Illegal To Kiss In Public In America

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2010-09-08
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Illegal to kiss in public in america
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 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:03:30
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Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:04:14
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Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
 Cerberus.Eugene
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:04:50
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Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:

Figures. So feeling up little kids is fine by you, but demonstrating in a place where demonstrations are prohibited is fine. Makes perfect sense.

Huge difference between public grounds and privately owned institutions with policy regarding your purchased patronage.
Airports are public property, try again.

To operate privately owned businesses.
The TSA is merely a federally enforced safety commission that comes with the territory. If you're not flying, you won't have to worry about it.

It still applies to other instances of public property, there are places that are strictly public property that are still closed to the public.
 Cerberus.Lasareth
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By Cerberus.Lasareth 2011-05-29 12:05:14
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Artemicion said:
Assuming their dance was a matter of happenstance and being in the moment of being a couple, it seems rather obscene the manner in which this law was enforced. If this was some assembled protest to call out how juvenile the law is, then they executed it quite poorly. Besides, why not perform civil disobedience on more pressing matters than dancing at a memorial?

You tell me, people do this all the time on lesser scales. People just like to find things to complain about when they are complacent.

If the handling of the situation is a gross injustice then appeal to the proper venues. Start with the law enforcement, then work your way up if they refuse to hear anything about it. But at some point the situation becomes: Is it worth taking to the supreme court over superficial injuries and bruised egos?

I just think the entire thing is being blown out of proportion.
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:05:18
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Cerberus.Eugene said:
Cerberus.Lasareth said:
Artemicion said:
Are you suggesting dancing wasn't happenstance with these folks?
It would seem silly if it was deliberate by means of protest from the initial purpose of being at the memorial.

My limited knowledge of the entire situation suggests yes but obviously I can't know for sure.
Apparently it wasn't chance. They were gathering to protest the 2008 arrest and 2009 ruling.
You're right the arrest was 2008 and the ruling was 2009.
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By Wenuden 2011-05-29 12:06:26
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Leviathan.Chaosx said:
There is a law that states that demonstrations are prohibited at the Jefferson Memorial. It stems from a court decision from 2008.


Clearly they disagree with the law, and are attempting to use the final clause of

Bill.Of.Rights said:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

to show this.

Public property is public property. What part of "Congress shall make no law" is hard to understand?
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:07:40
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Cerberus.Lasareth said:
Artemicion said:
Assuming their dance was a matter of happenstance and being in the moment of being a couple, it seems rather obscene the manner in which this law was enforced. If this was some assembled protest to call out how juvenile the law is, then they executed it quite poorly. Besides, why not perform civil disobedience on more pressing matters than dancing at a memorial?

You tell me, people do this all the time on lesser scales. People just like to find things to complain about when they are complacent.

If the handling of the situation is a gross injustice then appeal to the proper venues. Start with the law enforcement, then work your way up if they refuse to hear anything about it. But at some point the situation becomes: Is it worth taking to the supreme court over superficial injuries and bruised egos?

I just think the entire thing is being blown out of proportion.

Lack of knowledge on the situation puts all our arguments to be flawed. But either way, I think the police were rather excessive on this, especially when it doesn't particularly pose any threat or alienation of others within the area.
 Cerberus.Eugene
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:07:51
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Wenuden said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
There is a law that states that demonstrations are prohibited at the Jefferson Memorial. It stems from a court decision from 2008.


Clearly they disagree with the law, and are attempting to use the final clause of

Bill.Of.Rights said:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

to show this.

Public property is public property. What part of "Congress shall make no law" is hard to understand?

That's not entirely true, public property isn't necessarily open public forum. You are allowed to demonstrate (within certain restrictions) on open public forum (public park, street corner).

You are not allowed to demonstrate on closed public forum (ie military base, prison, Jefferson monument).
 Sylph.Tigerwoods
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By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-05-29 12:09:12
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 Cerberus.Eugene
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:11:16
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Artemicion said:

Lack of knowledge on the situation puts all our arguments to be flawed.
That doesn't mean that it shouldn't be discussed. I learned quite a few things about public forum by discussing this.
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:11:36
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Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
Just like these people choose to demonstrate in a place where demonstrations are banned.
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:13:03
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Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
Just like these people choose to demonstrate in a place where demonstrations are banned.

