Bahamut.Ravael said: »
You can't expect everyone to be smart with money though, unfortunately.
Random Politics & Religion #00
Random Politics & Religion #00
I just don't expect everyone to live in the same mold, but that's just me.
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Jetackuu said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
15/hr in NYC is nothing. You're still unable to pay rent / pay bills off that even on a 40 hour week so....
15*40 = 600 * 2 = $1200.
Average 1bed unsubsidized NYC rent = ~3k.
15*40 = 600 * 2 = $1200.
Average 1bed unsubsidized NYC rent = ~3k.
Uh, unless you're going for something that I don't understand, your math is off.
15*40 = 600 * 4 = $2400
Now, as far as the "average" 1 bedroom unsubsidized rent goes, that really isn't a good metric. There are some expensive and swanky 1 bedroom apartments in NYC that can throw off an average. If you're looking at whether or not $15 an hour is liveable, look at the average price for an apartment that a minimum wage worker would actually live in.
Health insurance
phone
electric
water
food
transportation (at least they don't have to have a car).
$15/hour isn't much $ anymore, this isn't 1992.
Perhaps. I make more than that, but I live off of less than that and I have a wife and two kids. Sure I don't live in NYC, but I don't live in a super cheap area either. You can't expect everyone to be smart with money though, unfortunately.
Dual income changes everything. You've got another full time provider (?) and with that comes more flexibility.
Factoring out Manhattan and Brooklyn, rents still ~1.2k/mo in the city average in the poorest sections. Considering the exploding affordable housing plans being put into place precisely because most people can't afford rent unless they sink 80% of their income into paying it, the cost of living adjustment on the minimum wage is a dent here at best.
Further you just said that the poorest can't save money so why wouldn't giving them more money be a good thing? No one spends more which facilitates economic growth. The stagnant middle class wages has been hitting suburbia hard and most people don't even have savings. But the poor spend. Through thick and thin.
70% of young people have no savings? Holy ***that's going to backbite us later. But how can you when costs are rising but pay ain't?
Lakshmi.Flavin said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
You can't expect everyone to be smart with money though, unfortunately.
It's all well and good that they want kids to be well rounded enough to have basic knowledge but they also need to be taught how to properly function in society and the consequences that come with some things.
A debt society doesn't want you to save. A debt society wants you to max out lines of credit and be beholden to creditors for the rest of your natural life. College, the pathway to the 'good' life has turned out to be a noose for many and in good American fashion, we blame 17 year olds with all the financial experience of a turnip.
So... why exactly would we teach savings? The status quo right now is to build good credit which lends itself to the machinations of credit card company schemes.
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Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
But how can you when costs are rising but pay ain't?
If I follow the government's lead I'll just spend my way out of debt by...accumulating more debt !
I've always been an advocate for small, frequent rises in the minimum wage based on inflation, with cities/states having the ability to adjust that based on their needs. I rarely see any arguments for that, though. It's usually people advocating for huge jumps or no change at all.
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Bahamut.Ravael said: »
I've always been an advocate for small, frequent rises in the minimum wage based on inflation, with cities/states having the ability to adjust that based on their needs. I rarely see any arguments for that, though. It's usually people advocating for huge jumps or no change at all.
Even at a national level.
So Billy at Burger King doesn't need 15 bucks an hour to flip a burger ?
I thought about it a bit if I was very wealthy I'd just attend college the rest of my life. And never graduate like Van Wilder.
I thought about it a bit if I was very wealthy I'd just attend college the rest of my life. And never graduate like Van Wilder.
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
I've always been an advocate for small, frequent rises in the minimum wage based on inflation, with cities/states having the ability to adjust that based on their needs. I rarely see any arguments for that, though. It's usually people advocating for huge jumps or no change at all.
The thing is, you can raise minimum wage but other wages aren't rising in tandem so people see things like Burgerflipper McGee making 15/hr at Wendy's while they're doing a private industry job with far more obligations and they're like "holy ***, that's not fair"
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Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
Dual income changes everything. You've got another full time provider (?) and with that comes more flexibility.
Nope, what I said earlier was based off of a single income.
Is there any other reason to get married besides dual income ?
Drama Torama said: »
Ragnarok.Nausi said: »
Why do you associate that with being far right? I'm pretty far into the right and I love pleasurable sex as much as any other guy.
Left and right are big groups. Surely you can concede that the "sex is for procreation only" crowd probably lives somewhere in the ultra-orthodox religious sects on the right.
I mean, it's not the hedonists on the left saying that.
Why do you assume all hedonists are left?
