[dev1047] New Battle System: Legion

You're burning up with excitement? :o

Thank you >^.^<

I really really really hope they don't nurf this becouse bunch of abyssea born noobs think it's to hard and wine about it did a run with 36last night got win and many of them had no idea how to follow directions and complained about drops and loot pool definatly showed who was born during the abyssea/VW era

The problem is in the sheer number of players required. 36 people is far too many. Tanaka's approach of telling all of the new subscribers that came in with the Steam release of the game that "No, you don't get to have the items you want" may not fall in line with your "philosophy", but it doesn't change the fact that when people stop having fun, they leave, and with every subscriber that leaves so does the money their subscription brings in for development.

The problem here is this is a two way street. Without content like this, people leave too!

I need 36 people to do the new content?

*** that.

I used to enjoy content like this, until I took a decreased population to the post Abyssea low man linkshell era.

The million dollar question:

Is Legion worth the immense challenge of gathering up 36 people because this is what sinks SE every time.

We can talk about challenge, Abyssea noobs and Tanaka all day but if you need 36 people to get logs every run then frankly this event is trash and should be revised.

18 people is difficult enough in this era, challenges should be handsomely rewarded and the current legion point items look like ***.

I'm all for challenge but I'll remain skeptical of this event till people start clearing wings and I see drops start falling relative to the number of people pitching in. 36 people and only getting 1-2 drops would be absolute ***and par for the course from SE.

I await being wrong.

If your LS can't field 18 solid people, join another LS.

If you have 18 solid people, team up with another LS and clear the content.

It's actually pretty fun working together and the content (at least for the moment) is interesting.

True, however an event such as Legion panders to the vocal minority as opposed to the bulk of the playerbase.

Legion may take LS team ups (in some cases to start..and GL dealing with drops) but im sure in time the content will take under 18 people

From what I've heard fielding less than 18 seems suicidal.

***links, spam their unique TP moves off the bat, plenty of dangerous AOE everywhere like Meteor, -gas and no buffs meaning one TP move could wipe you out.

Some obviously dont remember LSs fighting stuff like Tiamat when it 1st came out ... or Einherjhar ... stuff just takes time is all.

Pull each mob into a corner and you're out of range of each other, you don't have to stack up on top of each other, handle one mob at a time, and then go to the next.

The content is challenging but I'm with Sparthosx on what he has to say about the loot, it doesn't fit the difficulty you have to overcome for the chambers to win, killing the else that pop for a temp item for the person that gets the kill seems a tad HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, an area distribution of 1 temp item that could be useful (dusty elixer, lucid ether I lucid elixer I, body boost, mana boost.)

They are probably the minority b/c events like this have been MIA for a long time now.

In addition, legion is in the minority of events. This atm...seems like the only thing that requires lots of people.

SE makes a couple of pieces of gear un-attainable by someone duel boxing, and people get upset...ok

I'm with people worried about drops. It's nice to have a big event but IF you have to lot against 35 people for something with terrible drop rate that sucks immensily. Even more than old dyna. Especially if you can't go with a single ls and therefore you can't even trust the debatable dkp!
I'm not one who thinks things should be handed to you on a silver plate, but 1/36 chance on a 2% drop... x_x"

If SE really gave a ***they'd put Heavy Metal in this event since it's currently the most desired drop across all playstyles and would serve as immense incentive for anyone to pick up this event.

Naturally, I'm sure SE neglected to add this item.

There was a PUG that got 36 people on Lakshmi last night and did a few runs of the Kings. After a few trial runs, people remembered (learned?) how to kill Kings. However, the event is definitely not PUG friendly because as soon as the first piece of loot dropped (Vassal Mantle off a King), you saw the chat log instantly fill with 36 lots lol.

This event is definitely geared to the vocal minority who wanted EGLS content of this sort, and have a DKP system to prevent mass lotting. I see nothing wrong with catering to that minority with ONE event in the game, so I'm not sure why there are criticisms. As far as loot, looking at the DATs, the mage gear appears superior to the melee gear. However, melee will want the items that drop to uncurse the new Hexed items.

EDIT: I agree with Spart that putting Heavy Metal in here would have been a nice concession.

Nice straw man.

I'm not saying that everything should be able to be dual-boxed, nor did I say that at any point. I am saying that 36 people is an unreasonable expectation this late in the life of the game. 6-10, fine, 18 for voidwatch was already a little ridiculous, and Legion at 36 is just absurd. One of the major components of an event's challenge shouldn't be the logistics of getting all of the people together at one time that are willing to do it.

I played this game back when multi-alliance Dynamis was the normal, when early Kirins had a "hospital" and all that nonsense. As players we put up with it because we didn't know any better, and that's just "how it was". I did enjoy my time back then, but we've been shown there are more efficient and enjoyable ways of doing things. The nostalgia factor should be left out when evaluating new additions to the content. 36 person events just don't fly with the majority of the remaining players.

But you can use one Legion pass and enter with 18, no? Of course, I'm not sure about the differences in the setup since all the testimonials I heard last night were 36-man.

