Random Politics & Religion #00 |
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Random Politics & Religion #00
Ramyrez said: » Homeless shelters are woefully inadequate and have many, many shortcomings and problems that some people would rather brave freezing to death than go there. That you don't understand that one fact alone is enough to question anything assertions you make of the homeless. They're also pretty well known for being breeding grounds for communicable diseases.
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Ragnarok.Nausi said: » Which is also why the guy is so dangerous for America and her people. Ah. America is a "she" in your eyes. No wonder you wish to exert such control over what goes in and out of it. At least you're consistent!
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Valefor.Sehachan said: » Jassik said: » Everyone's history shapes who they are. Don't minimize someone else's hardship or boil their motivations down to cowardice unless you want to be under the microscope yourself. I'm sorry this upsets Rooks sense of heroism, but it's not about me, it's what they do. People were talking about the motivation to go down that road. It's not untrue what you said, they have found drugs in the system of some terrorists. What caught people's ire was minimizing the desperation of the terrorists, saying they need drugs to do it. Valefor.Sehachan said: » Jassik said: » Everyone's history shapes who they are. Don't minimize someone else's hardship or boil their motivations down to cowardice unless you want to be under the microscope yourself. I'm sorry this upsets Rooks sense of heroism, but it's not about me, it's what they do. My sense of heroism? What on earth makes you think I find that heroic? It's a desperate response to incredible adversity, a concerned rat biting with its last gasp. That speaks to a lot of complicated emotions, but heroism doesn't really factor in. And I didn't make this about you, you made it about you. You made a blanket statement, it's wrong, I pointed out why it's wrong. I've made it a point not to bring your upbringing into it other than to point out that you don't really have a frame of reference for these peoples' mindsets, which, again, you do not. Even I don't, I've just got a better view of it than most (I hope, anyway. It sucked and I hope most of you didn't have that.)
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Well excuse me but the ab auctoritate argument that Rooks used is just as wrong, because if he's still here with us it means he doesn't know either what it takes to blow yourself up. He might need the drug too, we can only go by what we witness as outsiders.
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Drama Torama said: » you made it about you As for the rest, I already replied to J. Jassik said: » Asura.Kingnobody said: » A fair point. I'm not going to deny that there is poverty in America. Maybe being up at 2 A.M. watching the National Geographic channel that shows true poverty makes me a little skeptic about poverty in America, who knows. I'm just pointing out that we, here in America, have it much much MUCH better than those do in Africa. Nobody is saying that we don't. But statements like "there's no homeless people in Buffalo" make you sound like a crazy person. In all likelihood I'm betting KN means that there are no people who aren't homeless by choice. There's always going to be idiots who choose to be self destructive and therefore are homeless. We all have sympathy for them, but disagree on how best to help them. Why do I get the feeling there are some people around here who really, really sympathize with pre-ghosts-visit Ebenezer Scrooge and consider the ghosts to be a villainous socialist influence trying to part a good man from his well-earned money?
Valefor.Sehachan said: » Well excuse me but the ab auctoritate argument that Rooks used is just as wrong, because if he's still here with us it means he doesn't know either what it takes to blow yourself up. He might need the drug too, we can only go by what we witness as outsiders. I found (through hard work, some luck, some inborn talent, and a lot of help from the government) a way out. Not everyone gets that chance, you know.
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Btw there are a lot of stories of isis fighters who just abandoned their families to join the cause, so let's not make the blanket statement that these guys are all carebears.
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Valefor.Sehachan said: » Drama Torama said: » you made it about you As for the rest, I already replied to J. Frankly at this point I think all three of you (that is, Seha, Rooks, Jassik) are going around about a few select wording issues and a slight lack of clarification. Valefor.Sehachan said: » Btw there are a lot of stories of isis fighters who just abandoned their families to join the cause, so let's not make the blanket statement that these guys are all carebears. All we're saying is that while we detest their actions (and them, really), their motivations aren't necessarily hard to understand, which was the initial question asked by Volk. Ragnarok.Nausi said: » Jassik said: » Asura.Kingnobody said: » A fair point. I'm not going to deny that there is poverty in America. Maybe being up at 2 A.M. watching the National Geographic channel that shows true poverty makes me a little skeptic about poverty in America, who knows. I'm just pointing out that we, here in America, have it much much MUCH better than those do in Africa. Nobody is saying that we don't. But statements like "there's no homeless people in Buffalo" make you sound like a crazy person. In all likelihood I'm betting KN means that there are no people who aren't homeless by choice. There's always going to be idiots who choose to be self destructive and therefore are homeless. We all have sympathy for them, but disagree on how best to help them. Not many people are homeless by choice. Some because of bad luck and bad decisions, others because of substance abuse, many because of medical issues like mental illness. You can't write off a stupid statement like his with another stupid one like yours.
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Hillary in the ultimate display of denial says Muslims are ‘Peaceful and Tolerant,’ Have ‘Nothing Whatsoever to Do With Terrorism’.
