Overall Battle System Adjustments For The Future

Sad. 1h jobs already take it in the shorts, why not give them that?

01-16-2013 08:09 AM [BG source] [JP source]
Slycer BG Translator		Hello! Thanks for your feedback. We've taken a look at the feedback we've received about the possible adjustments and we'd like to address a few of the questions that have been raised. Even though the proposal mentions that the adjustment is specifically for DRK, assuming the Haste from Last Resort will apply to one-handed weapons, I think the combination of the one-handed weapon correction you mention in the post plus strengthening Last Resort will be enoug for one-handed weapons to catch up with two-handed weapons. Hold on a minute...because of Dual Wield I have close to 80% delay reduction... does this mean I can cut some of the Dual Wield for one-handed weapons? The Haste effect planned to be granted to Last Resort will, along with that of Desperate Blows, only be applicable to two-handed weapons. The overlap of the effects would be too significant if the delay reduction applied to one-handed weapons (because of Dual Wield) or to hand-to-hand weapons (because of Martial Arts). I'm afraid that adjustments to hand-to-hand weapons are going to get lost in the mix between one-handed and two-handed adjustments. In the adjustments regarding balancing one-handed and two-handed melee weapons, hand-to-hand weapons will also be included and considered along with one-handed weapons. However, since the performance of one-handed and hand-to-hand weapons differ significantly, they won't be treated uniformly (for example, the adjustment of "increasing the correction value of the one-handed weapon in the main weapon slot" which was talked about previously will be significantly different for hand-to-hand weapons). Considering the unique circumstances around hand-to-hand, we will continue to make the adjustments separately. Regarding elemental magic, would this also hold true for magic casted by automatons? The elemental magic adjustment does also apply to magic used by the automaton. [[edited:]] While stats can be raised on the automaton, it's easy to Overload while doing so, and we will take this into account when we look at the balance of the adjustment. Translated by: Slycer
Subscribe

Worthless

LR only on 2handed? Sam onry.

People are surprised? Really?

Mfw stupid questions

I support 1 handed jobs getting a buff, but you can do that with fencer. Dual weild changes the 1 handed dps too much to give them the same kind of att and acc rating. And anyone who doesn't see the logic in that... Go swing around 20 lbs with one hand, then 20 in each, then 20 with both hands. Tell me what setup gives you the most control and power.

You're playing a game that involves dragons, floating fish, and calling meteors down from a pocket dimension and you're seriously trying to use real world logic to justify poor game design?

lol

As someone who actually fences in real life with ~16-17 c. styled weaponry they aren't 20# a hand. A period rapier is ~ 4-6# with a dagger much less. I regularly fight both single and sword/dagger and feel more coordinated with something in my offhand actually.

But when's the last time a video game was based off real life <.<

I can get that kind of logic for something like axes and full bladed swords meant for slashing. Smaller things meant for piercing or daggers don't fit your analogy.

Largest claymore in history is 23 lbs. You won't be swinging a Claymore with one hand, but a Rapier isn't anywhere near that weight.

Yeah, but wasn't that really their rationale for the 2h update to begin with? More force with 2h over 1h? Idk if that was it exactly, but the logic around it makes sense. Just because a game is fantasy, doesn't mean it can't have some aspects of logic or realism either though... We do walk on the ground instead of fly everywhere.... There are limitations and realism/logic behind not being able to, or being able to do certain things in-game.

It actually kind of scares me how they make note multiple times about how the will treat 1h and h2h differently.

Makes it seem like mnk will get left behind in the update.

I fully agree weapons should be treated differently. A dagger or rapier should have far higher accuracy than something the size of an axe, and an axe should definitely have a higher attack rating than a dagger. Fantasy or not, a giant 2 handed axe like ukon is going to do more damage than a friggin dagger, and you have no understanding of balance if toy think a dual wielding job should be given the same weight in attack and accuracy as a 2 handed job.

Dev team saw pchan and they were all like... "We should totally *** with this guy."

Their justification is pretty *** stupid btw. I also like how they're attempting to even the playing field between 1h and 2h by buffing 2h further. Not that it'd make a huge difference in high buff situations where the crux of the problem lies to begin with, but still. iMad

Am I reading this wrong? In the same post it looks like you're saying 1h should have higher accuracy, and then saying that they shouldn't have as high of accuracy.

Also, your post is just faulty in general. Attack rating has nothing to do with the weapon and everything to do with the person wielding it. What you are thinking of is weapon damage. It's already true that 2H weapons have much higher damage than 1H weapons. Attack rating is a seperate feature that doesn't even fit with your desire to equate real world logic to a fantasy game.

Attack rating is actually dependent on the weapon, but that aside...

I'd be more happy with 1h weapons getting their own bonuses, like increased critical hit rate/damage or something. Fencer working while Dual Wielding would be nice too

STR/DEX conversion isn't the big deal here, it's gear and JAs. 1h weapons/jobs need something to mitigate that edge.

Could this be why an Ukon has a higher damage rating and rapiers/daggers are faster?

Shocking I know.

Axes are 1 handed, I'm comparing apples to apples. I don't believe that a 1 handed weapon is even in the same category in terms of how base stats affect its accuracy or attack. A tiny little guy swinging a giant friggin axe with 2 hands is still going to be more effective than someone with a dagger, in terms of how damage SHOULD be calculated in a game.

a Dagger/rapier class of weapon should be given a higher accuracy rating, nearly on par with 2 handed weapons, and a broadsword/axe type weapon should have a higher attack rating, nearly on par with a 2 handed weapon, an you can buff the jobs that don't dual wield through adjustments to fencer. Dual Wielding jobs like NIN already have such a damage boost via dual wield delay reduction traits/gear, that increasing thier stats is a good way to break game balance as well.

Fact is, a THF is not a DD, a DRK is not a tank (loltank, I know) and a BRD is not a healer.

other adjustments need to be made, like say ninjutsu and blu magic attack, but thinking a buff to 1 handed weapons is going to be balance is short sighted.


Don't tell me what I'm thinking, read the post.

Not talking about base damage, I'm talking about base stat >>> attack and accuracy...

Was referring to this and the fact that that's how it currently works...

I agree the 2handed jobs are overpowered, but just evening the base stat calculations for 1 and 2 handed weapons and expecting the difference in base damage to balance out, is faulty as well... we'd go back to the days of war's subbing nin and dual wielding axes. Ruinator would be a broken weaponskill with 2handed att and acc calculations.

Also take into account what the 1 handed DD classes are ATM, DNC NIN THF... not really, they all dual wield and have their own unique utility, NIN being more of an abby tank, where its damage is far from underpowered. BLU... They have bigger issues than the way 1 handed weapons are calculated, blu attack needs a complete revamp... MNK... H2H is something I'm not familiar with, so I won't comment outside of MNK being significantly behind 2 handed DD's but far ahead of 1 handed in terms of damage.

Edit: just a quick breakdown of my thinking....

Axe + ridill for style... at least get it right :P

Also, Jassik you just mentioned ninja's being an "aby tank" LOL.... 1) LOL... 2) why not mention mnk or pup being an "aby DD" then? Inside Abyssea those 2 jobs are monsters.

Mostly because as I noted, I'm not familiar with H2H... I can tell you that the adjustments are not needed because of how the jobs perform in abby, these adjustments are for the other 90% of the game that people do.

wow they are changing things up a lot o.o Maybe I'll give the game a try again sometime...=)

You completely missed my point, so nevermind lol.

Those jobs have utility and use outside of abby, I have trouble finding a use for nin outside abby and tanking Odin 1, or soloing, which is why I also didn't mention BST