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Ebola Patient Coming to U.S.
 Bahamut.Kara
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3544
By Bahamut.Kara 2014-10-16 14:03:21
There was no Ebola in this country until the authorities allowed it to get in here in the first place. They are charged with keeping us safe, they are clearly incompetent at their jobs.
The solution is to completely close your border and cancel all flights until Ebola is eradicated from the world? I hope you are aware it could have been someone from any nationality who would have transmitted it.
It could have been, but it wasn't. You're right, it could end up being like the enterovirus that all the illegals brought up from Central America. That's all over the place now, kids have died from that. Do you really not see the danger here with president open borders and other liberals insisting on an America with no borders?
We should take measures to keep ebola out of the country. We should also cease the ridiculousness of proclaiming it isn't a threat, or that we're monumentally prepared for it when it clearly isn't true. Obama told west Africans the other day that Ebola wasn't something you could get on a public bus. Today we're banning suspects from taking mass transit.
It's just *** politics. what?
It was identified in 1962 in CA
Clusters of Acute Respiratory Illness Associated with Human Enterovirus 68 --- Asia, Europe, and United States, 2008--2010
 Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-16 14:07:00
The point is that you completely absolve the CDC of any responsibility in the fact that this woman (whom there were responsible for watching) was told by them that she could safely get on a plane with no cause for worry. Except the CDC did not say that.
Direct quote "Vinson was not told that she could not fly," said the spokesperson.
She was not barred from flying. She also wasn't given permission to fly (according to that quote).
Should the CDC have exercised some federal statue and barred her from flying? Are they allowed to do that in this situation? What if she only had a cold?
Guidelines say that she is to avoid public transit for 21 days after treating an ebola patient. She shouldn't have gone to Ohio on a plane to begin with and if she was constantly in contact with the CDC they should have emphasized that point multiple times.
But there are no penalties setup for disobeying the guidelines.
...“Although she (Vinson) did not report any symptoms and she did not meet the fever threshold of 100.4, she did report at that time she took her temperature and found it to be 99.5,” said CDC Director Tom Frieden. Her temperature coupled with the fact that she had been exposed to the virus should have prevented her from getting on the plane, he said. “I don’t think that changes the level of risk of people around her. She did not vomit, she was not bleeding, so the level of risk of people around her would be extremely low.”...
By Ramyrez 2014-10-16 14:08:35
In hindsight, do we wish they would have been better-trained and prepared for this? Yes.
Was this something the CDC should have been pressing facilities to be ready for? Eh. Maybe? It's easy to say "yes", but prior to this people were worried about the enterovirus going around and, in all honesty, probably still should be giving some focus to that as it's likely to cause more harm to Americans than Ebola.
You cannot prepare perfectly for every possible contingency. Sometimes things are going to be a reaction because something fell through the cracks.
It's awful, but it's true.
yeah, not a big fan of healthy children dying. There is also the sickness that is causing neural paralysis on top of D68 outbreaks. Experts unsure if the two are linked
http://news.yahoo.com/rare-respiratory-virus-paralysis-spreads-among-us-kids-224617119.html
I've heard to it refereed to as a kind of polio, the argument being that it is in the same family of pathology. Not sure to what extent it's true, but there's certainly a political reason to avoid calling it that.
It's not really a "political" reason, but a "public perception" reason. Look at the way we repond to "Ebola". It helps stem the unnecessary, potentially damaging panic that will inevitably ensue. C'mon Ramyerz, the biggest component of politics is public perception.
Except, it's not about benefitting any particular party on candidate. It's to stifle unnecessary panic and people jumping to idiotic conclusions. If the public perceives it to be the fault of the party in charge, that's politics baby! Don't pretend that that idea isn't right below the surface.
If the public (including you), perceive it to be the fault of political entities, you're idiots. But I've been saying people as a whole are idiots for years, so
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Server: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2014-10-16 14:08:39
but does she have super sweaty balls? or palms?
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-16 14:08:47
it could end up being like the enterovirus that all the illegals brought up from Central America
Obivously only people carrying the illegal gene can transmit diseases.
Obviously because they're a protected class means they can be held responsible.