She's the gift that keeps on giving. Ragnarok.Nausi said: » Hillary in the ultimate display of denial says Muslims are ‘Peaceful and Tolerant,’ Have ‘Nothing Whatsoever to Do With Terrorism’. She's the gift that keeps on giving. Buckle up then because she's probably going to be giving for eight years. Edit: Well, at least four. And I know you don't believe it, but I'm really not much happier about that than you are. Drama Torama said: » Valefor.Sehachan said: » Well excuse me but the ab auctoritate argument that Rooks used is just as wrong, because if he's still here with us it means he doesn't know either what it takes to blow yourself up. He might need the drug too, we can only go by what we witness as outsiders. I found (through hard work, some luck, some inborn talent, and a lot of help from the government) a way out. Not everyone gets that chance, you know. They still used drugs. The hell do you want with me, I didn't tell them to do it. Jassik said: » Not many people are homeless by choice. Some because of bad luck and bad decisions, others because of substance abuse, many because of medical issues like mental illness. You can't write off a stupid statement like his with another stupid one like yours. They both view pretty much all of that as a choice, though. Rightly or wrongly. But in that light, they feel justified in their resulting opinion on the subject. It's a very comfortable way to live your life, with such certainty that you've earned everything you have and the more unfortunate are merely products of their own doing. Makes it a lot easier to go about your day judging others. If I had been so lucky I'd probably feel the same way, honestly. When I was 14 and had all the answers I felt quite similar.
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Jassik said: » Asura.Kingnobody said: » A fair point. I'm not going to deny that there is poverty in America. Maybe being up at 2 A.M. watching the National Geographic channel that shows true poverty makes me a little skeptic about poverty in America, who knows. I'm just pointing out that we, here in America, have it much much MUCH better than those do in Africa. Nobody is saying that we don't. But statements like "there's no homeless people in Buffalo" make you sound like a crazy person. Oh wait, that's twisting words around. But I was told that I was the only one who did that. I know KN answered this before, but despite that I still don't understand the concept of being homeless by choice. It doesn't make sense to me.
Jassik said: » Ragnarok.Nausi said: » Jassik said: » Asura.Kingnobody said: » A fair point. I'm not going to deny that there is poverty in America. Maybe being up at 2 A.M. watching the National Geographic channel that shows true poverty makes me a little skeptic about poverty in America, who knows. I'm just pointing out that we, here in America, have it much much MUCH better than those do in Africa. Nobody is saying that we don't. But statements like "there's no homeless people in Buffalo" make you sound like a crazy person. In all likelihood I'm betting KN means that there are no people who aren't homeless by choice. There's always going to be idiots who choose to be self destructive and therefore are homeless. We all have sympathy for them, but disagree on how best to help them. Not many people are homeless by choice. Some because of bad luck and bad decisions, others because of substance abuse, many because of medical issues like mental illness. You can't write off a stupid statement like his with another stupid one like yours. Substance abuse is a choice, bad decisions are a choice. Bad luck isn't and mental illness can go either way, as people who refuse help are making that choice. People who choose to be homeless through their choices make the vast majority of them and you in no way help them by coddling them. I (theoretically) help the crack head begging for money on the street corner by refusing to subsidize their bad decisions than you do by giving them money to further destroy themselves. Ramyrez said: » It's like reading an EULA. Hard to understand? No. Lengthy and easy to miss fine print because who in their right mind has time to read all of that? Sometimes. Asura.Kingnobody said: » When did I say that? Oh wait, that's twisting words around. But I was told that I was the only one who did that. Asura.Kingnobody said: » You are right, they don't have to face freezing to death during a Buffalo winter because they *shock* don't exist in Buffalo. Neither does most homeless people either, because *shock* they would be in shelters to protect them from said winters. It's really not twisting anything. It's very easy to infer that from what you've said there. I understand you didn't say exactly that, but again, it's very easy to infer and it's not that far from what you did actually say. Valefor.Sehachan said: » I know KN answered this before, but despite that I still don't understand the concept of being homeless by choice. It doesn't make sense to me. Shooting oneself in the foot doesn't make sense to me, but I know that there are others that still do it. Jetackuu said: » Ramyrez said: » It's like reading an EULA. Hard to understand? No. Lengthy and easy to miss fine print because who in their right mind has time to read all of that? Sometimes. I rest my case. No one on this forum -- especially this thread -- could ever be mistaken for being in their right mind.
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Jetackuu said: » Valefor.Sehachan said: » I know KN answered this before, but despite that I still don't understand the concept of being homeless by choice. It doesn't make sense to me. Shooting oneself in the foot doesn't make sense to me, but I know that there are others that still do it. Some of them are just open carry advocates who slipped after loading up their plate at the Cracker Barrel buffet.
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I don't think I ever had a right mind to begin with.
Ramyrez said: » Jetackuu said: » Ramyrez said: » It's like reading an EULA. Hard to understand? No. Lengthy and easy to miss fine print because who in their right mind has time to read all of that? Sometimes. I rest my case. No one on this forum -- especially this thread -- could ever be mistaken for being in their right mind. Glad you caught on to that. :D Ramyrez said: » Ragnarok.Nausi said: » Hillary in the ultimate display of denial says Muslims are ‘Peaceful and Tolerant,’ Have ‘Nothing Whatsoever to Do With Terrorism’. She's the gift that keeps on giving. Buckle up then because she's probably going to be giving for eight years. Edit: Well, at least four. And I know you don't believe it, but I'm really not much happier about that than you are. If you give the people the choice of "Muslims have nothing to do with terrorism" vs. "lets round up all the Muslims and kick em out" people are going to drift towards the less dangerous option. Ramyrez said: » Jetackuu said: » Valefor.Sehachan said: » I know KN answered this before, but despite that I still don't understand the concept of being homeless by choice. It doesn't make sense to me. Shooting oneself in the foot doesn't make sense to me, but I know that there are others that still do it. Some of them are just open carry advocates who slipped after loading up their plate at the Cracker Barrel buffet. I meant willingly, not accidental. But then again I question the upkeep of the firearm if a mere impact were able to set it off. |
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