(Don't) Fear The Reaper: A Dark Knight Guide

Where does Redemption fit in the mix these days for DRK?

Now most of this is opinion but...

I’m a proprietor of 2 Handed Empyreans are all busted due to AM3. But for Redemption in particular, Scythe pDif and Cross Reaper are huge on it.

White hitting with Redemption can net 15k attack round Triple Attacks EASY, so it more than makes up for Quietus’s lack of output.

However I rip out 85-90k Cross Reapers in Wave1-2 Dyna easy with my R6~ Redemption.

It’s the least made Empyrean weapon because Scythe is seen as trash and Redemption requires Chloris which sucks, but I think it’s actually very comparable to Caladbolg in terms of dps.

I’m also thinking the new earring that eats enmity will make Scythe an attractive option for long-winded fights.

Being able to MP battery with Entropy and the earring will help us mitigate enmity to a point, but it would certainly help Redemption’s white hits.

Overall ever since I made it back in September, I’ve been in love with it. I get a lot of questions about it when people see me wearing it around town.

DRK is in a good place right now, there are many viable options. Ragnarok seems to be the only left out in the cold.

It takes Emp AM and a solid WS to be top dog.

I’m sure Emp is fun but the other three scythes have more going for them.

Apocs utility.

Liberators buff to Insurgency and WS frequency.

Angutas TP bonus. (Those huge CRs you mentioned will happen an entire attack round earlier which adds up fast over a longer event)

I don’t have a redemption but i have a few R15 Emps and it’s pretty obvious why only certain ones shine and even then they aren’t best all the time.

Tbh its more of a job/gear that unlock potential of Empy AM3 builds. Most jobs has some advantages in that direction. DRK has pdif, capped haste, absorbs, some natural crit damage. DRG has capped haste, Da from wyvern, Jumps to easily get 3000TP for activate/reactivate AM3 and worse, but still good pdif too. WAR has some natural crit rate/damage, good JSE gear, Double attack rate/damage and Blood Rage.

Its actually WAR who is the best here and Ukonvasara has highest melee white damage (and thats without blood rage)

Also I wonder what you consider the best AM3 set for redemption, because what I would consider pure best white DPS set has much less TP generation, than worse white DPS set, but with higher MA rate and higher TP generation. I assume tp per round might be important here, but xhit probably not, because you wont spam any WS anyway, but probably try to do something like Cross Reaper above 2000TP.

ItemSet 377697

ItemSet 377698

*empty slots are Schere earring and Coiste Bodhar


This is kinda misleading. While 15k triple attack round is something thats obviously possible, it wont happen often. Even if you consider some high TA rate set (like lets say 14%), you will need to proc it, then dont miss any of the hits, which is not that obvious with 95% hit rate cap, then proc some crit hit and AM3 on ~2/3 hits. That won happen often. You know WAR can in theory proc almost 40k damage attack round with Ukonvasara, but I wouldnt consider that as something that makes up for Ukko's Fury damage, because its too rare :P


This is also very misleading. You are probably talking about something like Jeuno with goblins taking +50% damage. You are also talking about some very high TP Cross Reaper. I dont want to be misunderstood too, CR at 3000TP is super powerful WS with Redemption, but its nowhere near 85-90k on neutral target (more like 55-60k maybe) and its significantly weaker at 1250TP+.

EDIT:


You mean Redemption itself or all Scythes? Because Scythe as weapon type for DRK is definitely not seen as trash >.>

I'm super bad at forums and quoting etc. So I'll respond in paragraphs lol.


I normally do wait for 2000+ TP to unload the Cross Reaper, but I currently use a standard high end TP set, haven't tried the critical build, but I do have all the gear to try it out, so maybe I'll give it a whirl. I do think getting the Reapers out faster is better off than the white hits.

I consider the Empy AM3 damage to "make up" for the bad weaponskill's damage... Quietus in this case, because you only really have to use it every 3 minutes, except for of course Torcleaver.


Dyna remark: Yes, my bad, I always forget Goblins take +50%, but I parse roughly the same on Redemption vs. Caladbolg in RP/Volte farms in any area. I haven't done a Wave 3 in a while on DRK though. Looking forward to testing the earring on Wave 3.


As for Scythes in general, I do believe they're perceived as sub-optimal. Caladbolg is extremely strong, and conveniently the easiest Abyssea path to do.


Apocalypse has nice utility, but it clearly doesn't keep up with the likes of Caladbolg for raw output.


