The Beast Within -- A Guide To Blue Mage

It's possible I entered a wrong value when simulating Mimesis, least it's been corrected!

DEX vs STR Uson is interesting though, I had DEX one coming out on top if CDC was being used as the primary WS. It may be because we calculate fSTR differently. I'd still very much recommend building a DEX Uson first since the difference between STR and DEX at capped acc is so small, but as soon as acc uncaps the story changes.

I'm still using Anahera - Bura and based on Motenten's chart, I guess that's not horrible but I should get an Uson...

I've really not wanted to give up Anahera, it's so awesome ; ;

Tis indeed a cruel twist of fate :(

Thank u mote, that comes close to what I was getting from my results.

here's the problem; i copypasted Uson to enter Mimesis' data, but didnt change the D from 132 to 128 or remove the attack, oops

Simple/accurate way of looking at values for CDC:

If my base damage is 135 and fSTR is 20 and I have 250 dex, how much is one more dex worth (total D before att= 135+20+250 or 405)? 406/405 = 1.00247 or 1 DEX is worth .247% damage

If you have 40% crit, your base attack is 1000 and the mobs def is 1000, how uch is one attack worth? 1400/1000 or 1.4 ratio, so add one attack (make sure to add it pre buff or you'll need to add that too) and 1401/1000 = 1.401, 1.401/1.4 = 1 attack is worth 0.071%

STR will add 0.25 to the 405 from above and 0.75 of the attack value, so 1 STR = 0.115%

If you are at 32 DA during WS, what will one more be worth? base 5.25 + 0.64 (first 2 hits can DA) = 5.89, one more DA +0.02 or 5.91/5.89: 1 DA = 0.34% on CDC

To Mimesis will add 1.15% from STR and 2.47% from dex

Values will change very slightly depending or your base damage, attack and mob defense, but not significantly so.

CDC only additive value for offhand (reference)

Mimesis: +3.62%
Bura: +2.59%
STR sword: +1.52%
DEX sword: +1.73%
Anahara: +1.83

Conclusion is the +1% from Mimesis to CDC worthwhile over Bura when you consider the lose of 3DA (faster WS), more acc (faster WS), more attack/STR/damage on white phase.....hardly. Its not even close.

Really you have 2 legit options for CDC spam:

DEX USO/BURA or BURA/ANA

Well put Doctorugh xD

For generalized approximating that all works for the most part, but... the difference between DEX uson and STR uson for CDC on an actual target is:

3773.59 (DEX) vs 3685.78 (STR) when accuracy is capped, so STR is fine to use too, making it "legit" as well. Not sure I'd ever suggest an Anahera Saber unless you have no other choice.

Refia are you going to actually contribute anything of value or are you going to continue buzzing around and being a fly on the cow's ear? Doctorugh and I may have lots of conflicting opinions, but at least he provides information to back his up.

umm u didnt back up urs from the start, hence my skepticism from what my results were telling me. Then u brought ur brigade to attack me and my comments instead of analyzing what could have been wrong. at least im not gloating you were wrong, im being mature but apparently you feel to attack me xD. Also u can easily see how it falls in comparison to bura just by looking at the stats, an in-dept response was not needed to see that even post update lolz.

Sweetie if I wanted to attack you I would have, but keep trying to play the damsel card. I'm sure you'll get at least one person to fall for it. Not even sure what you're referring to when you say my "brigade", I don't have one of those. They called you out on their own volition. In any case, if you're going to come in and protest a claim, providing evidence beyond "well I feel like it's wrong" is generally a great idea. You know, like what Motenten did: providing actual information and data.

As for your edit, no not really. They're so close that you can't eyeball it like that, it requires actual weighing. I feel a lot of people overvalue small amounts of double attack; it's nice, but isn't so great that it automatically means an item bearing it is better by default, especially when the weight of a certain stat is being shifted so aggressively and BLU already maintains such an immense attack frequency.

ur posts were very condescending from the start xD from when i questioned u. I told u why its wrong, look at the stats on the wpn alone in comparison to the mimemas. Look at Doctorough explanation.

xD

Dx .......

Here's the difference between my methodology for including weapons/armors in the OP and Doctorugh's method: I don't approximate, I simulate to find the best, and work down through the tiers to create a pool of gear to choose from. It just so happens that in haste I didn't properly adjust Mimesis' stats to match what they really are, which caused it to get better results than it was supposed to. In some cases, using approximations like that can lead to inaccuracy, and while neither system is infallible, I'll maintain that this is among my first major blunders when it comes to addressing BLU's armaments. I'm not going to just take someone's word on something that I've put through a simulation (wrong input or not, no way of knowing until I went back later and did it again which I pretty much always do anyway whenever I add new equipment, which would've been necessary in a few hours), especially when that someone said in the same sentence that "it's the exact same as Almace xD". That's going to require a reason beyond "well YOU SEE..."


tl;dr, I don't settle for "just looking at them and guessing based on what I think should be best 'cuz this one has a prettier stat on it with more things that are normally pretty irrelevant compared to other things"; not to say Doctorugh did anything wrong either (assuming that generalizing DEX Uson as the only good one wasn't intentional).