Bahamut.Milamber
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3691
By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-16 14:10:21
I don't use it incorrectly, I am personally responsibly for telling people to question their faith in authority. (we're always exercising our personal responsibility - it was tongue in cheek to your attempt to argue against a straw man) 
No, you aren't always exercising personal responsibility. When you blame someone else for your actions or the consequences of your actions, you aren't exercising personal responsibility.
How are you personally responsible for telling people to question their faith in authority? What exactly are you responsible for?
I doubt the authority of cops frequently, that doesn't mean I ignore their lights behind me on the highway. One can still doubt their authority while they are exercising it. 
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Cerberus.Pleebo
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-10-16 14:13:41
So... she was asymptomatic while on the plane. Everybody panic?
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By Ramyrez 2014-10-16 14:14:10
The point is that you completely absolve the CDC of any responsibility in the fact that this woman (whom there were responsible for watching) was told by them that she could safely get on a plane with no cause for worry. Except the CDC did not say that.
Direct quote "Vinson was not told that she could not fly," said the spokesperson.
She was not barred from flying. She also wasn't given permission to fly (according to that quote).
Should the CDC have exercised some federal statue and barred her from flying? Are they allowed to do that in this situation? What if she only had a cold?
Guidelines say that she is to avoid public transit for 21 days after treating an ebola patient. She shouldn't have gone to Ohio on a plane to begin with and if she was constantly in contact with the CDC they should have emphasized that point multiple times.
But there are no penalties setup for disobeying the guidelines.
Ah, well. Misinformation going around then too, that Nausi's helping.
There we go right there.
We're back to one nurse not following -- or not knowing -- proper guidelines. And potentially flagrantly defying them. Which should probably be punishable by quite a bit.
Bahamut.Milamber
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3691
By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-16 14:16:39
You're right, it could end up being like the enterovirus that all the illegals brought up from Central America. . *** it Nausi, why don't you just go for broke, and blame it on truck-driving grenade-tossing earthquake-generating illegal-immigrating Ebola-infested Central-American-African dinosaur zombies? Because they certainly didn't get a visa.
Bahamut.Kara
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3544
By Bahamut.Kara 2014-10-16 14:22:00
The point is that you completely absolve the CDC of any responsibility in the fact that this woman (whom there were responsible for watching) was told by them that she could safely get on a plane with no cause for worry. Except the CDC did not say that.
Direct quote "Vinson was not told that she could not fly," said the spokesperson.
She was not barred from flying. She also wasn't given permission to fly (according to that quote).
Should the CDC have exercised some federal statue and barred her from flying? Are they allowed to do that in this situation? What if she only had a cold?
Guidelines say that she is to avoid public transit for 21 days after treating an ebola patient. She shouldn't have gone to Ohio on a plane to begin with and if she was constantly in contact with the CDC they should have emphasized that point multiple times.
But there are no penalties setup for disobeying the guidelines.
Ah, well. Misinformation going around then too, that Nausi's helping.
There we go right there.
We're back to one nurse not following -- or not knowing -- proper guidelines. And potentially flagrantly defying them. Which should probably be punishable by quite a bit.
As far as I've read she should have restricted herself from flying.
If the temperature was within the threshold of "high" the CDC could take legal action and quarantine her.
But I could be wrong.
Edit:
Quote: Frieden specifically noted that the remaining 75 healthcare workers who treated Thomas Duncan at Texas Health Presbyterian Hospital will not be allowed to fly. The CDC will work with local and state officials to accomplish this. The CDC has to get Federal and State officials to put people on lists to prevent flying. I'd be interested to see what statue this will be implemented under
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-16 14:27:19
You're right, it could end up being like the enterovirus that all the illegals brought up from Central America. . *** it Nausi, why don't you just go for broke, and blame it on truck-driving grenade-tossing earthquake-generating illegal-immigrating Ebola-infested Central-American-African dinosaur zombies? Because they certainly didn't get a visa.
Lets just welcome in 100-150 Ebola patients a day. It only takes like 20 health care workers to care for them.
Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-10-16 14:29:12
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »Can't wait till the gummint starts giving out FEMA trailers again, I could totally use one right about now. Did you know that people still live in those today even though they are not supposed to?
There were big time class action law suits related to the FEMA trailers provided because they contained asbestos and people were getting sick.
