(Don't) Fear The Reaper: A Dark Knight Guide
(Don't) Fear the Reaper: A Dark Knight Guide
Odin.Psycooo said: »
Afania said: »
Odin.Psycooo said: »
Afania said: »
Odin.Psycooo said: »
Afania said: »
This PM was from me, despite Ive decided not to post on this forum I feel I have the responsibility to reply since you bring it in public with little context in entire discussion(just FYI, I believe it's against the rules to post PM in public but whatever).
I personally don't think it's wrong to discuss different builds that has lower dps as long as their usage are being brought up, or gear set information is provided. For example, SC situations, defensive playstyle situations, the point is to focus on the content of information instead of personal preferences, anti math, anti spreadsheet etc.
I think information like gear sets, comparison between pros and cons of different playstyle style, pros and cons of different weapons, when does each playstyle shines is great.
Opinions like "I hate math, I don't want to read ws formula in dps discussion, I hate spreadsheet, play what you want, whoever prefer to discuss numbers should shut up" which happens a lot on forums lately doesn't contribute anything in a discussion, it's off topic.
I see this happens a lot on forums recently, that's why I sent a PM trying to solve this in private. I still encourage you to post scythe sets or post situations favoring different playstyle.
Theres difference between saying "I think scythe isn't that bad because it can do X but GS can't" and "just let people play with scythe and let them have fun". The former is providing information, the latter is provoking drama.
I personally don't think it's wrong to discuss different builds that has lower dps as long as their usage are being brought up, or gear set information is provided. For example, SC situations, defensive playstyle situations, the point is to focus on the content of information instead of personal preferences, anti math, anti spreadsheet etc.
I think information like gear sets, comparison between pros and cons of different playstyle style, pros and cons of different weapons, when does each playstyle shines is great.
Opinions like "I hate math, I don't want to read ws formula in dps discussion, I hate spreadsheet, play what you want, whoever prefer to discuss numbers should shut up" which happens a lot on forums lately doesn't contribute anything in a discussion, it's off topic.
I see this happens a lot on forums recently, that's why I sent a PM trying to solve this in private. I still encourage you to post scythe sets or post situations favoring different playstyle.
Theres difference between saying "I think scythe isn't that bad because it can do X but GS can't" and "just let people play with scythe and let them have fun". The former is providing information, the latter is provoking drama.
I think you are out of touch with reality.
edit: nobody ever once said "I hate math, I don't want to read ws formula in dps discussion, I hate spreadsheet, play what you want, whoever prefer to discuss numbers should shut up." Only that they were tired of the same information and didn't want the same copy/paste every page.
As if "let people use whatever they want" in 2 different thread isn't same information over and over. So can we move on then?
Yes because so many people want to be told to play only one way and not be told to do what they want. The entire thread has "rag only" plastered all over it and one guy was nice enough to support a community of people and try to help them play what they want without others coming in and trashing the thread for not using "rag only." Then come to find out you are the guy that told the one guy trying to support everyone to not support anything but one play type in a thread designed to talk about a job, not a play type? oh please you are part of the problem not the solution
You are missing the point. For this entire time I encourage people and Thorva through PM to post more information about scythe. Bolded information for importance. I also talked about this through PM to prevent it turn into another 5 pages of drama.
Then not only content of PM(that does not accurately represent my opinion regarding the issues) somehow popped on the forum again, and it turned into another page of drama.
Psycooo, if you have an issue with people(me or Saevel)please send a PM and I am happy to solve this with you. But posts irrelevant to information of the job is off topic.
Anyways, not going to derail this further.
I openly have a problem with both of you, you two ran off one of the few people that was kind enough to take time out of their day to assist and support anyone regardless of their weapon choices just because the two of you tried making this a dps only thread
You misunderstood, the first sentence that I sent to Thorva in pm is this:
Quote:
I fully respect your opinion of promoting different playstyle in a job discussion
which encourages more information about scythe.
As stated previously
Quote:
I personally don't think it's wrong to discuss different builds that has lower dps as long as their usage are being brought up, or gear set information is provided.
none of my posts bash scythe users, rather it's against people not providing any information in their posts and focus on individuals. The only opinion I had disagreeing Kylos is mentioning "dps doesn't matter" and whm roles in a dps discussion.
As stated previously, if you wanted to direct your issues toward individuals, I'm happy to solve it in pm.
And yes there's one person in this thread uses very aggressive language in this weapons debate but it isn't me.
Enough is enough. The guide maker/OP is tired of it, contributors are tired of it, and we, staff, are tired of this endless loop of infighting. Shape up or ship out.
