Overall Battle System Adjustments For The Future
Overall Battle System Adjustments for the Future
AltimaOmega missed a Resolution as DRK in NNI 100 boss >_>, we lol'd
I think I've only missed a CDC when something has perfect dodged right as I ready it!
Missed a Ukko's before though!
Oh and when I used to do Salvage this guy missed Fudo so much it became a running joke (was before Shoha existed).
Missed a Ukko's before though!
Oh and when I used to do Salvage this guy missed Fudo so much it became a running joke (was before Shoha existed).
Ok ... Does anyone know if this update will affect BLU spells? IE are blue spells affected greatly by a targets level (I know mobs def factors in but eh) like with Weapon skils? Because if they remove the level correction BS and it does affect BLU, this might see BLU being more effective, minus the inability to greatly raise BLU attack.
Cerberus.Tidis said: »
Oh and when I used to do Salvage this guy missed Fudo so much it became a running joke (was before Shoha existed).
oh lawdy dont even get me started
Accuracy penalty? Welcome to pre-2hander update.
Talk of 2H accuracy made me think of...
Hey at least we're not Dragoons...
YouTube Video Placeholder
Hey at least we're not Dragoons...
Cerberus.Kvazz said: »
Fenrir.Sylow said: »
2h weapons should have a severe accuracy penalty or something. It has to be harder to swing a great axe and hit something than to stab it with a dagger!
Accuracy decreases exponentially depending on how much TP you have and how many job abilities are up... if you have 300 TP and just used zerk/gressor/warcry/WC, you WILL miss the first hit of Ukko's.
Bismarck.Ihina said: »
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Bismarck.Ihina said: »
Quote:
In the event that you jump into battles and pay no attention to your defense, you will take damage for nearly two-times the amount that it is now, so the way the job is played will change.
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Cerberus.Conagh said: »
Ok ... Does anyone know if this update will affect BLU spells? IE are blue spells affected greatly by a targets level (I know mobs def factors in but eh) like with Weapon skils? Because if they remove the level correction BS and it does affect BLU, this might see BLU being more effective, minus the inability to greatly raise BLU attack.
The change will most negatively impact whatever has the lowest attack. That would be physical blue magic.
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Cerberus.Conagh said: »
Ok ... Does anyone know if this update will affect BLU spells? IE are blue spells affected greatly by a targets level (I know mobs def factors in but eh) like with Weapon skils? Because if they remove the level correction BS and it does affect BLU, this might see BLU being more effective, minus the inability to greatly raise BLU attack.
The change will most negatively impact whatever has the lowest attack. That would be physical blue magic.
Certain BLU spells have an attack bonus based on TP IE with use of efflux/CHain affinity so ie Amorphic spikes which is thought to be a 300% ATtack bonus at 350 tp would this be affected bady or positively in this update?
So many Typos not enough time
I know all about attack bonuses... I've been part of testing most of them. Amorphic Spikes is not a 300% attack bonus at 350TP, and even if it was it would be only during azure lore. No spell has a high enough attack bonus by itself to let it overcome severe defense differences, however Vanity Dive and Goblin Rush should come close.
Siren.Kalilla said: »
Idea
Increase the cap value for the numbers calculated from the attack/defense ratio.
Damage received while defense is low will be larger.
Increase the cap value for the numbers calculated from the attack/defense ratio.
Damage received while defense is low will be larger.
01-23-2013 01:58 PM
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| Greetings! Since there has been a lot of feedback and questions regarding level correction, I’d like to take this opportunity to add a bit to what we mentioned last week about how we are looking into eliminating level correction. This level correction is what we will be using to make it so that when you increase your defense the damage you take will be reduced. In other words, the level correction will be focused on the monsters' attack power. Since we will not be making any changes to the level correction in regards to monster defense, damage towards higher level enemies will not see an increase from the level correction adjustments. Completely getting rid of level correction would make it easy at low levels to defeat monsters that have a difference of 20 levels or more. With that said, from your character's perspective, these changes will only really be applicable to higher level monsters, and easy prey monsters or other lower level monsters will not become weaker. However, depending on the attack/defense ratio there may be variations. We also understand that the current attack/defense ratio cap for single-handed and two-handed weapons is 2 and 2.25 respectively, and an idea was raised to set them both to 2.25. We will need to examine whether this value is good enough or if we need to make further changes in advance before we proceed with this adjustment. Now to answer some questions…
Currently we do not have any plans to make adjustments to these kinds of weapon skills.