While Liberator is very good at R15, it's a lot of investment for one when you can scoop up a Caladbolg and go. More than likely if someone is making a Mythic and is not a career DRK, they're making something far more useful.


Essentially, besides Apocalypse, Scythes are pretty sparse and obnoxious to get, especially Redemption. At least in my opinion. Again I'm not a mathematician, but I think Redemption is overlooked, and AM3 is super strong with the max pDif Scythe provides.

Anguta is basically free and is an amazing option for cross reaper spam. It’s my go to for a lot of things especially when I have a war in party for warcry


That said I still prefer to use my Liberator whenever possible

I definitely prefer using Scythe, and have built all the Scythe RMEAs...and its still very frustrating to know that one can build a Caladbolg and functional sets so much cheaper/easier than tweaking scythe sets to compete equally, if not exceed scythe parses.

Nonetheless, it does have its niche where you can freely chain when scythe gets to shine.

My Liberator is R15, my Redemption is R12, and my Apoc is R8. I haven't started RP'ing my Anguta yet, just out of costs and other things pulling at my attention. While I enjoy my Redemption a ton, I still find it hard to give up Liberator. And yes, I do run varying AM sets depending on the weapon, not one of those "swap the weapon and wonder why its not performing" guy. My Redemption AM-up set is very similar to the multiattack-based setup SimonSes posted, with +crit rate augmented valorous feet (and yetshila+1, I don't have the ammo option he mentions). My Liberator AM-up set is STP based with STP+7 augmented valorous feet and odyssean legs.

Its hard to convince the "I have a DRK" guy to go beyond Caladbolg when its an easier path to make and easier to gear sets for it (no need for ratri+1 besides feet, really- possibly the head for idle regain, I guess), so I do look at DRKs who can capably run either weapon as more into the job. Its not as bad as trying to get Archery to work on Ranger, but Scythe on DRK is a long-term investment in my book.

I don't even play DRK anymore and still I have zero regrets about R15 Liberator. Such a great weapon/build.

I prefer Scythes by far. Calad is basically only good for strong 2step Light IMO. Liberator is competitive in damage otherwise, while being way better weapon for Dark magic. Apocalypse's utility is so good, that sometimes it's the pure reason to use DRK. Also its really hard to balance accuracy and raw power in Torcleaver set, which is really annoying.

I loved Anguta until the Rank System came out. Afterwards it slowly began to fall behind to other options IMO. It still isn't a bad scythe, and is rather nice if you don't have Dyna Clears.

This. Liberator is so fun, hits like a freight train, and just feels so great to use. Scythe 4 Lyfe.

anyone have lycurgos steel cyclone numbers? seems fun to play around with when you can max out drain 3 maybe. also access to breaks minus full break is nice.

edit: ls mate answered, use upheaval instead.

I honestly prefer Steel Cyclone with Lycurgos. I only use Upheaval if it completes a Skillchain.

-Steel Cyclone has a slight Attack Bonus, While DRK gets a crap ton of attack already, makes it easier to reach the cap for PDL.
-Lycurgos has a +30% Damage Boost to Steel Cyclone. As an added bonus this also applies to any multi attacks that proc on it. (Could be wrong though)
-Steel Cyclone is 60% STR and 60% VIT VS Upheaval only having a 73-85% VIT mod. Since I have Chango I only keep one merit in Upheaval.

Honestly it can go either way. But for me I feel like I get the most consistent numbers with Steel Cyclone, especially compared to Upheaval with only one merit.


Upheaval is pretty much my Torcleaver Set

Here's the advice I usually give to people. Get/Use Both

If you have the chance to multistep you can do:
ARMOR BREAK > STEEL CYCLONE (DETONATION) > UPHEAVAL (GRAVITATION) > STEEL CYCLONE (DARKNESS)

It does a crap ton of damage in a short time. With a TP bonus its a really solid option for Darkness and it also puts a potent defense down effect on the enemy as an opener.

I remember being made fun of for making a less than "useful" Mythic. Apparently it should've been a Burtgang, Yagrush, Nirvana or Death Penalty. The fact is, I got it because I love Scythes since I first picked one up in 2004 after getting rid of the trial Great Sword. It took forever to swing, but man did it hit harder than anything else.

All those misses back at 75 cap, and the bandRagnaroks from the Voidwatch era, were just some of the pain we had to endure til SE finally made Scythe the force it was destined to be. I don't knock GS DRKs though, because the beauty of this job is you get the choice. Most other DD jobs don't get the luxury of choosing. Also, Zeid uses GS and you wouldn't mess with him.