Get back on track or piss off.
Get back on track or piss off.
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DRK players keeping up the stereotype of the most emo job
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YouTube Video Placeholder
:)
Thanks for the guide. Its good to have different sets and options.
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Ramuh.Austar said: »
DRK players keeping up the stereotype of the most emo job
I would like to say thank you to the people that have given advice while there has been arguement there has been a lot of information that has helped me on this topic.
From the way I see it people like Sav and stuff who are focused purely on endgame are really helpful when it comes down to how to get the most out DRK with the best gear and what to aim for and DRK role in a event ls or top tier endgame.
As for how to play DRK, it's been equally helpful that people discuss how best to use Apoc or that Torcleaver is better than Resolution until a certain point because until I get the gear/CP I need it's equally important to me to make the most out of DRK on old content and new content with the gear I have until i can get the better gear.
As for who wins or is right ... the person that is having fun in FFXI with there friends. :D
From the way I see it people like Sav and stuff who are focused purely on endgame are really helpful when it comes down to how to get the most out DRK with the best gear and what to aim for and DRK role in a event ls or top tier endgame.
As for how to play DRK, it's been equally helpful that people discuss how best to use Apoc or that Torcleaver is better than Resolution until a certain point because until I get the gear/CP I need it's equally important to me to make the most out of DRK on old content and new content with the gear I have until i can get the better gear.
As for who wins or is right ... the person that is having fun in FFXI with there friends. :D
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What are some good multi step SCs for greatsword? I see a lot of scythe multi step SCs but never see one for greatsword.
Power Slash > Resolution > Scourge > Resolution > Scourge works but it hasn't been very impressive so far for me.
The best part is that both Resolutions close a skillchain and so they both give extra damage. Opening the skillchain with Resolution seems kinda undesirable to me since you don't get to utilize it for high closing-skillchain damage that way.
Edit: Forgot that DRKs get Torcleaver. Yeah, substituting that into here would surely be the better option.
The best part is that both Resolutions close a skillchain and so they both give extra damage. Opening the skillchain with Resolution seems kinda undesirable to me since you don't get to utilize it for high closing-skillchain damage that way.
Edit: Forgot that DRKs get Torcleaver. Yeah, substituting that into here would surely be the better option.
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Resolution > Ground Strike (distortion) > Scourge (fusion) > Resolution (light) > Scourge (light)
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Resolution > Torcleaver > Scourge > Resolution > Torcleaver is the best you can do.
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A Drk, Drg, and Pld are on a plane with no parachutes. The Pld jumps, uses Invincible and lands taking no damage. The Drg goes and hits Super Jump before hitting the ground.
The Drk jumps, uses Last Resort, Souleater, readies Catastrophe... And misses the ground.
The Drk jumps, uses Last Resort, Souleater, readies Catastrophe... And misses the ground.
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Scourge > Resolution > Torcleaver is a simple double light too.
Irony of trying to do a 5 step skillchain with one hit weapons skills is you're gonna miss ;;
Irony of trying to do a 5 step skillchain with one hit weapons skills is you're gonna miss ;;
A Drk, Drg, and Pld are on a plane with no parachutes. The Pld jumps, uses Invincible and lands taking no damage. The Drg goes and hits Super Jump before hitting the ground.
The Drk jumps, uses Last Resort, Souleater, readies Catastrophe... And misses the ground.
THIS 100 MILLION TIMES!!!!
PS SCYTHE RULES.
The Drk jumps, uses Last Resort, Souleater, readies Catastrophe... And misses the ground.
THIS 100 MILLION TIMES!!!!
PS SCYTHE RULES.
Is Entropy worth keeping 5/5 at all or is Cross Reaper still going to be better? If CR wins either way I'll just 1/5 Entropy and 4/5 something else that i might get some use out of on another job. Can't believe SE still being stingy with those merit WS's lol.
Asura.Tigredor said: »
Is Entropy worth keeping 5/5 at all or is Cross Reaper still going to be better? If CR wins either way I'll just 1/5 Entropy and 4/5 something else that i might get some use out of on another job. Can't believe SE still being stingy with those merit WS's lol.
I was honestly just wondering the same thing... was thinking of taking 4 out and putting it on like stardiver or something
Quetzalcoatl.Commencal said: »
A Drk, Drg, and Pld are on a plane with no parachutes. The Pld jumps, uses Invincible and lands taking no damage. The Drg goes and hits Super Jump before hitting the ground.
The Drk jumps, uses Last Resort, Souleater, readies Catastrophe... And misses the ground.