We understand the concerns associated with this and there is a possibility that we will be making separate adjustments to Counterstance. As a final note, we do not have any plans at the moment to make adjustments to weapons that deal non-elemental damage; however, we do realize that they are extremely strong. Though this is speaking more about the future, since we will be introducing items that have a higher damage value, we expect that these weapons will not be something that are used full-time, and the situations for use will become limited. In regards to the way we create monsters, we will still be adding features to them like you can see currently, where some monsters will be weak against piercing, while others weak against blunt damage or physical damage in general. However, instead of making it so you can only do damage via a certain method of attacking, we feel it would be better to create them so certain attack methods yield even more damage. To get a better idea of what we are talking about, Qutrub are a perfect example. Also, the possibility that we add more weapons that deal non-elemental damage is extremely low. Now then, just to wrap stuff up, below is a TL;DR version of the basic plan for these adjustments. Please keep in mind that none of this is finalized.
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[+]
/dusts off Defender macro
//sheds single tear
//sheds single tear
lolRedemption
Slycer's translation seems to include a lot more information, so I'll get that one up in a few minutes as well.
[+]
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
Definitely looking forward to it. Less people clogging up my alliances with their gimpery
Quetzacoatl said: »
Accuracy penalty? Welcome to pre-2hander update.
Blame bandwagon RCB's.
Love when SE makes these type adjustments and viola a new king of the hill is created overnight for peeps to cry NERF about stay tuned....
If they put dual wield weapons on the same max pDIF as two-handers, we'll be put back exactly where we were before the two-handed update, with two-handed weapons being garbage. That's the stupidest ***I've ever heard.
01-23-2013 11:50 AM
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| Based on the previous posts [see below, posts #163-#165 in this thread], we've readjusted and clarified our proposal (summarized below). Since none of this has yet been confirmed, please check out the original post for the basis. Proposals
There are no plans at the moment to make any adjustments to weapons that deal non-attribute damage. We understand that these weapons are very strong (Matsui was weeping...). We mentioned this a little while ago, but in the areas of equipment, based on the fact that we will continue to add a large amount of weapons with higher DMG values, the use of these should gradually become more and more limited. Regarding monsters, we've had features like monsters vulnerable to blunt, or piercing, or physical attacks in general, but rather than limiting the damage of attacks that aren't specific weaknesses, we believe it would be a better direction to increase the damage dealt by specific kinds of attacks (think about Qutrubs, for example). Based on this, the likelihood that we will continue to add weapons that deal non-attribute damage is extremely low. We hope this addresses some of your concerns so far.
In my previous post, I mentioned that we were considering that we might "eliminate level difference correction." What the term "level difference correction" was intended to mean was that we would ensure that the damage taken is reduced by increasing defense. In other words, we meant "level difference correction to monster attack power." As far as your concerns such as ranged attacks becoming far more effective by removing the level correction, there are no plans to make any adjustments to "level difference correction to monster defense power." If we completely eliminated level difference correction, from the point of view of low-level players, there would be a concern that monsters with a very different level (>= +20 levels) would be far too easily defeated.
The level difference correction is only effective for monsters that are high levels as compared to players. It does not affect monsters that are near the same level as the player. So, do not think that you will suddenly take more damage from higher level monsters and weaker monsters will suddenly be effortless battles. However, we will also be adjusting the attack/defense ratio. If you are closer to the monster's level and you raise your defense above the typical ~500, the ratio will be better adjusted in your favor and the damage taken will be lowered. On the other hand, if your defense is significantly lower, the damage taken will increase. The idea is to give a benefit to defense so that defense will lower risk more than ever before. We will support this with abilities and additionally with new types of equipment and food.
As part of the adjustment, the attack/defense ratio limit will be increased to 2.25 for one-handed weapons (like two-handed weapons). Whether this is a good value or whether you want further adjustment, please let us know.
At present, we do not plan to make any adjustments to weapon skills that ignore enemy defense.
For Counterstance, it is possible that we will make a separate adjustment.
Please regard the level difference correction as a modification to monster attack power. We are separately considering making the modification to raise the upper limit on the attack/defense ratio for one-handed weapons to be equal to that of two-handed weapons, which should allow or one-handed weapons to be a weapon of choice in more situations.
For back line jobs, the main role can be done at a distance, so you should be able to reduce the frequency of taking damage as compared to front-line jobs. However, we will include new effects such as support from party members and food effects, and at the same time, for future monsters implemented, we will pay close attention to the amount of damage and range of damage dealt by monster skills. Translated by: Slycer | |||||||||||
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About 1/3 of the way into Kalilla's quoted post I made a mistake, should say "damage taken is reduced by increasing defense" of course. Just wanted to clarify.