There was some controversy over who could join the class action suit though because some of the people that these were provided to were actually selling them to other people.
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By Jetackuu 2014-10-16 14:34:39
What did I first imply it was?
She is responsible for herself. She called the authority, sought permission, and the authority gave it to her. What did you want her to do, doubt the authority? Does anyone doubt the authority is the authority? They are the ones in charge of the welfare of the rest of us.
Yes. No. Yes, personal responsibility of not being a moron. Irrelevant. Not really.
As for the earlier plane ticket cost ***: *** you, and your wallet, if somebody else on that plane got it hopefully they sue her stupid *** as apparently that's the only way morons like you learn to not do something so HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE.
When an individual gets sick it's their responsibility and duty to take it upon themselves (several fold when it's a healthcare worker) to attempt to reduce the risk of transmission as best as possible. It is up to the CDC to restrict the movement of some illnesses if they're categorized as being dangerous enough, and they've done so in the past, this is not one of those "freak out and panic" cases.
You're confusing personal responsibility with your delusions again.
But the hypocrisy is hilarious, keep that up.
By Jetackuu 2014-10-16 14:37:28
So... she was asymptomatic while on the plane. Everybody panic? had a fever before she got on the plane, even if it was low.
Server: Bahamut
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Posts: 1155
By Bahamut.Soraishin 2014-10-16 14:43:25
she flew to atlanta right?
Bahamut.Milamber
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3691
By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-16 14:46:50
You're right, it could end up being like the enterovirus that all the illegals brought up from Central America. . *** it Nausi, why don't you just go for broke, and blame it on truck-driving grenade-tossing earthquake-generating illegal-immigrating Ebola-infested Central-American-African dinosaur zombies? Because they certainly didn't get a visa.
Lets just welcome in 100-150 Ebola patients a day. It only takes like 20 health care workers to care for them. Because those are clearly the potential choices/outcomes/consequences that are possible.
It isn't like the current outbreak started in March.
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-16 14:47:57
What did I first imply it was?
She is responsible for herself. She called the authority, sought permission, and the authority gave it to her. What did you want her to do, doubt the authority? Does anyone doubt the authority is the authority? They are the ones in charge of the welfare of the rest of us.
Yes. No. Yes, personal responsibility of not being a moron. Irrelevant. Not really.
As for the earlier plane ticket cost ***: *** you, and your wallet, if somebody else on that plane got it hopefully they sue her stupid *** as apparently that's the only way morons like you learn to not do something so HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE.
When an individual gets sick it's their responsibility and duty to take it upon themselves (several fold when it's a healthcare worker) to attempt to reduce the risk of transmission as best as possible. It is up to the CDC to restrict the movement of some illnesses if they're categorized as being dangerous enough, and they've done so in the past, this is not one of those "freak out and panic" cases.
You're confusing personal responsibility with your delusions again.
But the hypocrisy is hilarious, keep that up. Oops Jet called me a hypocrite, I'm ROFLing as we speak. I'm not canceling my plans so you don't have to get my strep. Call me a selfish *** if you must, but otherwise prepare yourself, take your "cold ease", and bring your hand sanitizer. You don't have the right to quarantine me for something as trivial as a strep, and my proximity to you on a plane places you in no mortal danger. Feel entitled to sue me if you must, but you're gonna end up *** off.
Cerberus.Pleebo
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-10-16 14:53:01
99.5 is technically not a fever, but given the full context of her situation, she should have been told not to fly. Still unsure of the power the CDC has in dealing with individuals like these.
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Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-10-16 14:53:57
I'm personally responsible for making sure you question authority but I'll be damned if I care if my plans got in the way of your health!
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Bahamut.Milamber
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3691
By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-16 15:00:05
What did I first imply it was?
She is responsible for herself. She called the authority, sought permission, and the authority gave it to her. What did you want her to do, doubt the authority? Does anyone doubt the authority is the authority? They are the ones in charge of the welfare of the rest of us.
Yes. No. Yes, personal responsibility of not being a moron. Irrelevant. Not really.
As for the earlier plane ticket cost ***: *** you, and your wallet, if somebody else on that plane got it hopefully they sue her stupid *** as apparently that's the only way morons like you learn to not do something so HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE.
