financially and was getting close to bankruptcy; it's not exactly the same thing as the Wall Street Journal publishing a provocative political cartoon.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
I'm fine with mistakes being done here and there, but you'll understand that you being anal about it is hardly a good justification to shift.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
One country is allowed to kill its citizen in the name of racism, the other is allowed to annoy them every day, but let them live.
I haven't watched TV since 2006. I'm not really into politics either, it's just *** left and right and as said before, I'm not religious in the slightest. You'd have serious troubles finding anyone as unbiased as me.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
I only used it in a very specific way because you are the only person that gave me a racist vibe between that last Palestine/Israel thread and now on these forums.
But that still doesn't mean that racist means what you want it to mean. I dislike people who follow a monotheistic religion and I don't give a ***where their ancestors came from. Stop being illiterate.
Getting away from your personal nonsense...
I find it amusing that you'd question my ethnicity, anyway. It's the first time it happens actually. Occam's razor etc. There were a couple drunk girls who thought I was Greek actually, if it helps you in your quest.
Oh and, you are racist, we all are. Do you also lack knowledge in this department? There are enough studies that explain why humans are racist by default. Furthermore, denying that Muslims are associated with Arabs is just, I don't want to use that word as I really dislike it, just stop making a fool out of yourself.
That's like saying "you may be a Buddhist but I actually thought you were black". Just, don't.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
You are literally wondering why a girl who has been raped 30 years straight by her uncle is angry toward said uncle. That's why I'm mind blown, and said you had no clue about the topic. And you still have absolutely zero clue.
Free preview, though, I'm not going to agree with you, anyhow. Because dance though you try, you keep attempting to justify people slaughtering other people.
And, no, it doesn't "make sense" that a trio of clinically unbalanced, if not outright insane and psychopathic, people would kill a bunch of cartoonists. Charlie Hebdo wasn't even doing very well financially and was getting close to bankruptcy; it's not exactly the same thing as the Wall Street Journal publishing a provocative political cartoon.
Biggest example that started the whole wave against them? The Dieudonné incident. I've put my hands on a DVD copy of his sketches, actually they're up on youtube now anyway, and there was no antisemitism to be found. If anything, Muslims would be the angriest with "La fine équipe du 11 septembre". Did Muslims do their best to ruin someone's freedom? Did they even threaten his life? Exactly.
It's not a matter of you agreeing or not, as I said before, your opinion is completely irrelevant. So is mine, I'm just explaining facts here, facts I obviously agree with, but they'd still be the same facts if I wouldn't agree with them.
I'm not attempting, I'm literally explaining why they'd get into troubles.
There is a reason as to why they were killed, everything makes sense in a way or another. Jumping on the "THEY'RE PSYCHOPAAAATH" bandwagon is just being narrow minded and shallow.
If you were to be Columbo, the series would have ended with the first episode. The link I gave is a good thing to read just to make your brain start working on the whole story. Why did it happen? Who did it? What will happen now? You don't have to say the article is right or whatever, the article's point is to make you think on your own, to go out there and seek elements and draw a conclusion, your conclusion, what is logical for you. And then maybe important people will do the same and the whole issue will go forward, toward a resolution hopefully.
I find it fun and more interesting than following the simplistic "MURDERERS, EXTREMISTS, BURN RELIGION" and what not. I don't know, I honestly think that you aren't smart enough for me to make you understand if you don't get it at this point. If you have to brag about talking 4 languages, which is indeed an accomplishment as an American though, it means you literally hold no value beside that. That's most likely one of my bad sides but, I can't take anyone bragging about something so small seriously. I just can't.
I'd have more success explaining that guy who doesn't speak English nor French why his level 2 dive as Warwick on Riven was a bad idea. Speaking of, I'm gonna do that.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
Furthermore, denying that Muslims are associated with Arabs is just, I don't want to use that word as I really dislike it, just stop making a fool out of yourself.
My city, a landlocked midwestern American one, is safe harbor to thousands of Somali refugees. Guess what religion they predominantly follow. And you claim to be in France, so I'm sure you've run into plenty of Algerians, assuming you aren't yourself one.
You're making a very false assumption here, though. My opinion of you doesn't alter by knowing what ethnicity you are (it can't get any lower and I don't hold people in higher esteem for a fluke of parentage, either). I just want to know what your stake is. Your pointed refusal to say anything coupled with your excessive focus on something that primarily impacts ethnic and religious minorities in France, though, are telling. You "look Greek," which could mean you're anything from Icelandic to Egyptian, Iranian to Moroccan.