On public grounds; as opposed to refusing mandatory protocol of a purchase?
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:13:31
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Cerberus.Eugene said:
Artemicion said:

Lack of knowledge on the situation puts all our arguments to be flawed.
That doesn't mean that it shouldn't be discussed. I learned quite a few things about public forum by discussing this.

Oh of course, it's interesting to debate about either way but neither of us can put our arguments as an absolution.
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:14:49
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Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
Just like these people choose to demonstrate in a place where demonstrations are banned.
I don't have a problem that they were protesting a law. I have a problem that they weren't clearly protesting a law.

The situation would have been different if they clearly stated what they were protesting, and protested in an organized and coherent manner.
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:16:04
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Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
Just like these people choose to demonstrate in a place where demonstrations are banned.

On public grounds; as opposed to refusing mandatory protocol of a purchase?
I guess these folks didn't read up on the protocol for holding a demonstration. http://www.ehow.com/how_2051467_organize-protest-washington-dc.html
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:16:51
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Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
Just like these people choose to demonstrate in a place where demonstrations are banned.

On public grounds; as opposed to refusing mandatory protocol of a purchase?
I guess these folks didn't read on the protocol for holding a demonstration. http://www.ehow.com/how_2051467_organize-protest-washington-dc.html

Implying their dance was an act of protest to begin with.
We simply don't know.
 Cerberus.Eugene
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:18:12
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Hades.Stefanos said:
Found an article to go with this.

http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/307284

Quote:
Washington - Five people were arrested for dancing at the Thomas Jefferson Memorial, in defiance of a ban on demonstrations at the site.
The flash mob was organized through Twitter and Facebook as a protest against a recent court decision upholding a 2008 verdict that banned dancing at the memorial.
Andrew Sharp, a protester, told radio station WTOP:

"I think some people thought it was a joke at first, and then they started putting handcuffs on people and were very, very serious about it."

Sharp also said that people were told that no warnings would be given, and arrests would be made on the spot.
The court's decision stems from 2008, when Mary Oberwetter was arrested by police for dancing at the Jefferson Memorial on the eve of the former president's 265th birthday. Oberwetter, then 28, was charged with a misdemeanor count of interfering with agency functions, and was later released.
Oberwetter sued the Park Service in 2009, saying that her arrest for dancing was a violation of her First Amendment rights. In her suit, she asked U.S. District Judge John D. Bates to stop the Park Service from preventing such demonstrations in the future.
In his final decision, Bates took side with the Park Service, writing in his 26-page opinion:

“...the purpose of the Memorial is to publicize Thomas Jefferson's legacy, so that critics and supporters alike may contemplate his place in history. The Park Service prohibits all demonstrations in the interior of the Jefferson Memorial, in order to maintain an "an atmosphere of calm, tranquility, and reverence,"'”

The Justice Department, acting on behalf of the Park Service, wrote in court papers:

“The Memorial is, has long been, and is intended to be a place of calm, tranquillity, and reverence—a place where visitors can go to celebrate and honor Jefferson and enjoy and contemplate the Memorial itself without the distraction of public demonstrations and other expressive activities. The Memorial is akin to a temple or a shrine (both in terms of its purpose and its physical characteristics), not a place of public expression.”

A second event is planned for June 4.

Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/307284#ixzz1Nil36ptSp

Assuming this is right, then f those people arrested. They were breaking rules, simple as that. It could be just me, but I agree that a place like the Jefferson Memorial is no place for stupid crap like dancing and couples having to kiss and such in public.

According to this article it was.
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:18:52
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Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Artemicion said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
Go ahead feel up little kids, but dare try to stop me from dancing and kissing in a place where it's strictly banned.

Not saying TSA policy isn't ***, but it honestly comes with the territory of a choice purchase. Just sayin.
Just like these people choose to demonstrate in a place where demonstrations are banned.

