[dev1063] Job Adjustments: Warrior
[dev1063] Job Adjustments: Warrior
Pandemonium.Anookulchandra said: »
Alexander.Mastersquall said: »
Fenrir.Minjo said: »
Fenrir.Minjo said: »
A tanking WAR can cap their enmity within a minute, at which point the only useful damage they deal is during blitzes. You don't seem to understand how enmity and/or Voidwatch works.
Repeating the same thing over and over doesn't really help your argument at all, you're not providing any evidence to prove me wrong.
But you are providing evidence you don't understand it by what you are saying. That's what he's trying to tell you. That literally based off what you are saying... nevermind if I understood then you should be able to..
I've done voidwatch many times, tanked for many years on many different jobs. Nothing I have said shows lack in understanding enmity or voidwatch so unless you can specifically prove me wrong you're just being butthurt about the truth instead of trying to actually have a conversation.
Phoenix.Fredjan said: »
edit: derp
[+]
Phoenix.Fredjan said: »
edit: derp
I saw what you did... can't hide it from me..
lol
also, so much mad in the previous page
also, so much mad in the previous page
Alexander.Mastersquall said: »
Pandemonium.Anookulchandra said: »
Alexander.Mastersquall said: »
Fenrir.Minjo said: »
Fenrir.Minjo said: »
A tanking WAR can cap their enmity within a minute, at which point the only useful damage they deal is during blitzes. You don't seem to understand how enmity and/or Voidwatch works.
Repeating the same thing over and over doesn't really help your argument at all, you're not providing any evidence to prove me wrong.
But you are providing evidence you don't understand it by what you are saying. That's what he's trying to tell you. That literally based off what you are saying... nevermind if I understood then you should be able to..
I've done voidwatch many times, tanked for many years on many different jobs. Nothing I have said shows lack in understanding enmity or voidwatch so unless you can specifically prove me wrong you're just being butthurt about the truth instead of trying to actually have a conversation.
FYI, being butthurt about something, if such were the case, does not make you any less obtuse.
All of a sudden, everyone who has ever tanked ever knows how enmity works.
HEY GUYS, EVERYONE KNOWS HOW ENMITY WORKS!
Also yes, you've proved that you don't know how enmity works.
HEY GUYS, EVERYONE KNOWS HOW ENMITY WORKS!
Also yes, you've proved that you don't know how enmity works.
[+]
I once had a quadav looking in my direction while I was running through Rolanberry Fields.
Brb, writing a guide about tanking while running through Rolan.
Brb, writing a guide about tanking while running through Rolan.
[+]
Bahamut.Serj said: »
All of a sudden, everyone who has ever tanked ever knows how enmity works.
HEY GUYS, EVERYONE KNOWS HOW ENMITY WORKS!
Also yes, you've proved that you don't know how enmity works.
HEY GUYS, EVERYONE KNOWS HOW ENMITY WORKS!
Also yes, you've proved that you don't know how enmity works.
Dear me...lets see at 95 you get 1.25 CE per damage you do... you lose 1800 per hp pool you take in damage. All war JA's give 1 CE last i checked.
VE 3.75 per damage you do and you lose 60 per second. When you have decent DD's with capped CE and VE the mob hits whoever hit it last because of VE capped and will also change targets based on who it last hit if it has not been hit since both players capped enmity.
What part of enmity do i not seem to understand?
the part where you forgot to slow your roll
[+]
Quite simply, a PLD can also cap enmity values in a relatively short period of time before the Warrior is actively doing damage.
Warrior engages mob. 8,000 damage later, their enmity values are capped. If they are smart they'll have a Fanatic's Drink up and won't be taking damage.
A Warrior with a Bravura is no more useful a tank than one without on relevant Voidwatch fights. A Warrior can attain PDT-47% with mild effort. Maintaining aftermath to reduce damage taken is a pretty significant damage penalty to still risk death, especially since you're still going to need 30% in gear which hurts your output in the same way it would hurt an Ukko's WARs, though slightly to a lesser extent.
But, this still ignores that pretty much all relevant damage is done during Blitz and with Fanatic's up. And a Ukonvasara has significant damage output over Bravura. Are you done now?
Warrior engages mob. 8,000 damage later, their enmity values are capped. If they are smart they'll have a Fanatic's Drink up and won't be taking damage.
A Warrior with a Bravura is no more useful a tank than one without on relevant Voidwatch fights. A Warrior can attain PDT-47% with mild effort. Maintaining aftermath to reduce damage taken is a pretty significant damage penalty to still risk death, especially since you're still going to need 30% in gear which hurts your output in the same way it would hurt an Ukko's WARs, though slightly to a lesser extent.
But, this still ignores that pretty much all relevant damage is done during Blitz and with Fanatic's up. And a Ukonvasara has significant damage output over Bravura. Are you done now?
Bahamut.Danthebk said: »
A quick comparison between Tachi: Shoha and Ukko's Fury to show how little warrant there is for this nerf. Also, Kantanotachi+Shoha is better than Masamune and Amanomurakumo. Sucks for the career SAM's that gave it their all to be a well-geared SAM throughout the Abyssea content.