"Rough guess" method is the most common initial approach, based solely on people's experiences with how different stats affect DPS outcomes. Unless there's something truly unique about a given setup, a few percent DA is going to outweigh a few points of a given stat. Likewise, something that can change a weaponskill's damage by over 5% (compared to a similar item) is *huge*, and if the underlying gear changes are not likewise huge, asserting such a result is dubious. This method is never itself accurate, but it is the most common means of finding errors in the more accurate methodologies.

Approximation methods present all the numbers used (or at least should) right in the comparison. If something doesn't look right, you can immediately check the math used. If you want to make a counterargument to such a presentation, it's expected that you show exactly where the error occurred.

For example:

This is in error in a few ways. First, 1000 att vs 1000 def is 1.0 Ratio, not 1.4. 40% crit does not create a 1.4 Ratio. Adding 1 attack does not add to the nonsensical rendition of the ratio as 1401/1000. Average pDif varies notably relative to Ratio, and one cannot count on a linear relation (though in times past I did so because the math to get a proper average pDif is complicated). A couple other minor technical quibbles derive from the above problems.



Simulationist methods are most vulnerable to 'hidden' errors -- exactly the sorts of mistake that you made. They are subject to dozens of unknowns, partly because the presenter never provides 100% of all set conditions, and partly because the provider is relying on tons of automated math inherent in the model itself. A single error (such as one I corrected in the Cor spreadsheet just today, referencing Set2TPBonus instead of Set2RTPBonus) can completely destroy a comparison without you even realizing it (particularly since frequently the error makes no difference at all, so isn't something that stands out).

Thus, when someone notes that the assertion you made doesn't really make sense, there's a greater burden on the simulationist to verify their own methodology, since most of the math that backs is up is something only they have access to.

Demeaning and insulting behavior after having been proven wrong, particularly against someone who did not make any additional comment against you, is really bad form.

Absolutely, if there's a major error I try to find it immediately, problem being I didn't find this one until after your initial post with sword set DPS comparisons (appreciated btw, was able to correct another error based on the DEX and STR Uson numbers, much more minor one than the Mimesis but still something). My initial reasoning for believing that 5~10% was, indeed, correct was thus: multiattack has a tendency to be less "heavy" in BLU sets due to how much is being stacked by default.

For example, the difference between an Atheling mantle and, say, a Buquwik cape for CDC is quite low despite Buquwik having next to no natural value for CDC. With all the time spent doing these sets and comparing 1~2% differences in Piece A and Piece B for this job in particular, there really wasn't much of a red flag for the sword to be increasing CDC's damage by at least 5%, particularly with it gaining 29% extra WSC. Therefor, initially, someone coming in saying "lul did you even spreadsheet it" and such made me feel the need to require more evidence than just "gut feeling".

As far as the demeaning and insulting behavior, it wasn't really toward the fact that I was proven wrong as much as to the point that they were pretty much going out of their way just to "rub it in" (which I didn't even notice until a couple people mentioned it to me on MSN), so to speak, even though it isn't a big deal to begin with. In any case, I'm enough of a man to apologize if it seemed to be that I was trying to insult someone, because that was not the intention. With the amount of things that need to be done to keep these guides current, it's inevitable that mistakes will be made, and I do appreciate it when they're pointed out. What I don't appreciate, however, is someone coming in and proposing that something may be wrong, not stating why they think so other than "well, it looks wrong compared to blah blah blah", receiving an explanation as to why their opinion may not be correct, and following up with something as baseless as "did you even spreadsheet it?" (which honestly seemed arrogant at the time), particularly when the very same post includes bad information as well.

So yeah, not a saint, and certainly not a paragon of perfection. Mistakes inevitably going to happen.

xD

xD

Sorry, just trying to ease the tension. This thread became very uncomfortable when we stopped talking about ***.

I agree, from now on this thread is all about phallus. Blue phallus.

Is that a sword or a club and is it made from soulflayers?

"Occasionally XXX 2-8 times"

It's a staff, need to use two hands.

lol well then, can put ACC+30 and Occ. attacks twice on Xiutleato


nvm the NPC is just a *** ***

so you CAN put OAT on it



at a glance with very little thought put in so far, 8DEX more on uk'uxkaj hat, 8DEX on buremte gloves, 4crit OAT on xiutleato (likely just a toy)

This is not in error I just used 1000att/1000def to make it simple to understand. Let me go through a more lengthy explanation for you:

60% of the time my ratio will be 1.0
40% of the time my ratio will be 2.0

60% x 1 = 0.6
40% x 2 = 0.8

0.6 + 0.8 = 1.4

should I slow down further? There is no lvl correction to work anymore. Don't question me! (just trying to get with the vibe of the posts)

DEX for head MND for legs yes. Expiacion seems to have gotten a pretty massive ftp boost at 300tp, nice for Tizona owners. Sanguine Blade damage is almost imperceptibly higher compared to what physical ws are getting, but it's there. Need to test to see if alpha was removed from physical spells, too. Not much else for blu though, may have a new piece or two of 115 gear to use but I'll have to look later.

With some haste augments on 115 armor, any way to get Thurandaut+1 hat to fit in the sets?

I have Bura and An saber was thinking of making Uson or JSE if I could only make 1, does JSE make more sense now? I was trying to follow the thread but the debate got confusing.