Merits For A Endgame RDM

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2010-09-08
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merits for a endgame RDM
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 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-09-02 00:17:09
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Yet the only advantage is increasing the speed of your kill, I wouldn't advocate Bio 3 as an end all merit for RDMs.
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 Siren.Catabolic
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By Siren.Catabolic 2010-09-02 00:26:05
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It can't be denied though that its outstanding for RDM solo. Hearing ppl say Bio2 is even in the same galaxy as Bio3, is a total joke. Even at 291+ dark magic skill a taru blm would need to cast 2 completely unresisted AM2's on top of its Bio2 in a 30 minute fight just to come close in dmg to an Rdm's Bio3 5/5. I'd say that's a noticeable return on merits spent.

edit also in that 30 minutes blm would spend more mp casting Bio2. Add that onto the 2 AM2's and an RDM does the same if not more dmg in 30 minutes and spends roughly 600 less mps doing so.
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-09-02 00:27:42
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Outstanding is a little extreme, all you really gain from Bio3 is a shorter fight span, you either care about that or you don't, so to each their own.
 Leviathan.Dissonant
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By Leviathan.Dissonant 2010-09-02 00:51:35
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Siren.Catabolic said:
Bio3 5/5 does 220 more dmg in 2 and a half minutes than Bio2 does in 2 minutes. Not to mention it also weakens the enemies attacks more than Bio2 does. So yea I'd say its pretty valuable. Bio3 4/5 does 40 more dmg than Bio2 does in the same amount of time and only costs 18 more mp. So even at 4/5 Bio3 is hands down better than Bio2.

Oh yea, btw that's assuming the Bio2 is cast from a job with 291+ dark magic skill. If not then Bio3 is even that much greater. If you drop down to an Rdms average dark magic skill that would mean 5/5 Bio3 does 300 more dmg and 4/5 does 120 more dmg. If the fight takes 30 minutes that translates into Bio3 5/5 doing 3.6k more dmg than Bio2 would do. Wanna talk blm Bio2? Then its still roughly 2.5k dmg more in 30 minutes. Idk to me 3.6k more dmg sounds pretty awesome and mp efficient. So I guess the question is, is 3.6k more dmg, and ultimately saving you a ton of mps worth it? If it is than Bio3 is much much much much much much much better than Bio2.
Oh, look. Someone with an opinion on bio that isn't "hur dur ur dum olololololol"
 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-02 00:55:37
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Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Outstanding is a little extreme, all you really gain from Bio3 is a shorter fight span, you either care about that or you don't, so to each their own.
And lower attack!!! And I'm not kidding when I say the differene is highly noticable in blood soloing

Also I wouldn't compare dots to AM2...

I mean dots are by nature highly efficient. AM2 is fairly inefficient. ONly thing less efficient would be AM lol.
 Leviathan.Dissonant
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By Leviathan.Dissonant 2010-09-02 01:03:19
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Ramuh.Dasva said:
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Outstanding is a little extreme, all you really gain from Bio3 is a shorter fight span, you either care about that or you don't, so to each their own.
And lower attack!!! And I'm not kidding when I say the differene is highly noticable in blood soloing

Also I wouldn't compare dots to AM2...