On public grounds; as opposed to refusing mandatory protocol of a purchase?
I guess these folks didn't read on the protocol for holding a demonstration. http://www.ehow.com/how_2051467_organize-protest-washington-dc.html

Implying their dance was an act of protest to begin with.
We simply don't know.
We do.

Quote:
The flash mob was organized through Twitter and Facebook as a protest against a recent court decision upholding a 2008 verdict that banned dancing at the memorial.
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By Ramuh.Thunderz 2011-05-29 12:18:52
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There is a way to do things

If you don't like the law you can dispute it.

They just took the stupid path
[+]
 Ramuh.Krizz
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By Ramuh.Krizz 2011-05-29 12:20:08
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I don't think there was any brutality in the video. Maybe if you play it muted (which I typically do). The guy taken down to the ground was warned (to get on his knees) more than once before the cop did so. The cop had his hand on his throat, yeah, but I don't think he was actually choking the guy. He was simply keeping him in place while giving TWO more 'final warnings'. I could be wrong on that, but I seriously doubt there was more than minor pressure on the guy's neck.

I was more bothered by the one cop being unprofessional when he yelled at the guy on the bench to shut up. I don't know if he tried to get the guy to quiet down peacefully before that, but don't sink down to their level.
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:20:13
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Ramuh.Thunderz said:
There is a way to do things

If you don't like the law you can dispute it.

They just took the stupid path
So true.
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:21:49
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Ramuh.Krizz said:
I don't think there was any brutality in the video. Maybe if you play it muted (which I typically do). The guy taken down to the ground was warned (to get on his knees) more than once before the cop did so. The cop had his hand on his throat, yeah, but I don't think he was actually choking the guy. He was simply keeping him in place while giving TWO more 'final warnings'. I could be wrong on that, but I seriously doubt there was more than minor pressure on the guy's neck.

I was more bothered by the one cop being unprofessional when he yelled at the guy on the bench to shut up. I don't know if he tried to get the guy to quiet down peacefully before that, but don't sink down to their level.

They could have simply been kicked out if they failed to comply.
Simple as that. I don't see a need to arrest anyone for the sake of dancing in a memorial; whether it is illegal or not.
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:22:57
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Leviathan.Chaosx said:
I guess these folks didn't read up on the protocol for holding a demonstration. http://www.ehow.com/how_2051467_organize-protest-washington-dc.html

I was going to criticize the advice of ehow on legal matters, but then I remembered this was an lolinternet debate.
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By Asura.Vyre 2011-05-29 12:24:48
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Read entire thread to this point...
 Leviathan.Chaosx
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By Leviathan.Chaosx 2011-05-29 12:25:49
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Cerberus.Eugene said:
Leviathan.Chaosx said:
I guess these folks didn't read up on the protocol for holding a demonstration. http://www.ehow.com/how_2051467_organize-protest-washington-dc.html

I was going to criticize the advice of ehow on legal matters, but then I remembered this was an lolinternet debate.
Yeah, but my point was that there are legal steps involved when you want to start a protest. You can't just hold a protest where ever you want whenever you want.
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By Cerberus.Eugene 2011-05-29 12:26:23
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Yeah I know, at second glance there was nothing wrong with citing that in this situation.
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By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-05-29 12:26:34
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Artemicion said:
Ramuh.Krizz said:
I don't think there was any brutality in the video. Maybe if you play it muted (which I typically do). The guy taken down to the ground was warned (to get on his knees) more than once before the cop did so. The cop had his hand on his throat, yeah, but I don't think he was actually choking the guy. He was simply keeping him in place while giving TWO more 'final warnings'. I could be wrong on that, but I seriously doubt there was more than minor pressure on the guy's neck.

I was more bothered by the one cop being unprofessional when he yelled at the guy on the bench to shut up. I don't know if he tried to get the guy to quiet down peacefully before that, but don't sink down to their level.

They could have simply been kicked out if they failed to comply.
Simple as that. I don't see a need to arrest anyone for the sake of dancing in a memorial; whether it is illegal or not.
If I were the cop, and some people were just dancing, I wouldn't have even asked them to leave. I'd have just asked them to stop and let them know it wasn't legal to dance there.