The need to borrow being a standard only further exacerbates the problem of people not making enough. Every case of debt isn't the Jonses maxing credit cards to install a new deck to make the neighborhood jealous.
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about. I say start up those FEMA camps already.
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Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
The need to borrow being a standard only further exacerbates the problem of people not making enough. Every case of debt isn't the Jonses maxing credit cards to install a new deck to make the neighborhood jealous.
Aha! I knew they couldn't afford that deck with Bob's income!
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
Bahamut.Ravael said: »
I've always been an advocate for small, frequent rises in the minimum wage based on inflation, with cities/states having the ability to adjust that based on their needs. I rarely see any arguments for that, though. It's usually people advocating for huge jumps or no change at all.
The thing is, you can raise minimum wage but other wages aren't rising in tandem so people see things like Burgerflipper McGee making 15/hr at Wendy's while they're doing a private industry job with far more obligations and they're like "holy ***, that's not fair"
Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about. I say start up those FEMA camps already.
I'd go live in the woods but the government won't even let you do that as the Una Bomber !
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Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
Considering the exploding affordable housing plans being put into place precisely because most people can't afford rent unless they sink 80% of their income into paying it
Anecodote incoming, take with salt:
I have a few friends who live and work in NYC. Both are gigging musicians (good ones, with an income comensurate to your average middle class worker) and one works another job on top of that teaching lessons through a music store.
They both really, really hate the 'affordable housing' initiatives because they're providing nicer houses to people paying less than what they can afford making significantly more money. And they don't get to qualify.
And in a place like NYC, it definitely knocks down the middle class earners as much as it does helps people working unskilled positions.
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Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
things
I've got the dentist paid off, maybe I'll send another 30 bones, but this time by fedex or ups, so it'll actually get there.
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Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about. I say start up those FEMA camps already.
I've been an advocate of recreating the Civillian Conservation Corps for years.
Can't find a job? We've got one for you fixing our highways and bridges, rebuilding after natural disasters, etc. Pay people directly and stop hiring shady *** contractors cutting quality to get a little more money out of that government contract.
Of course, it would mean able-bodied people would have to not be lazy.
That's hard.
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Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about. I say start up those FEMA camps already.
Your hippie ideas intrigue me I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter !
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Jetackuu said: »
Local is almost never the cheapest, especially anything from a small company that needs to make you know... a profit. When you're poor all that matters is $$$$$ not feel good economics. It's the job of lawmakers or gov't to incentivize local economic stimulation because the markets could care less if that chicken came from upstate or China.
Speaking of that, remember the shipping US chickens for processing in China then back to the US for purchase? Yeah...
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Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about. I say start up those FEMA camps already.
I was wondering where my hyperbole was. Yes, I'm sure people want everything to be free, permanent on demand *** and four arms to wield lightsabers from while shouting "HAVE AT THEE, MORTAL".
But maybe that's just me.
Back in reality, wages be an issue yo.
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Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about.
No generally people aren't going to be happy when they're required to slave away to make a living. Especially when that end game is so uncertain.
When companies stop *** over loyal employees who've worked for decades just to outsource the labor to Mexico and destroying their retirement and similar situations, you'll have more people content. Sure some people (like you) can work on the contract basis and make ends meet and have it stable enough to where you don't have to worry about anything. Others have families to support to where if they're out of work for a few months it could mean losing everything.
Granted that's a compound as *** issue that doesn't have a simple fix, but you can start to see why people are pissed off.
Yea but discussing reality is kind of a downer !
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
Jetackuu said: »
Local is almost never the cheapest, especially anything from a small company that needs to make you know... a profit. When you're poor all that matters is $$$$$ not feel good economics. It's the job of lawmakers or gov't to incentivize local economic stimulation because the markets could care less if that chicken came from upstate or China.
Speaking of that, remember the shipping US chickens for processing in China then back to the US for purchase? Yeah...
Lakshmi.Sparthosx said: »
Back in reality, wages be an issue yo.
fonewear said: »
Yea but discussing reality is kind of a downer !
Life is a downer, man.
Ramyrez said: »
Leviathan.Chaosx said: »
People aren't going to be happy until everything is free and they don't have to work if they don't want to. Even then, they'll still find something to *** about. I say start up those FEMA camps already.
I've been an advocate of recreating the Civillian Conservation Corps for years.
Can't find a job? We've got one for you fixing our highways and bridges, rebuilding after natural disasters, etc. Pay people directly and stop hiring shady *** contractors cutting quality to get a little more money out of that government contract.
Of course, it would mean able-bodied people would have to not be lazy.
That's hard.
That sounds too much like work and not sitting on my *** !
In the future roads and bridges will be fixed by robots.
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