I mean dots are by nature highly efficient. AM2 is fairly inefficient. ONly thing less efficient would be AM lol
What are you talking about? AM2s are so awesome. It costs me approximately double the MP of a T4 and does nearly 30% more damage!!1!
 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-02 01:04:40
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Not to mention 1 more dmg per tic or even 2 (haven't heard if it goes up to 10) would only be 600 or 1200 more dmg over 30 min... definitely not 2 unresisted AM2s. Not even 1 from a good blm
 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-02 01:06:47
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Leviathan.Dissonant said:
What are you talking about? AM2s are so awesome. It costs me approximately double the MP of a T4 and does nearly 30% more damage!!1!
I agree they are awesome. But they are mp inefficient. Mostly for starting spells in soloing/manaburn or when you are only doing spike dmg on hnms where tp given to dmg dealt is more important than mp used to dmg dealt. And where you can get bonus dmg from skillchain
 Leviathan.Dissonant
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By Leviathan.Dissonant 2010-09-02 01:08:32
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Ramuh.Dasva said:
Leviathan.Dissonant said:
What are you talking about? AM2s are so awesome. It costs me approximately double the MP of a T4 and does nearly 30% more damage!!1!
I agree they are awesome. But they are mp inefficient. Mostly for starting spells in soloing/manaburn or when you are only doing spike dmg on hnms where tp given to dmg dealt is more important than mp used to dmg dealt. And where you can get bonus dmg from skillchain
Sarcasm ):
Edit: not disagreeing with the points you made
 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-02 01:13:04
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Lol I know it was sarcasm. That's why I specified it's good points. I suppose you cold add the resist down.... but yeah
 Lakshmi.Emanuelle
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By Lakshmi.Emanuelle 2010-09-02 09:19:36
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Pandemonium.Spicyryan said:
Lakshmi.Emanuelle said:
Unicorn.Tarowyn said:
If you have only one merit in slow 2, it caps out at 35% slow. Adding merits brings that up to 39%. You can't get that 39% with 1 merit no matter how much mnd you put in.

That is great, but meriting slow II past 1/5 really will not matter much outside of blood tanking. It is only 4% which does not matter when blink tanking and would not of made the difference if waiting on shadow recast.

They are much better spent in paralyze II.
yeah , like rdm can tank now with the spell's nerf rite?
 Ifrit.Vextra
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By Ifrit.Vextra 2010-09-02 09:23:28
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Lakshmi.Emanuelle said:
Pandemonium.Spicyryan said:
Lakshmi.Emanuelle said:
Unicorn.Tarowyn said:
If you have only one merit in slow 2, it caps out at 35% slow. Adding merits brings that up to 39%. You can't get that 39% with 1 merit no matter how much mnd you put in.

That is great, but meriting slow II past 1/5 really will not matter much outside of blood tanking. It is only 4% which does not matter when blink tanking and would not of made the difference if waiting on shadow recast.

They are much better spent in paralyze II.
yeah , like rdm can tank now with the spell's nerf rite?

i bet you blink tank with composure up
 Lakshmi.Emanuelle
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By Lakshmi.Emanuelle 2010-09-02 09:23:59
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Leviathan.Dissonant said:
Ramuh.Dasva said:
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Outstanding is a little extreme, all you really gain from Bio3 is a shorter fight span, you either care about that or you don't, so to each their own.
And lower attack!!! And I'm not kidding when I say the differene is highly noticable in blood soloing

Also I wouldn't compare dots to AM2...

I mean dots are by nature highly efficient. AM2 is fairly inefficient. ONly thing less efficient would be AM lol
What are you talking about? AM2s are so awesome. It costs me approximately double the MP of a T4 and does nearly 30% more damage!!1!
however am2's will kinda get useless now with tier5 nukes, nice avatar btw makes me laugh looks funny XD
 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-02 09:24:08
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Lakshmi.Emanuelle said:
Pandemonium.Spicyryan said:
Lakshmi.Emanuelle said:
Unicorn.Tarowyn said:
If you have only one merit in slow 2, it caps out at 35% slow. Adding merits brings that up to 39%. You can't get that 39% with 1 merit no matter how much mnd you put in.
That is great, but meriting slow II past 1/5 really will not matter much outside of blood tanking. It is only 4% which does not matter when blink tanking and would not of made the difference if waiting on shadow recast. They are much better spent in paralyze II.
yeah , like rdm can tank now with the spell's nerf rite?
Hey if you got enough blu/thfs...
 Lakshmi.Emanuelle
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By Lakshmi.Emanuelle 2010-09-02 09:34:18
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anyways, people saying that convert merits is a waste, they don't solo at all but ls events and merits, convert is more like survival because when you are soloing mp depletes very fast with nukes and bind/bio3/poison2 spam, on top of that at cap 99 enfeeblin magic will get overrated more than ever , should down those wind merits and put them on convert,

It's nice to have convert up quickly when main healing a pt/allie specially when doing einherjar and kings, mp goes down fast
 Cerberus.Kvazz
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By Cerberus.Kvazz 2010-09-02 09:34:33
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Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Yet the only advantage is increasing the speed of your kill, I wouldn't advocate Bio 3 as an end all merit for RDMs.