Current Ukko's:ukkos = 241 * 3.4 * 2.9 = 2376 * 1.22 = 2899
Current Shoha:shoha = 287 * 4.0 * 1.95 = 2240 * 1.19 = 2665
-Ukko's will not cap cRatio against any real mob; Shoha gets a ~67% attack bonus from what I've heard. The base Cratio of Ukko's would realistically be closer to 1.45 with berserk down, or 1.75 with berserk up, meaning the weaponskill damage would average closer to 2100-2600 depending on Berserk.
-The ideal build for Kantanotachi is a 5-hit, Ukon is a 6-hit. With Hasso+Haste on both players, Kantanotachi has 25% more weaponskill frequency.
Warrior is balanced, as with Samurai and Monk. The other jobs need a buff, Monk and Warrior do not need a nerf. Samurai is already stronger than War and most likely MNK as well. (still need to look into MNK more)
Current Ukko's:ukkos = 241 * 3.4 * 2.9 = 2376 * 1.22 = 2899
Current Shoha:shoha = 287 * 4.0 * 1.95 = 2240 * 1.19 = 2665
-Ukko's will not cap cRatio against any real mob; Shoha gets a ~67% attack bonus from what I've heard. The base Cratio of Ukko's would realistically be closer to 1.45 with berserk down, or 1.75 with berserk up, meaning the weaponskill damage would average closer to 2100-2600 depending on Berserk.
-The ideal build for Kantanotachi is a 5-hit, Ukon is a 6-hit. With Hasso+Haste on both players, Kantanotachi has 25% more weaponskill frequency.
Warrior is balanced, as with Samurai and Monk. The other jobs need a buff, Monk and Warrior do not need a nerf. Samurai is already stronger than War and most likely MNK as well. (still need to look into MNK more)
Can you do the maths for Quietus and torcleaver please?
Take a look to my item sets for those. For Quietus replace the aqua rings with raja's and spiral, replace brutal earring with aqua pearl.
I'd be thankful.
Ragnarok.Zanary said: »
what about wildfire and jishnu's >.> why dont SE lower them too
Cerberus.Detzu said: »
Bahamut.Danthebk said: »
A quick comparison between Tachi: Shoha and Ukko's Fury to show how little warrant there is for this nerf. Also, Kantanotachi+Shoha is better than Masamune and Amanomurakumo. Sucks for the career SAM's that gave it their all to be a well-geared SAM throughout the Abyssea content.
Current Ukko's:ukkos = 241 * 3.4 * 2.9 = 2376 * 1.22 = 2899
Current Shoha:shoha = 287 * 4.0 * 1.95 = 2240 * 1.19 = 2665
-Ukko's will not cap cRatio against any real mob; Shoha gets a ~67% attack bonus from what I've heard. The base Cratio of Ukko's would realistically be closer to 1.45 with berserk down, or 1.75 with berserk up, meaning the weaponskill damage would average closer to 2100-2600 depending on Berserk.
-The ideal build for Kantanotachi is a 5-hit, Ukon is a 6-hit. With Hasso+Haste on both players, Kantanotachi has 25% more weaponskill frequency.
Warrior is balanced, as with Samurai and Monk. The other jobs need a buff, Monk and Warrior do not need a nerf. Samurai is already stronger than War and most likely MNK as well. (still need to look into MNK more)
Current Ukko's:ukkos = 241 * 3.4 * 2.9 = 2376 * 1.22 = 2899
Current Shoha:shoha = 287 * 4.0 * 1.95 = 2240 * 1.19 = 2665
-Ukko's will not cap cRatio against any real mob; Shoha gets a ~67% attack bonus from what I've heard. The base Cratio of Ukko's would realistically be closer to 1.45 with berserk down, or 1.75 with berserk up, meaning the weaponskill damage would average closer to 2100-2600 depending on Berserk.
-The ideal build for Kantanotachi is a 5-hit, Ukon is a 6-hit. With Hasso+Haste on both players, Kantanotachi has 25% more weaponskill frequency.
Warrior is balanced, as with Samurai and Monk. The other jobs need a buff, Monk and Warrior do not need a nerf. Samurai is already stronger than War and most likely MNK as well. (still need to look into MNK more)
Can you do the maths for Quietus and torcleaver please?
Take a look to my item sets for those. For Quietus replace the aqua rings with raja's and spiral, replace brutal earring with aqua pearl.
I'd be thankful.
brutal > aqua
Bahamut.Atoreis said: »
Bismarck.Elanabelle said: »
Ya'll need to calm down I think.
If you look at the details of the "nerf" more closely, and actually inspect them, rather than just emo-raging, you'll see that these adjustments are only designed to tone down Ukko's Fury damage. Outside of that, WAR will remain just as viable as it is now, most likely.
Why not try out Ruinator, Upheaval, and/or Stardiver, Warriors? Might be fun.
If you look at the details of the "nerf" more closely, and actually inspect them, rather than just emo-raging, you'll see that these adjustments are only designed to tone down Ukko's Fury damage. Outside of that, WAR will remain just as viable as it is now, most likely.