The Drk jumps, uses Last Resort, Souleater, readies Catastrophe... And misses the ground.
This post and the video a few post above had me me cracking up thanks I had a crappy long day at work I needed a good laugh.
Asura.Tigredor said: »
Is Entropy worth keeping 5/5 at all or is Cross Reaper still going to be better? If CR wins either way I'll just 1/5 Entropy and 4/5 something else that i might get some use out of on another job. Can't believe SE still being stingy with those merit WS's lol.
I'm supposing that has more to do with what you want to get out of Entropy. If for instance, it's just a simple matter of having access to Entropy in order to skillchain and/or to get MP back then 1/5 it. If on the other hand, you want to get the most out of Entropy as much as any other weaponskill in your arsenal then I would suggest keeping it 5/5.
As for whether one beats the other... "stuff's situational." as always. End of the day, it's personal choice.
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Thanks for the GS multi step skill chains!
I have some follow up questions!
For our sub job is SAM our best option? I was considering WAR because with LS and berserk, things just melt.
However with that much defense down as well WSing in Argosy, I've actually been one shotted a couple of times by some ilvl mobs(last time was nimble snap by an apex eft while I was WSing...)
Given that, would SAM be our best choice for relevant content, and WAR for anything below ilvl 119?
Also, when in a party with other DDs, what are some common Resolution SCs that I can do with others to maintain/not break SC damage. Or is it best just to span Torcleaver to keep those lvl 3 chains going? Or is the higher Resolution damage with a lower tier SC better overall?
Finally, for apex crabs, which seem to be the most popular, people usually make darkness SCs. For those, Torcleaver is definitely the way to go in terms of greatsword right? Would it be better to go scythe in these situations?
I have some follow up questions!
For our sub job is SAM our best option? I was considering WAR because with LS and berserk, things just melt.
However with that much defense down as well WSing in Argosy, I've actually been one shotted a couple of times by some ilvl mobs(last time was nimble snap by an apex eft while I was WSing...)
Given that, would SAM be our best choice for relevant content, and WAR for anything below ilvl 119?
Also, when in a party with other DDs, what are some common Resolution SCs that I can do with others to maintain/not break SC damage. Or is it best just to span Torcleaver to keep those lvl 3 chains going? Or is the higher Resolution damage with a lower tier SC better overall?
Finally, for apex crabs, which seem to be the most popular, people usually make darkness SCs. For those, Torcleaver is definitely the way to go in terms of greatsword right? Would it be better to go scythe in these situations?
Depends what party needs.
Scythe with all WS can open and close darkness and double darkness.
Great sword can only open or close single darkness.
If you're in a party with 2 BLMs basically one shotting mobs with MBs then scythe would be the way to go.
If your WS/SC dmg is needed for killing stuff trying to work a way for you to use Torcleaver will help.
It's all situational tho just be ready to use both.
As for /SAM vs /WAR comes down to 2 things, if you have LR down time /SAM (Hasso) will usually pull it ahead (unless you're using Apoc119v3 for some reason), if that's not an issue tho it's how much you gain from Berserk is what it comes down to and if that's enough to out weight the store tp.
As for being one shot it will depend on what you fight but /SAM is a much better at staying alive.That said fighting Apex efts sucks no matter what job/sub you're on Apex bats and crabs won't one shot though.
Scythe with all WS can open and close darkness and double darkness.
Great sword can only open or close single darkness.
If you're in a party with 2 BLMs basically one shotting mobs with MBs then scythe would be the way to go.
If your WS/SC dmg is needed for killing stuff trying to work a way for you to use Torcleaver will help.
It's all situational tho just be ready to use both.
As for /SAM vs /WAR comes down to 2 things, if you have LR down time /SAM (Hasso) will usually pull it ahead (unless you're using Apoc119v3 for some reason), if that's not an issue tho it's how much you gain from Berserk is what it comes down to and if that's enough to out weight the store tp.
As for being one shot it will depend on what you fight but /SAM is a much better at staying alive.That said fighting Apex efts sucks no matter what job/sub you're on Apex bats and crabs won't one shot though.