This.

I love my Bio3, but it's not in any way needed.
 Ragnarok.Sekundes
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2010-09-02 11:08:43
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Lakshmi.Emanuelle said:
anyways, people saying that convert merits is a waste, they don't solo at all but ls events and merits, convert is more like survival because when you are soloing mp depletes very fast with nukes and bind/bio3/poison2 spam, on top of that at cap 99 enfeeblin magic will get overrated more than ever , should down those wind merits and put them on convert,

It's nice to have convert up quickly when main healing a pt/allie specially when doing einherjar and kings, mp goes down fast

You know, the mobs we fight at level 99 might just be proportionally stronger than the mobs we had at 75. We might just need every bit of that skill until we all get all the best gear they will slowly release or require huge amounts of upgrades to finish.
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 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-09-02 11:13:47
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Cerberus.Kvazz said:
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Yet the only advantage is increasing the speed of your kill, I wouldn't advocate Bio 3 as an end all merit for RDMs.
This. I love my Bio3, but it's not in any way needed.
Only cause all the old mobs can be killed way before they build resistances now and the new ones are mostly super easy to enfeeble or immune lol
 Leviathan.Dissonant
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By Leviathan.Dissonant 2010-09-02 14:53:05
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Cerberus.Kvazz said:
Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Yet the only advantage is increasing the speed of your kill, I wouldn't advocate Bio 3 as an end all merit for RDMs.

This.

I love my Bio3, but it's not in any way needed.
Agreed, but then again, the same could be said about all of the group two merits for rdm (past one or two points).

I'm interested in what Kria (OP) decided to do now after eight pages of debate. He seems to have left after the first page. :(
 Diabolos.Manwhat
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By Diabolos.Manwhat 2010-09-07 12:43:09
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I currently have Paralyze II, Slow II, and Dia III @ 3/5 and Phalanx II @ 1/5. I've read, and I'm sorry...I can't remember the source it's been a while, that both Slow II and Paralyze II aren't worth putting a merit into unless you go 3/5 or 5/5 (something about a noticable proc rate when judging fps [frames per second]). Dia III for me is just golden; I've always been a fan of lowering a mob's defense. I've talked to quite a few RDM's and I'm pretty sure a majority of them all have different views on what to merit. I've had RDM's tell me that Slow II should always be 5/5. I've had RDM's tell me not to even bother with it. I've had RDM's say the same about just every dang spell in Group 2, not to say who is right or wrong...I think it really comes down to your play style, what type of events you do, and your expectations of what you will do in the future. I'm not saying mine is right or wrong...just putting it out there.
 Titan.Cripnicc
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By Titan.Cripnicc 2010-09-07 12:49:59
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Merit them all and start with ur own personal prefrence there is no wrong way to do it. it just depends on ur style of play
 Asura.Azriel
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By Asura.Azriel 2010-10-01 14:27:44
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To add on my previous post on page sumthing. 2 months ago? I honestly dunno.
I don't get the idea of 5/5 convert ... i mean what you do with your MP honestly?
I see a use when you are solo healer in some messed up xp/party with everyone eating dmg like no tomorow (but then again there is abyssea now), mabbe even for Einherjar/Dynamis since its timed events ... let alone salvage ... unlock SJ/Abilitys/etc not makin 5/5 convert worth ...
On "HNMs" ... you 5/5 ppl cast slow/para/silence etc every 15 secs or whats the plan behind ... i do fine since years with not even touchin convert at all and i was curing/enfeebin/stunnin/hastin at "HNMs" and did well with my convert as it is.
I know i know, more convert = more MP blahblah, yeah fine if you really have a good reason go for it.
But would anyone mind tellin me where you as RDM with ... 8MP/tick nowadays (yes i asume everyone and their mum got a chap now) would need a convert time reduction.
If you cure too much, where is your WHM? If you need to enfeeb every 30 seconds, where is your MND gear/enfeeb gear. WHMs nowadays even Haste ppl in cyrcles with np ... so where the *** you really need 5/5 Convert.
And don't jump out saying SOLO!!!! Yes it makes solo easier ... but wheres the challenge in that.