I don't know when last there was a discussion about Palestine and Israel, which means it had to be quite a few months back, but it's an issue that sticks in your craw enough to remember what I apparently said. So, again, there's a stake here that you're working very, very hard not to claim. Your claims of being unbiased are transparently false and that is what I'm seeking to undermine.
Cerberus.Senkyuutai said: »
I'm not attempting, I'm literally explaining why they'd get into troubles.
And you're saying that people condemning a racist comedian is justification for the world hating, attacking, and killing them. What? What kind of hallucinogen is necessary to make that leap in logic? Goodness, yes, anti-Zionism never existed until some French git started making a career of anti-semitism and was charged under laws written and approved by the elected legislature. I'd possibly be more sympathetic to Dieudonné had he not spent the past 10 years proving right the originally dubious claims made against him. It wouldn't take a high school psych class to know that his problems with Jews goes back longer and deeper than a few disgruntled critics and a suit that was dismissed by the courts, given the way his hostility has increased over the years.
What is most intriguing is the way you keep trying to say that France is different from the United States (indeed, this was your first claim in this thread), yet pretty much everything indicates that, no, it isn't. Your deep loathing of Jewish people would fit you right in with certain neighborhoods in New York City. The claim that France abhors violence, though... that one is too good. It's like you guys want the world to believe all the jokes about French cowardice so that we won't remember your many bloody revolutions and literal centuries of warfare. Half my native language is French in origin and it sure wasn't because the Angles thought it'd sound nice and opted to borrow it.
Oh, wait, wasn't this about some Muslim terrorists shooting cartoonist? Why are we talking about Jews? Huh... who was it that decided to bring that red herring into this discussion? Can we maybe return to the subject of why murder is bad instead of trying to justify genocide? I find the two points to be somewhat at odds.
Shiva.Onorgul said: »
Has anyone else actually seen the cartoons in question? They're not justification for killing, but they are shockingly provocative. I can't imagine them being published in a US magazine. I'm fairly sure I've never seen a depiction of Jesus's *** and flaccid *** here in the US, anyhow.
Kinda makes the dubious controversy about Mohammed showing up in South Park and Family Guy several years ago seem rather pointless by comparison.
Kinda makes the dubious controversy about Mohammed showing up in South Park and Family Guy several years ago seem rather pointless by comparison.
The Danish cartoons that created such an issue from 2006 forward and led to violence are tamer (not sexual but inferring violence) but they still enraged the middle east.
Well, they enraged some fringe lunatics and the power-mongers who needed to keep their congregations in line, anyhow. But an adequately shaped ball of yarn can achieve that effect, as can a grilled cheese sandwich.
I know I'm not supposed to apply my culture's values to another culture, but something really bugs me about Charlie Hebdo's style. Having learned that the magazine has a limited readership and was in fiscal bad straits makes me somewhat less troubled. I'm used to varying levels of scathing comics, ranging from very on-the-nose to virtually impenetrable in their meaninglessness, but Charlie Hebdo just threw me for a loop. They seemed to be more stunt than anything else.
None of which justifies them being attacked. It's more I'm amazed they even had enough of a readership to attract an attack.
I know I'm not supposed to apply my culture's values to another culture, but something really bugs me about Charlie Hebdo's style. Having learned that the magazine has a limited readership and was in fiscal bad straits makes me somewhat less troubled. I'm used to varying levels of scathing comics, ranging from very on-the-nose to virtually impenetrable in their meaninglessness, but Charlie Hebdo just threw me for a loop. They seemed to be more stunt than anything else.
None of which justifies them being attacked. It's more I'm amazed they even had enough of a readership to attract an attack.
These threads are like arguing with a potato.
All of you are potato.
All of you are potato.
[+]
One of the three suspects turned himself in.
There are reports that two of the victims (one is a police officer) were Muslims.
There are reports that two of the victims (one is a police officer) were Muslims.
Ragnarok.Zeig said: »
One of the three suspects turned himself in.
There are reports that two of the victims (one is a police officer) were Muslims.
There are reports that two of the victims (one is a police officer) were Muslims.
There was also a Muslim among the journalists who died in the building.
http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/blame-for-charlie-hebdo-murders
http://www.newsweek.com/officer-shot-during-charlie-hebdo-massacre-identified-297603?piano_d=1
If you(generic person)so adamantly claim someone's post to be unintelligible then why do you respond to it pretending to have understood it? You either did or you didn't.
Also I didn't see Senkyuu justifying mass murder in his posts, but rather trying to get behind the sociological intricacies that might lead to a race-driven riot, or worse(which I find unlikely anyway).
When the populace is fed up with certain socio-economic situations it's easy to incite it against a scapegoat. And this shouldn't be news to anyone. However, I also think that we(as people of the world in general)know better by now than to give into that and thus consider Senk stance too dramatic.
