Young Man Raised By Lesbian Couple [video]

I agree it got derailed by a theology lesson on biblical accuracy and blah blah. Thought id post this video. It's airing in Australia and Canada and parts of Europe atm.

The same thing that happened to any socially controversial topic on FFXIAH.

I won't shower you with pretty words, but you do have my admiration for hanging in there.

I don't know who asked me earlier, but if anyone's still wondering why I lash out against religion and its teachings, read this man's post again.

I love you both. Don't make yourself a hypocrite by judging me because of a group that "I" belong to. <3

Well then I'm safe because I've made no judgement about you personally.

One of the best replies I've ever seen on the internet.

Sure, I think that's a lot of it - but that's a damn near impossible thing to fix, and certainly far harder than passing laws.

Here we are 150 years after slavery is gone, or 50 years after civil rights, and racism is still pretty strong, especially in certain parts of the country. Are we ever going to remove the bulk of racism? Possibly, but probably not for another 200 years, even with a black president.

So I'm back to the original question - knowing full well that any gay person or child of gay parents is going to face huge challenges in my lifetime, as Luces so clearly stated, what am I to do?

This is where I really feel stuck - no matter what I do, someone is going to suffer. Either the child is born and lives through hell, or the child isn't born and society misses out on a great person. I don't like being put in a situation where I lose no matter what I do, I want another alternative!

Edit: The alternative of crusading for gay rights won't happen either - even if I had the time, which I don't, it's just not as important as other issues to me right now.

Pardon my obliviousness, but why?

I don't go to churchs I avoid them, but I have met some very lovely youth pastors that have invited me to their church. I don't care if your a Christian or anything, I'll paint a picture of you based on your actions.

How are these out of context? Further, how is this moral? What are we to learn from this as humans living in the 21st century?

Im aware of the many stories that have positive lessons within the Bible but there are so many passages like the one above that most people mentally erase them because they're nothing more than the ramblings of Bronze Age men.


How is this out of context? It seems pretty clear you're to kill anyone who attempts to sway you from serving God and to do it without hesitation.

Simply because he stated that He shouldn't be judged solely based on his association with a certain group of people. Not because of which group he is associated with, but that he is part of a group. The next reply was wonderful as well, stating that he/she had made no judgement of him personally so they had nothing to worry about. I + but was again too lazy to incorporate it into this with an edit.

I don't know, maybe because you took one or two verses out of a book in which the entirety of that book had a meaning. I know that the ends don't always justify the means in any situation, and there are terrible acts to humanity committed in the Bible. Asked of by our Lord even, but they are all done for the ultimate good of mankind. Do we have the brains to grasp the entirety of those plans? No, that is why these things seem so horrific. You and I have already had the discussion in which we disagree on whether this is the only existence we will know, and that changes quite a bit about the permanence of physical death. In that small portion of this situation, you and I will never see eye to eye.


As far as this: That's a hard thing to explain. In those times, it was followed literally. Today, I read it to show that you do whatever it takes to stand strong and not let others sway you from your faith. To 'kill' them is the ultimate in removing their influence. Today, does that mean I take a knife to someone because they try to sway me from my faith? No, it means I cut ties from them to whatever point necessary in which they no longer have influence over me. If we are both in agreement that we disagree on God, but everyone leaves it be, then we can be best friends. If they are continually attempting to make me question my own beliefs, I may need to cut them out of my life completely. That's how I see it.

I guess someone hasn't seen this season of Dexter :)

Why is it that I just suddenly keep seeing this video everywhere? I knew this guy, I'm from Iowa near where this occurred. The video was even on the news here. This happened a couple years back when we first had gay marriage and some people were attempting to change the constitution or pass an anti-marriage law. The supreme court ruled a law against gay marriage as unconstitutional, and we ended up losing three justices in retaliation (thanks in part to some crazy out-of-state activists):

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/article/20101103/NEWS09/11030390/Iowans-dismiss-three-justices

Really though, why is this just now suddenly so popular? Did someone just now go and reddit it a year or two late?

As for the conversation at hand... Meh. Considering the thousands of kids we have who are parentless, abused, or raised by a single mom, why is this even an issue?

People just get really bored if they don't have something to complain about.

I don't judge the religious because I think they're all fear-mongering gay-haters. Most of the people I surround myself with are slightly religious, and I love them all the same. That has no bearing on my judgement of their critical shortcomings. Its really that simple. I hold the omnicritical on a higher intellectual level than the selectively critical, as I very well should.