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kk I'll make the change :)
Remora.Brain said: »
If they put dual wield weapons on the same max pDIF as two-handers, we'll be put back exactly where we were before the two-handed update, with two-handed weapons being garbage. That's the stupidest ***I've ever heard.
This is the best ***I've ever heard.
Though I don't think the adjustment will make as big of a difference as you're implying without adjusting STR/DEX Attack/Accuracy values as well.
Definitely a nice adjustment for my BLU though. Now, I just need recycle adjustments for RNG and I'll be happy.
Edit: wrote defense instead of accuracy
It may just be how tired I am but I'm having a very hard time comprehending what is in those Dev posts. Could anyone clarify in a few short and simple words?
Mookies said: »
It may just be how tired I am but I'm having a very hard time comprehending what is in those Dev posts. Could anyone clarify in a few short and simple words?
Quote:
Now then, just to wrap stuff up, below is a TL;DR version of the basic plan for these adjustments. Please keep in mind that none of this is finalized.
Attack/defense ratio adjustment plan
- Increase the cap value for the numbers calculated from the attack/defense ratio.
- Make adjustments so that when a player’s defense is low, damage taken will increase.
- Increase the cap of the attack/defense ratio for single-handed weapons.
- Look into increasing this to 2.25, the same attack/defense ratio of two-handed weapons.
- Increase the cap value for the numbers calculated from the attack/defense ratio.
Level correction adjustment plan
- Level correction for monsters’ attack power
- Make adjustments so when a player’s defense is high, damage taken will be reduced.
- Make adjustments to monsters’ strength via parameters
- Monsters created after Seekers of Adoulin will be made at a level where there is no level correction, and when higher level monsters are created modification will be placed on attack, defense, and stats.
- Level correction for monsters’ attack power
Bismarck.Helel said: »
Remora.Brain said: »
If they put dual wield weapons on the same max pDIF as two-handers, we'll be put back exactly where we were before the two-handed update, with two-handed weapons being garbage. That's the stupidest ***I've ever heard.
This is the best ***I've ever heard.
Though I don't think the adjustment will make as big of a difference as you're implying without adjusting STR/DEX Attack/Defense values as well.
Definitely a nice adjustment for my BLU though. Now, I just need recycle adjustments for RNG and I'll be happy.
back to viking mode on drk. wielding axes and swords.
Yeah, this isn't going to restore DW-onry times because:
1) Dual Wield grants much less Delay reduction at 99 with buffs than it did at 75 with buffs due to increases in Haste buff potency (Capped Victory March, another +3 March in gear, etc.) For Dancer in particular, Dual wield only brings us from 78.3 to 80% delay reduction when fully buffed.
2) Monsters have high defense, to the extent that Dual Wield jobs will not be capping Ratio on them without large attack buffs / defense down debuffs. 1H jobs lack native attack buffs (like Last Resort and Berserk), so they have to get their attack from their subjobs and they start with less due to the STR/Atk conversion ratio.
1) Dual Wield grants much less Delay reduction at 99 with buffs than it did at 75 with buffs due to increases in Haste buff potency (Capped Victory March, another +3 March in gear, etc.) For Dancer in particular, Dual wield only brings us from 78.3 to 80% delay reduction when fully buffed.
2) Monsters have high defense, to the extent that Dual Wield jobs will not be capping Ratio on them without large attack buffs / defense down debuffs. 1H jobs lack native attack buffs (like Last Resort and Berserk), so they have to get their attack from their subjobs and they start with less due to the STR/Atk conversion ratio.
[+]
Siren.Kalilla said: »
Attack/defense ratio adjustment plan
- Increase the cap value for the numbers calculated from the attack/defense ratio.
- Make adjustments so that when a player’s defense is low, damage taken will increase.
- Increase the cap of the attack/defense ratio for single-handed weapons.
- Look into increasing this to 2.25, the same attack/defense ratio of two-handed weapons.
- Increase the cap value for the numbers calculated from the attack/defense ratio.
Level correction adjustment plan
- Level correction for monsters’ attack power
- Make adjustments so when a player’s defense is high, damage taken will be reduced.
- Make adjustments to monsters’ strength via parameters
- Monsters created after Seekers of Adoulin will be made at a level where there is no level correction, and when higher level monsters are created modification will be placed on attack, defense, and stats.
- Level correction for monsters’ attack power
Isn't that kinda odd? Shouldn't it just stay the same?
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