When an individual gets sick it's their responsibility and duty to take it upon themselves (several fold when it's a healthcare worker) to attempt to reduce the risk of transmission as best as possible. It is up to the CDC to restrict the movement of some illnesses if they're categorized as being dangerous enough, and they've done so in the past, this is not one of those "freak out and panic" cases.
You're confusing personal responsibility with your delusions again.
But the hypocrisy is hilarious, keep that up. Oops Jet called me a hypocrite, I'm ROFLing as we speak. I'm not canceling my plans so you don't have to get my strep. Call me a selfish *** if you must, but otherwise prepare yourself, take your "cold ease", and bring your hand sanitizer. You don't have the right to quarantine me for something as trivial as a strep, and my proximity to you on a plane places you in no mortal danger. Feel entitled to sue me if you must, but you're gonna end up *** off. Uh, what?
You do realize that strep throat has some pretty serious potential consequences/potential following diseases? Particularly for children?
And you are the *** that wants to quarantine people for freaking scabies?
And that you, personally, by being such a type of ***, are increasing the financial burden of others, which may include visits to the emergency room, other doctor's visits, medicine, etc?
You really, really don't seem to get the concept of personal responsibility.
Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
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Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-10-16 15:02:49
I think he has "personal responsibility" mixed up with looking out for ol' #1 and only #1!
Server: Bahamut
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Posts: 1155
By Bahamut.Soraishin 2014-10-16 15:05:25
I think he has "personal responsibility" mixed up with looking out for ol' #1 and only #1!
Indeed, not sure why Jetacku is even humoring him at this point , cmon people
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Bahamut.Milamber
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3691
By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-16 15:20:21
By Blazed1979 2014-10-16 15:25:33
someone give me the short synopsis on the ebola situation in the states. I don't want to spend an hour back-reading.
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
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Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-16 15:30:18
someone give me the short synopsis on the ebola situation in the states. I don't want to spend an hour back-reading.
We're all gonna die and it's the CDC's fault.
Bahamut.Milamber
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3691
By Bahamut.Milamber 2014-10-16 15:32:39
someone give me the short synopsis on the ebola situation in the states. I don't want to spend an hour back-reading. Does not currently pose a significant risk or threat to everyday life.
Situation should be monitored for developments.
Situation will not achieve minimal risk until initial outbreak source is controlled.
By Blazed1979 2014-10-16 15:38:43
Was there another case of Ebola in the states though? (I've been away from civilization for the past week)
Lakshmi.Flavin
Server: Lakshmi
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By Lakshmi.Flavin 2014-10-16 15:42:10
Was there another case of Ebola in the states though? (I've been away from civilization for the past week) The original carrier and then two nurses.
Ragnarok.Nausi
Server: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2014-10-16 15:46:20
What did I first imply it was?
She is responsible for herself. She called the authority, sought permission, and the authority gave it to her. What did you want her to do, doubt the authority? Does anyone doubt the authority is the authority? They are the ones in charge of the welfare of the rest of us.
Yes. No. Yes, personal responsibility of not being a moron. Irrelevant. Not really.
As for the earlier plane ticket cost ***: *** you, and your wallet, if somebody else on that plane got it hopefully they sue her stupid *** as apparently that's the only way morons like you learn to not do something so HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE.
When an individual gets sick it's their responsibility and duty to take it upon themselves (several fold when it's a healthcare worker) to attempt to reduce the risk of transmission as best as possible. It is up to the CDC to restrict the movement of some illnesses if they're categorized as being dangerous enough, and they've done so in the past, this is not one of those "freak out and panic" cases.
You're confusing personal responsibility with your delusions again.
But the hypocrisy is hilarious, keep that up. Oops Jet called me a hypocrite, I'm ROFLing as we speak. I'm not canceling my plans so you don't have to get my strep. Call me a selfish *** if you must, but otherwise prepare yourself, take your "cold ease", and bring your hand sanitizer. You don't have the right to quarantine me for something as trivial as a strep, and my proximity to you on a plane places you in no mortal danger. Feel entitled to sue me if you must, but you're gonna end up *** off. Uh, what?