This is absolutely absurd. My brain is fully capable of understanding the plan that created the Bible. Your inability to apply critical thinking to what you hold to be the ultimate truth has nothing to do with anyone else's brain.

I cannot believe you just said that.

This is wrong, Yes I don't practice homosexuality, it's looked down upon on us to do it but butting into someone else's lives and telling how they should live it? Not my place if they want my opinion they'll ask for it if they really care chances are they aren't because that's what they look for in life.

Seriously think people are believing that the nut-zealots make up the religion just because they're louder, more violent, and a hell of a lot easier to notice that we're all evil cynical ***.

I like original concept behind the Constituition and it's one that I practice separation of church and state. No need to blend them together as some people do but I'd like to think to some others that they're two different machines with different sets of operations and objectives.

It's really not just religious bigots, it's also about money which is why they're fighting for that title for tax benefits since the more people that have them the less benefit it would be overall for people. Like if there were drafts and mandatory service not everyone in this day and age could hope for the benefits to be the same as it were a volunteer service.

Kinda why smokers are great, they pay more taxes than we have to or alcoholics; it all feeds the pot baby and if that change isn't there where do you think the difference comes out of?

this turned into an interesting thread XD i guess I'm off topic from the OP here... but as far as the general religious/bible discussion. I'm of the belief that the bible was written by man, i don't personally think that God wrote it through man (obviously just MY opinion). regardless, even if it was in fact written by God, through man, it wasn't translated by God through man.

the bible has gone through many translations and transitions throughout time, I'd have to be tinfoil hat paranoid to think the entire thing was utterly rewritten, but I'm just saying much of what you read in the bible is very likely not the exact intent of what was written. and its reasonable to believe that those who translated it, would be tempted to translate with their own bias (if you ever studied a foreign language you would know you can't simply translate word for word, you have to assume context.)

I... don't personally know the first language the bible was written in (Hebrew?) but I'd say the closest thing you could find to its full and truest intent are the Dead Sea Scrolls. unfortunately much of the text from them were destroyed over time, but even those were translated from Hebrew i believe.

and in a closing statement, i have my own beliefs, i believe in them very strongly. some may say that if i don't believe in the bible the same as them then i don't believe in that God. you have the right to think that, but I still know what i believe, and not you. also i say all this strictly for the idea of discussion, i hold no grudges against anyone here or their opinion. i just found this interesting so i thought i'd say something XD

I got some questions:

How is it possible that the words of god be mistranslated, misinterpreted or open to interpretation?
Is his words not supposed to be absolute?
How can his "words" been obscured through the many translations?
If he really is so almighty and omnipotent then couldn't he had very easily taken magical godly measures to ensure that that would never happen?
Was that too hard or was he just didn't quite think that through? or is it possible that he intended for all of those mistranslations and misinterpretations including all of the extreme, very violent ones. Was it his intention to split apart his loyal followers by making it "open to interpretation?"
Or is this supposed to be some sort of "test" to see who will be able to keep true to his original proclamations?

Is it possible that he's laughing his *** off watching all the ***happening because of him?

I'm atheist, but I can try to explain this fallacy for you. God doesn't work on your terms. So whatever you think is rational, throw it out the window because you're talking about religion. Also, how would they not be open to multiple interpretations?

"I am the door; if anyone enters through Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.” –John 10:9

Ostensible literal and figurative interpretations, given the reader has a brain.

I just don't understand why it would be. God's word is god's word not god's word and whatever the hell you want to make of it, right?

If the Bible is really god's words and he really did intend for it to be then I think he cracking up right and having one hell of a time watching.
Also, didn't we eat the apple from the tree that supposedly gave us the same knowledge as god? So, shouldn't we be able to understand his workings somewhat or did I get that wrong and Adam and Eve got duped into eating a regular apple? I don't really keep up with religion.

Oh, something else I've been wondering. Theists believe in some sort of omnipotent being(s). Atheists don't such beings exists. Agnostic's can't make up their mind. What do you call someone who could care less? Would that fall into the agnostic category?

I don't know, I guess its subject to interpretation like any literature is - the way one word can mean eight different things. You are saying he should have had us wired to interpret things the same way? That undermines our free will :( anyways, I just think we can't extrapolate what we "know" of God and make assertions about what he thinks or why he does things.

edit: I think you are an apatheist

Have you never heard of any of the history of changes in Biblical scripture by the church or whatnot, sometimes for selfish purposes? Entire sections ignored, words altered.