If I told them it wasn't legal to dance there, and they go out of their way to antagonize me, you can be your sweet *** and half a titty I'd do everything legally within my power to return the favor to them.
 Ramuh.Krizz
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By Ramuh.Krizz 2011-05-29 12:28:24
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Artemicion said:
Ramuh.Krizz said:
I don't think there was any brutality in the video. Maybe if you play it muted (which I typically do). The guy taken down to the ground was warned (to get on his knees) more than once before the cop did so. The cop had his hand on his throat, yeah, but I don't think he was actually choking the guy. He was simply keeping him in place while giving TWO more 'final warnings'. I could be wrong on that, but I seriously doubt there was more than minor pressure on the guy's neck.

I was more bothered by the one cop being unprofessional when he yelled at the guy on the bench to shut up. I don't know if he tried to get the guy to quiet down peacefully before that, but don't sink down to their level.

They could have simply been kicked out if they failed to comply.
Simple as that. I don't see a need to arrest anyone for the sake of dancing in a memorial; whether it is illegal or not.
They were specifically told "you will be arrested." If they hadn't been told that, I would agree with you completely.
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By Artemicion 2011-05-29 12:29:35
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Sylph.Tigerwoods said:
Artemicion said:
Ramuh.Krizz said:
I don't think there was any brutality in the video. Maybe if you play it muted (which I typically do). The guy taken down to the ground was warned (to get on his knees) more than once before the cop did so. The cop had his hand on his throat, yeah, but I don't think he was actually choking the guy. He was simply keeping him in place while giving TWO more 'final warnings'. I could be wrong on that, but I seriously doubt there was more than minor pressure on the guy's neck.

I was more bothered by the one cop being unprofessional when he yelled at the guy on the bench to shut up. I don't know if he tried to get the guy to quiet down peacefully before that, but don't sink down to their level.

They could have simply been kicked out if they failed to comply.
Simple as that. I don't see a need to arrest anyone for the sake of dancing in a memorial; whether it is illegal or not.
If I were the cop, and some people were just dancing, I wouldn't have even asked them to leave. I'd have just asked them to stop and let them know it wasn't legal to dance there.

If I told them it wasn't legal to dance there, and they go out of their way to antagonize me, you can be your sweet *** and half a titty I'd do everything legally within my power to return the favor to them.

As I mentioned earlier, one cannot put their ego in the equation as a law-enforcer. Otherwise we'd see a lot more excessive use of tasers and or guns; regardless of the stupid things people do and say. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. This applies to both parties however.
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By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2011-05-29 12:30:36
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Artemicion said:
Sylph.Tigerwoods said:
Artemicion said:
Ramuh.Krizz said:
I don't think there was any brutality in the video. Maybe if you play it muted (which I typically do). The guy taken down to the ground was warned (to get on his knees) more than once before the cop did so. The cop had his hand on his throat, yeah, but I don't think he was actually choking the guy. He was simply keeping him in place while giving TWO more 'final warnings'. I could be wrong on that, but I seriously doubt there was more than minor pressure on the guy's neck.

I was more bothered by the one cop being unprofessional when he yelled at the guy on the bench to shut up. I don't know if he tried to get the guy to quiet down peacefully before that, but don't sink down to their level.

They could have simply been kicked out if they failed to comply.
Simple as that. I don't see a need to arrest anyone for the sake of dancing in a memorial; whether it is illegal or not.
If I were the cop, and some people were just dancing, I wouldn't have even asked them to leave. I'd have just asked them to stop and let them know it wasn't legal to dance there.

If I told them it wasn't legal to dance there, and they go out of their way to antagonize me, you can be your sweet *** and half a titty I'd do everything legally within my power to return the favor to them.

As I mentioned earlier, one cannot put their ego in the equation as a law-enforcer. Otherwise we'd see a lot more excessive use of tasers and or guns; regardless of the stupid things people do and say. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. This applies to both parties however.
Which is why I said everything legally within my power. If they're within my bounds, there's no reason not to do it.
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