You do realize that strep throat has some pretty serious potential consequences/potential following diseases? Particularly for children?
And you are the *** that wants to quarantine people for freaking scabies?
And that you, personally, by being such a type of ***, are increasing the financial burden of others, which may include visits to the emergency room, other doctor's visits, medicine, etc?
You really, really don't seem to get the concept of personal responsibility. I get it far better than you do.
I recognize that I'm personally responsible for exposing people to my mild feverish illness on a plane, heads up Milamber, I'm not obligated to cancel my plans because I have strep or a cold. They could get it even if I don't even know I have it, or I could get on a plane and they could also get it from someone else on the plane too. If I choose to cancel my plans because of it or not, it's not any of your business.
Dire consequences from strep throat? I had strep numerous times as a kid. If left untreated I'm sure it could get terrible but me being responsible for exposure does not mean I'm responsible for it being left untreated. People are exposed to billions of germs every day. I don't get to blame my co-workers for my hospitalization because I didn't take care of myself when I got sick.
The fact that my existence is personally responsible for undoubtedly impacting other people in negative ways, doesn't mean I'm obligated to cease my existence, or obliged to live a life of positive contribution to other people's interest when it conflicts with my own.
I want the government to quarantine illegal immigrants for diseases like scabies and enterovirus 68 because they are bringing in risks to Americans that they otherwise would not be exposed too. That's what the government is for, to protect its citizens from external threats. That is a concept that just seems to sail right by you.
Reuters.com said: A U.S. aid worker who was infected with the deadly Ebola virus while working in West Africa will be flown to the United States to be treated in a high-security ward at Emory University Hospital in Atlanta, hospital officials said on Thursday.
The aid worker, whose name has not been released, will be moved in the next several days to a special isolation unit at Emory. The unit was set up in collaboration with the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
CDC spokeswoman Barbara Reynolds said her agency was working with the U.S. State Department to facilitate the transfer.
Reynolds said the CDC was not aware of any Ebola patient ever being treated in the United States, but five people in the past decade have entered the country with either Lassa Fever or Marburg Fever, hemorrhagic fevers similar to Ebola.
News of the transfer follows reports of the declining health of two infected U.S. aid workers, Dr. Kent Brantly and missionary Nancy Writebol, who contracted Ebola while working in Liberia on behalf of North Carolina-based Christian relief groups Samaritan's Purse and SIM.
CNN and ABC News reported that a second American infected with Ebola was to be flown to the United States. CNN identified the U.S.-bound patients as Brantly and Writebol. Reuters could not independently confirm the reports.
Amber Brantly, the wife of Dr. Brantly, said in a statement: "I remain hopeful and believing that Kent will be healed from this dreadful disease."
Earlier on Thursday, White House spokesman Josh Earnest said the State Department was working with the CDC on medical evacuations of infected American humanitarian aid workers.
The outbreak in West Africa is the worst in history, having killed more than 700 people since February. On Thursday, the CDC issued a travel advisory urging people to avoid all non-essential travel to Guinea, Liberia and Sierra Leone, the epicenter of the outbreak.
Brantly and Writebol "were in stable but grave" condition as of early Thursday morning, the relief organizations said. A spokeswoman for the groups could not confirm whether the patient being transferred to Emory was one of their aid workers.
CDC Director Dr. Thomas Frieden said in a conference call that transferring gravely ill patients has the potential to do more harm than good.
Meanwhile, the National Institutes of Health plans in mid-September to begin testing an experimental Ebola vaccine on people after seeing encouraging results in pre-clinical trials on monkeys, Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the NIH's allergy and infectious diseases unit, said in an email.
In its final stages, Ebola causes external and internal bleeding, vomiting and diarrhea. About 60 percent of people infected in the current outbreak are dying from the illness.
Writebol, 59, received an experimental drug doctors hope will improve her health, SIM said. Brantly, 33, received a unit of blood from a 14-year-old boy who survived Ebola with the help of Brantly's medical care, said Franklin Graham, president of Samaritan's Purse.
Frieden could not comment on the specifics of either treatment but said: "We have reviewed the evidence of the treatments out there and don't find any treatment that has proven effectiveness against Ebola."
Source
Not really sure how I feel about this.
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