I'm not religious. I don't know what may or may not have been obscured. What I do know is that there are thousands of versions of the Bible, plenty of sections of biblical text ignored, and plenty of parts changed for purposes other than simple clarity. The best example I can think of is the Council of Nicaea, if you want to look that up. And, the best reasoning I can give as to why god wouldn't 'guide' the translations is "something something free will."


There are a lot of things that fall into the agnostic category - to each their own, I suppose. I guess you could say I couldn't care less. The way I see it, I have no proof as to whether or not there is a god or an afterlife. As far as I'm concerned, I know what life I do have to utilize, and I see no reason for an omniscient power to be concerned with my minor existence. If there's an afterlife, then that's great, probably even preferable. If not, then at least I lived what I did have to the fullest rather than devoting it to something that turned out to be false. Thus, I consider myself to be agnostic. Or, as you say, I just don't care.
I expect a response along the lines of, "if you don't care, then why don't you just accept Jesus to prevent going to hell just in case?" Just, no. If I actually wanted to devote myself to a religious belief, it would not be one with such requirements. I respect those that do, but it's not for me. Sorry.

Someone asked me this once. Something along the lines of "But why not be a believer just in case its all true?" IMO, if you're just using God as a safety net, your faith probably isn't genuine enough to get that trip to heaven anyhow. I don't think anyone is capable of faking out an omniscient God :/

Despite appearances in this thread, I'm not a "white knight" for the LGBT community. However, I am definitely a champion for equality, and the legal/political recognition of equality.

Check this out:

Have you ever played the game, where someone starts with a message, and whispers it to someone else, who passes it onto another, and so on. By the time it gets through everyone, the message that comes out at the end is usually entirely different to the original, whether it be through simple misunderstanding, or people just changing it for their own reason.

Im not a christian, I never will be, however I was raised in a christian community and spent 12 years of my life in strict religous schools, so I've seen all sorts of them, and I respect them and their views, so long as they respect mine. My view of the bible and religions in general, is like that game. Think of how many years that 'message' has been passed on for, think of how many people and languages its gone through. God didnt physically write the bible. And despite what anyone says, I very much doubt god had ever materialised before someone and told them to copy down word for word what he said to them.

The bible was written by human beings, who as it says, are imperfect beings who lie. Is the bible one big fat lie? I have no idea, I wasnt around when all the parts of it were written so I will never know, but history shows people changing the religion to suit their own needs, so how much of the bible has been changed? If I recall correctly, for a long time it was only written in languages that priests could read, and they invented many things to benefit themselves that nobody could debate them on, since nobody else could read it (forgive my lack of sources, its 5am and Im still waking up)

I really dont understand all these non christians who are bashing christians for being religous, or telling them their views are wrong, yet when said christians agree with that, those same people tell them they're wrong for NOT behaving like the people they originally claimed about. Really? You people just want an excuse to hate. Religion is just a way of living. If its not harming you in any way, just let people believe what they want. I would think you people should want christians to not support hate and bigotry, which IMO many of this generation dont.

Although I would like to add, I spent a few months living in america, and I did notice how much more...forceful many christians were in spreading and recruiting, whereas in my country I have rarely come across people like what I saw there. Im not accusing anyone in this thread of being like that, simply trying to give some credit to the other side of the fence and accept/understand why some people are so anti-religous.

I'd recommend On the Dignity of Man

You have a choice to live however you like, with due consequence basically. I personally like Muhammed's (pbuh) share most people are animals and plants.

If you make things plain as day people stray away from it because it doesn't suit their fancy.

If you make it metaphorical people interpret the same thing differently and clash about who's right and who's wrong.

My personal opinion is that there isn't an encyclopedia on how to live life correctly, sure you're given guidelines by different creeds by different religions, philosophies, and societies. You have to find out how to make it work, or don't and even if you do it's not perfect or truly appreciated because of conflict that you took to get there. Still trying makes you stronger even if you don't go through with it, it's better than having blanket statements about religious people that you don't fully comprehend due to stupidity(which is refusal to understand).

He gave us the choice to choose from right and wrong and to ponder past events those two things are what separates us from the rest of the animals on the planet. It's a power and responsibility like any other if you cannot control it, then you'll be just like the rest of them and I don't mean fullblown running through the savannah and gouging gazelles for meat either.

We're humans with ego, with all of our incredible and expedient advances in technology and comforts we feel a lot more important than we realize and because of that if it doesn't bend to our way or isn't convenient and lacks calculated, statistical data it's probrably not right.

They threw it when you could see the girl's arm move halfway through.

Sadly, he squats to pee.