Just to add on to the discussion, going to add some thoughts and I want you to please prove me wrong and why my thinking is bad. I have an Apoc and a Rag (got it back in 2011 during the craze). I'm about to do another run through a mythic set up for an alt character (can't decide between bard or whm, besides the point), so I'll be free to go through everything as well on my main. I already have pup and rng mythic, and looking for what do. I thought about nirvana, but I can't say my smn is really geared all that well, as well as a few other options. I looked into the Sam mythic and general consensus is that there is to much multi hit anymore on gear to really make one of the twice/thrice weapons really worth while. I feel like that would also fall in line with Drk and make Liberator less attractive as well because of gear available.

I don't have a caladbolg yet either but been on fence of doing that or finishing up the 85 Ukon I used for war back pre seekers. Is there something that dark has going for it that multi hit equipment does effect? Someone please enlighten me as I'm strong considering a Liberator, but still not sold yet.

Liberator allows you to gear DRK differently, a build centered around STP. When you pair this with a mythic's aftermath, the end result is a chaining monster. 4-stepping regularly becomes so easy with aftermath up.

What truly makes it great in my book is that with all the growth in gear as well as the afterglow/RP process for RMEA weapons, Insurgency can still hit like a truck for the times where there is too much going on and you can't skillchain. The AM3 simply allows for more TP overflow and WS frequency in those moments.

Add to this the bonuses to absorb spells on Liberator, and if you want to play DRK fully, you'd be hard pressed to find a more all-in-one weapon.

I have all the RMEA scythes outside of Father Time. And while I love Apoc and Redemption- its hard to move off of Liberator I enjoy it so much.

Thanks! I do prefer scythes over greats words myself, so this is good to hear. I also have a redemption sitting at the ultimatum level, waiting on those 50 chloris buds (did this when trials were introduced), but I can't bring myself to finish it.

Most players will logically go the lib/apoc/anguta way. Redemption is a niche scythe but it truly is a monster with the proper buffs. The white damage crits will make other DDs cry. It's like gandiva am3, but with 4 to 9k hp.

Redemption has always looked like a worse version of ukon to me. Burn a crappy 3k tp ws every 3 minutes to get aftermath and use scythe ws that scale with tp without a tp bonus or fast tp gain. Calad already has great white damage and a really strong ws that scales with tp, so I don't know when empy scythe would be more favorable to use over calad for similar functions. I'm sure those situations exist but they have to be rare. Drk has access to a lot of great weapons including ambu GA for different situations so adding one more can't hurt but personally I don't see it being worth the effort, especially given the empy NMs you need to farm for it. Ganvida is probably an apt comparison because it is a worse version of arma in most cases.

Liberator gang flex!

Well to be fair, you only need to Quietus once, then for the rest of the 3min AM3 up, you can Cross Reaper. White DPS wise, Redemption will have around 6~7% advantage over Caladbolg. Both will lose to Ukonvasara by quite a lot (25~30%+ assuming Fighter's/Rogue rolls for all of them) and Gandiva/Armageddon are slightly worse without Double Shot, but with Double Shot they are miles ahead. Taking avg with DS and without DS, Armageddon is around 17% above Ukonvasara. One more factor beside white damage for those builds is that Cross Reaper is much better 3000TP WS than Upheaval or Last Stand (tho during Double Shot, Last Stand might actually be a DPS loss). Another factor is that WAR Ukonvasara AM3 set isn't exactly glass cannon, but has very low meva. DRK AM3 sets also have rather poor defensive values, but DRK can partially even that out with Drain III. RNG AM3 set is even more glassy, but AM3 DS set has at least very high MEVA. If RNG choose safety over dps and wont be in True Shot range, then Arma white DPS slightly drops below Ukon.

---deleted by author due to his insomnia---

I think you confused Quietus and Entropy :)

I gotta *** stop posting this late.

What's best for uncapped reso now we have Sakpata?

Uncapped attack?

Unaugmented, it's still 4/5 Argosy +1 (A head/feet, D body/hands) and Ignominy +3 legs, but Sakpata body is extremely close, so it's probably best to just use Sakpata in that slot just for the survivability aspect.

I'm not sure about how augmented Sakpata compares. Body would definitely win, and head likely would too with the Double Attack damage, but not sure about the others.

I tried to kill Gin using Reso (it sucked) but my general acc was horrific using 5/5 Sek and other DT TP gear.

Double attack damage is only for melee. It doesn't work for WS.