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Also from BGwiki, defense page:
" Decreasing defense will increase damage taken, but if the player's defense falls below 50% of the attacking monster's attack value, further reductions in defense will have no impact on damage taken by the player. "
" Decreasing defense will increase damage taken, but if the player's defense falls below 50% of the attacking monster's attack value, further reductions in defense will have no impact on damage taken by the player. "
Asura.Ganno said: »
Also from BGwiki, defense page:
" Decreasing defense will increase damage taken, but if the player's defense falls below 50% of the attacking monster's attack value, further reductions in defense will have no impact on damage taken by the player. "
" Decreasing defense will increase damage taken, but if the player's defense falls below 50% of the attacking monster's attack value, further reductions in defense will have no impact on damage taken by the player. "
Leaping Lizzy can one shot you if you pop Last Resort and Berserk at the same time. #truestorybro
SE has adjusted monster pDIF at least twice since that page was made, so idk how accurate it is anymore.
I'm pretty sure ratio has capped at 4.0 for monsters since early in SoA, so you'll experience higher damage taken all the way down to 25% of a monster's attack value.
Well to be completely honest, if you're THAT worried about your defense and damage taken use /SAM and have a -DT or hybrid -DT set at the ready. The Sulevia set is a perfect jump off point for those situations I've found.
Personally, I go /WAR in a majority of situations and honestly see little reason to go /SAM unless under particular circumstances. Besides, DRK just naturally takes more damage than other DDs (Hell I've seen Mages take less damage than me at times) even without Last Resort up. It's just plain fact.
The most damage I've seen from a non-Nm was... 1,200 on a non-crit melee round from an Apex Bat in Outer Rakaznar with Last Resort/Berserk up. I'm so used to taking high dmg on DRK I just stopped flinching about it.
"Hit Hard or Die Trying" or as my linkshell would say [about me at least] "Hit Hard AND Die Trying"
Personally, I go /WAR in a majority of situations and honestly see little reason to go /SAM unless under particular circumstances. Besides, DRK just naturally takes more damage than other DDs (Hell I've seen Mages take less damage than me at times) even without Last Resort up. It's just plain fact.
The most damage I've seen from a non-Nm was... 1,200 on a non-crit melee round from an Apex Bat in Outer Rakaznar with Last Resort/Berserk up. I'm so used to taking high dmg on DRK I just stopped flinching about it.
"Hit Hard or Die Trying" or as my linkshell would say [about me at least] "Hit Hard AND Die Trying"
Hmmm interesting. The reason I brought it up was because in another thread someone said we shouldn't be subbing WAR because of what Kyte brought up.
I'm all for subbing WAR because honestly zerk/aggressor/warcry and the DA are really hard to give up for hasso/store tp/sekkanoki. It's not that these aren't really great things to have, but having an additional acc and attack buff can really help extend the range in which you maintain both acc and attack buffed.
But if that's a death sentence and detriment to the party I totally get that it would be a better choice to sub SAM.
I'm all for subbing WAR because honestly zerk/aggressor/warcry and the DA are really hard to give up for hasso/store tp/sekkanoki. It's not that these aren't really great things to have, but having an additional acc and attack buff can really help extend the range in which you maintain both acc and attack buffed.
But if that's a death sentence and detriment to the party I totally get that it would be a better choice to sub SAM.
Truthfully, I don't know how fruitful it is to sub warrior on dark anymore. We already have access to smite 5, last resort, emdark, and a crap load of attack gear, including hq argosy. We're never attack starved. Warrior essentially only adds a few points of double attack (which, depending on your sets, may be completely not worth it), berserk, and aggressor.
Berserk is non essential for the points mentioned above.
Aggressor is a wash because it's only 25 accuracy, and you'll likely have diabolic eye merited for that need. Also, Endark adds twenty accuracy points that does not diminish over time, with job points of course. Also, dark should always be using sushi.
Berserk + last resort is probably a death wish anyways.
Honestly, it's 10% double attack vs hasso and the defensive seigan, and a few points of store tp. Hasso is worthless while LR is in effect, seigan can be a life saver, but honestly warrior sub never seems to add enough to warrant using, especially in high buffed scenarios. Hasso during LR downtime is invaluable. I just can't see myself subbing warrior anymore. Not as good as it looks.
Berserk is non essential for the points mentioned above.
Aggressor is a wash because it's only 25 accuracy, and you'll likely have diabolic eye merited for that need. Also, Endark adds twenty accuracy points that does not diminish over time, with job points of course. Also, dark should always be using sushi.
Berserk + last resort is probably a death wish anyways.
Honestly, it's 10% double attack vs hasso and the defensive seigan, and a few points of store tp. Hasso is worthless while LR is in effect, seigan can be a life saver, but honestly warrior sub never seems to add enough to warrant using, especially in high buffed scenarios. Hasso during LR downtime is invaluable. I just can't see myself subbing warrior anymore. Not as good as it looks.
Quote:
Hasso is worthless
It still gives 10 accuracy and 7 STR.
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