Absolutely right. I as a seasoned veteran of this stupid game, think 36 is wayy too large a requirement of participants. Seriously, at this rate sure Legion will be popular now but i see it ending up just like dynamis (which by the way required less people): one boring event that in the end lets admit it, we all afk'ed because it was just a bunch of boredom. Meh, all that aside, not much to really do. The close knit family feeling of endgame link shells have long ended. Could this give birth to them? Maybe...but i doubt it. In the end, people like me just play the game for something i have to do when i get off work early. Hell i enjoy reading AH forum more than playing. Just how i feel about things.

Meh, from anecdotal evidence on my server, there are several close knit family EGLS's on Lakshmi, but not sure about others. You have to seek that out to find it IMO, but yes they are fewer and farther between these days.

So impressions of Hall of An after 5 runs last night.

The turtle is just skillchain etc nukes. Build a lot of resist toward melee dmg fast as expected. We set a couple of SAM's or RNG/sam's doing SC's for the BLM/SCH's to nuke then kite etc around one of the pillars. We fought it first because left to its own devices he would destroy a holding party.

The wyrm is piss easy to deal with for a PLD + BRD (carols) + WHM + 1x DD (we used me on THF and a SAM/thf for our last one and it worked well). Goal was to get it to fly around 63~65% then just let the PLD hold hate with Piano/Carols etc. Around this time our crew would be done with the turtle and moved to this thing where the RNG's would do light SC's/nuke etc until it went on the floor. It's then just a Jorm fight with old school strat or simply just zerg it on the paws.

After wyrm then it's just a straight kill on the behemoth no kiting needed. We held it with an Aegis PLD, BRD, WHM, and a doing some decent damage. The bard was doing marches on the PLD.

After those are dead the others pop...and FML they like to eat babies. If you have time to reset and do it again more power to you. We had I think about 6~9 minutes left after killing the first three.

Hall of Ki notes:

Cerberus = Piss easy. Simple NIN tank or PLD w/e and TA the s#$t out of him. Gates of Hades move did decent dmg but nothing a couple of WHM's can't take care of.

Khimara = suck still working that one.

Hydra = pseudo-suck I think our guys were just tired.

If we see anything that may help other LS's we'll post it later tonight but right now Hall of Ki is nasty.

How did you handle Meteor on Behe? That was the sticking point on the PUGs I went with last night. Doing it with the LS tonight though so wanted to perfect strats.

To be honest, I see SE increasing the time limit a bit. 7 HNM's in 30 minutes means 4.28 ish minutes per mob, and I only see that happening with 2 BLM parties doing Meteors.

Forgot to mention for Hall of An we took around 25 people and for Hall of Ki we reduced to 18 to test the difficulty. Seemed easier to manage with the more people we had but that's just eyeball science. Gonna try a full 36 next time then 2 separate 18 on the same chamber and try to gauge the difficulty.

If by "vocal minority" you mean the players who for years functioned, and flourished in level 75 cap end game. The same players who for the past two years played through 3 expansions of Abyssea "low man onry so cool bro" then several installments of VW which was done 85% by PUG's. All the while paying the same subscription fees as everyone else.

Is it really too much to ask that SE saw fit to incorporate a new EG event which is best utilized by 18-36 people? It's not as if dynamis has not been tailored to low man friendly. SE released Nyzul not very long ago which is easily accessible, and Salvage 2.0 will be along sooner or later. Seems like the game is skewed pretty heavily on the low man end, and is not in danger of leaving people who like to solo or do things in small groups hanging out to dry.

If the gear purchasable with legion points is kinda meh though that is a shame. While I feel the best gear available from the event should for sure be obtainable only by treasure pools dropped from higher tiers/targets the gear bought through points should be useful. As einherjar gear was, if not a step up from that effort/reward ratio.

Meteor wasn't an issue against a properly geared PLD and the holding party paying attention. Just imagine fighting KB back at lvl 75 and not kiting it but with better damage mitigation gear. When we zerged it after the wyrm, we had all the SAM's / PLD's use JA stuns on it if we seen meteor. If one went through it still didn't do much dmg to anyone cause our WHM's were on it (whm JA ftw). I don't remember anyone dieing during the zerg portion of KB. Not a perfect strat but worked for us.

Yeah, I meant at the zerg part, not the holding part. Thanks, answered my q. When I went with the PUG last night, I was in charge of holding Jormy with the PLD on WHM all I saw was massive wiping to Meteor lol.

PLD + WHM can hold Jormy np, but I like your strat of actually doing some damage to it to save time when the main ally is done with their mob.

Ya Jormy is really squishy and if you can throw just 1 DD on it with trick attack then it saves a lot of time later. We did the same for KB. I think it was at about 50% when we went into zerg mode on it after the other 2 died.

we made it through 2 kings and behemoth 17% in a shout group and had nearly 0 dd we had a rng and 2 pld as only non mage dd i got really lucky on pld mage was on the buffs instantly when jormy stripped em 1 blm fell asleep at entrance and other pld fell asleep holding kb mob lol pug ftw