Why not try out Ruinator, Upheaval, and/or Stardiver, Warriors? Might be fun.
Because I put few months and 200M into Ukonvasara?
Give it back and we can talk about other options.
Bahamut.Danthebk said: »
A quick comparison between Tachi: Shoha and Ukko's Fury to show how little warrant there is for this nerf. Also, Kantanotachi+Shoha is better than Masamune and Amanomurakumo. Sucks for the career SAM's that gave it their all to be a well-geared SAM throughout the Abyssea content.
WRONG.
WRONG.
Sylph.Biginallways said: »
Bahamut.Danthebk said: »
A quick comparison between Tachi: Shoha and Ukko's Fury to show how little warrant there is for this nerf. Also, Kantanotachi+Shoha is better than Masamune and Amanomurakumo. Sucks for the career SAM's that gave it their all to be a well-geared SAM throughout the Abyssea content.
WRONG.
WRONG.
How about we stop replying within others' quotes
[+]
Bahamut.Novadragon said: »
Asura.Solara said: »
Bahamut.Novadragon said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Vodkaa said: »
Dude who cares my 85 ukon was smashing 95 bravura, people making points about empys are doing so because the 85 stage is a complete joke to get and still made the 95 relic ga a joke.
You sir make the best point. Empys broke alot of Relic due to their ws being so damn strong.
I believe you mean "due to Relic ws being so weak". Before Ukko's was shitting on Metatron, Raging Rush and King's Justice did. Hell, at 75 Tomoe beat Amano on most content, where was the Penta Thrust nerf?
Nerfs are almost always a bad idea, the only one I can think of that made sense was the tp return nerf. All other "adjustments" they made could have been easily resolved through minor changes to enhance other jobs.
There was a Penta nerf when it's mods were changed. Even E body wars were doing 3k+ Pentas. Then the nerf came in for being too powerful.
I'm going to assume you mean the change from "damage varies" to "accuracy varies" back when they added an acc penalty (that they removed a few months later) to Penta. I don't know of any other Penta changes, if there's one I'm not aware of please let me know.
That was hardly a nerf, iirc the damage bonus didn't add anything at 100tp and no one ws's above 100tp anyway if they can help it. If anything it helped because Penta accuracy on higher level mobs was always a complaint since 2004, that change along with the 2hnd buff was a blessing.
Wars could get higher Penta damage than Sam or Drg thanks to job abilities, but it was mainly overpowered on Sam because of the hit builds available due to polearm delay.
Sams were stronger than Drgs were with their own weapon on fodder (Salvage/Limbus/Ein/Merits) mobs, and had Hagun for HNMS. Both were better than the damage of several relics, which was my original point.
Fupafighters said: »
Sylph.Biginallways said: »
Bahamut.Danthebk said: »
A quick comparison between Tachi: Shoha and Ukko's Fury to show how little warrant there is for this nerf. Also, Kantanotachi+Shoha is better than Masamune and Amanomurakumo. Sucks for the career SAM's that gave it their all to be a well-geared SAM throughout the Abyssea content.
WRONG.
WRONG.
Wow, I guess WS damage is all that matters now eh? Do parses no longer calculate DoT? Oh, that's right. WRONG! You're also forgetting that Amano at 95 has MUCH higher base dmg which also affects WS dmg. You obviously have no clue what you're talking about so take a chill pill.
Bravura Best Weapon in Game For me Period.
Empy's is what i make for my Mules. Muhahaha
Empy's is what i make for my Mules. Muhahaha
Enough about samurai lol...Warrior thread! Arent they upping double attack and critical attack bonus in job traits for warrior?
I thought about gloating a little myself, but since most Ukon war's suck and I've outparsed every single ukon war i've gone up against it's not that big of a deal. Most don't know how the hell to gear properly outside of abyssea anyways. All this update will do is separate the truly good warriors from the truly bad ones. Oh, and for you people that think 6 hitting is better than 5 hitting on warrior.... yeah, not so much. They do still teach math in the US don't they?
Fupafighters said: »
Enough about samurai lol...Warrior thread! Arent they upping double attack and critical attack bonus in job traits for warrior?
lol..... no but they are removing crit bonus...
Yeah from the job ability and ws...but arent they improving the job trait for warrior?
Fupafighters said: »
Yeah from the job ability and ws...but arent they improving the job trait for warrior?
Sylph.Biginallways said: »
I thought about gloating a little myself, but since most Ukon war's suck and I've outparsed every single ukon war i've gone up against it's not that big of a deal. Most don't know how the hell to gear properly outside of abyssea anyways. All this update will do is separate the truly good warriors from the truly bad ones. Oh, and for you people that think 6 hitting is better than 5 hitting on warrior.... yeah, not so much. They do still teach math in the US don't they?
in US? lol I guess you have to be from US to own a computer... or have internet... cause you back water countries like the ones you are from don't have those.
Never heard of sarcasm have you? I was born from and continue to live in the United States.
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