Also I didn't see Senkyuu justifying mass murder in his posts, but rather trying to get behind the sociological intricacies that might lead to a race-driven riot, or worse(which I find unlikely anyway).
When the populace is fed up with certain socio-economic situations it's easy to incite it against a scapegoat. And this shouldn't be news to anyone. However, I also think that we(as people of the world in general)know better by now than to give into that and thus consider Senk stance too dramatic.
As for the topic, hopefully the murderers will be found quickly and brought to the court alive to face justice.
That's actually a serious issue in France as of late. Due to the recent attacks on Jews the number of Jews moving out of France to Israel has doubled in 2014 (heard that during the pre-christmas time on the radio).
Which movement? This is just one problem in one region, where barely any Muslim lives. (in Saxony only 0,1% are Muslims (2010 latest numbers)). In every other city/region they are vastly outnumbered. (Cologne 500 against 7500-8000, Berlin 300 against 5000 as examples)
No need to make it bigger than it is.
It's the same old racism in that region with a new scapegoat.
Valefor.Sehachan said: »
Oh god no, not the jews! NOT THE JEWS! *curls up on the floor*
Caitsith.Shiroi said: »
Germany's anti-islam movement is going to feed on this hardcore.
No need to make it bigger than it is.
It's the same old racism in that region with a new scapegoat.
I find it quite difficult to understand why people, in this day and age, still believe in religion. It's clearly a very old form of propaganda, and people still fall for it.
Bismarck.Leneth said: »
Valefor.Sehachan said: »
Oh god no, not the jews! NOT THE JEWS! *curls up on the floor*
I think Valls said he'd work on that, but I haven't heard of anything being done about it yet.
Cerberus.Spirachub said: »
I find it quite difficult to understand why people, in this day and age, still believe in religion. It's clearly a very old form of propaganda, and people still fall for it.
Just like there is as many reasons to not be religious as people who aren't.
Cerberus.Spirachub said: »
I find it quite difficult to understand why people, in this day and age, still believe in religion. It's clearly a very old form of propaganda, and people still fall for it.
Indoctrination and or stupidity/gullibility.
A lot of the issue is that people are weak, and can't handle reality and need their crutch.
There's plenty of reasons all right, none of which are really logical. But it can be mostly boiled down to indoctrination and proselytizing, without those it would just about die out within a few generations.
I'm expecting more zealot laws to be put on the books to persecute non-believers though, as some of the leaders aren't stupid, they'll lose their power if they don't try to keep it while they still have it.
I'm more curious as to why this thread (and the news articles) are titled this way, these are terrorists, yet they use the misnomer of "gunmen" to just push an agenda, cute.
Let me be on the record in condemning these attacks in the strongest way I can.
As muslims we can see the Quran clearly addresses what a measured reaction is when people either insult or ridicule the Quran or the prophet:
Quran 4:40
"And it has already come down to you in the Book that when you hear the verses of Allah [recited], they are denied [by them] and ridiculed; so do not sit with them until they enter into another conversation."
The Quran clearly states to remove yourself, not use violence let alone kill.
Quran 73:10
"And be patient over what they say and avoid them with gracious avoidance."
It is not a Muslim's role to judge others but only to judge himself and religion is not a political movement. There are no vanguards of Islam. An individual is a vanguard of himself and his own soul. One can only remind or inform others, but he cannot compel them.
Quran 6:69
"And those who fear Allah are not held accountable for the disbelievers at all, but [only for] a reminder - that perhaps they will fear Him."
We have a lot of uneducated, fanatic idiots who identify themselves as Muslims. They're no more a representation of the Quranic teachings than a KKK member is of the christian Bible.
As muslims we can see the Quran clearly addresses what a measured reaction is when people either insult or ridicule the Quran or the prophet:
Quran 4:40
"And it has already come down to you in the Book that when you hear the verses of Allah [recited], they are denied [by them] and ridiculed; so do not sit with them until they enter into another conversation."
The Quran clearly states to remove yourself, not use violence let alone kill.
Quran 73:10
"And be patient over what they say and avoid them with gracious avoidance."
It is not a Muslim's role to judge others but only to judge himself and religion is not a political movement. There are no vanguards of Islam. An individual is a vanguard of himself and his own soul. One can only remind or inform others, but he cannot compel them.
Quran 6:69
"And those who fear Allah are not held accountable for the disbelievers at all, but [only for] a reminder - that perhaps they will fear Him."
We have a lot of uneducated, fanatic idiots who identify themselves as Muslims. They're no more a representation of the Quranic teachings than a KKK member is of the christian Bible.
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