Edit: Oh rite ... the challenge is gone after they raised the lvl cap lulz ...

Edit2: Oh and before you start flaming and bitchin and w/e just tell me why you do 5/5 convert, thats all i am asking for. I appreciate and reason i didn't think over myself allready.
 Titan.Cripnicc
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By Titan.Cripnicc 2010-10-01 14:44:18
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I personaly dont have merits on convert because i dont use convert that often.
So i do agree i will not rush to put merits on convert prolly go 5/5 on blind 2 before convert
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-10-01 14:45:32
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^Wat
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 Bahamut.Zorander
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By Bahamut.Zorander 2010-10-01 14:50:41
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Asura.Azriel said:
To add on my previous post on page sumthing. 2 months ago? I honestly dunno. I don't get the idea of 5/5 convert ... i mean what you do with your MP honestly? I see a use when you are solo healer in some messed up xp/party with everyone eating dmg like no tomorow (but then again there is abyssea now), mabbe even for Einherjar/Dynamis since its timed events ... let alone salvage ... unlock SJ/Abilitys/etc not makin 5/5 convert worth ... On "HNMs" ... you 5/5 ppl cast slow/para/silence etc every 15 secs or whats the plan behind ... i do fine since years with not even touchin convert at all and i was curing/enfeebin/stunnin/hastin at "HNMs" and did well with my convert as it is. I know i know, more convert = more MP blahblah, yeah fine if you really have a good reason go for it. But would anyone mind tellin me where you as RDM with ... 8MP/tick nowadays (yes i asume everyone and their mum got a chap now) would need a convert time reduction. If you cure too much, where is your WHM? If you need to enfeeb every 30 seconds, where is your MND gear/enfeeb gear. WHMs nowadays even Haste ppl in cyrcles with np ... so where the *** you really need 5/5 Convert. And don't jump out saying SOLO!!!! Yes it makes solo easier ... but wheres the challenge in that. Edit: Oh rite ... the challenge is gone after they raised the lvl cap lulz ... Edit2: Oh and before you start flaming and bitchin and w/e just tell me why you do 5/5 convert, thats all i am asking for. I appreciate and reason i didn't think over myself allready.
Why wouldn't you do convert? Which ele acc is better than getting a full MP pool 1 min+ faster? Imo there isn't one..and now with how much I am low manning NM's in Abyssea there is never a better time to have convert recast maxed. Now granted I am elvaan so my MP is slightly limited..I don't find myself popping meds as much as other Rdm's..the SJ of choice lately have been /nin or /sch hell even /blm so I'm not even thinking about Divine Seal(not that I would anyway.) I have never regretted doing convert recast and I'm in love with it now more than ever.
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By Bahamut.Zorander 2010-10-01 14:52:15
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Titan.Cripnicc said:
I personaly dont have merits on convert because i dont use convert that often. So i do agree i will not rush to put merits on convert prolly go 5/5 on blind 2 before convert
Silly lakers fan..

Convert and Blind2 are in seperate categories..and lol@blind2.
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By Phoenix.Lithical 2010-10-01 14:57:45
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Now I've been reading people sing praises of accuracy merits (besides ice) for the last week, with no reason why. Your turn to explain why accuracy merits are better than convert and in what situation does the minor amount of accuracy make any noticeable difference (para procs are noticeable, this question isn't at all about ice)? Why is sitting on so much MP that you never have to convert at recast seen as efficient when RDM can nuke a very, very large amount of abyssean NMs without resist? I thought faster kills were efficient. I'm not saying sit at 50 MP waiting on vert, I'm saying sit at 300+ so you have plenty of room to cure your tank if need be, when convert comes up dump your MP into a couple T4 and use it.

Edit: That's only one justification of Convert merits obviously.
 Titan.Cripnicc
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By Titan.Cripnicc 2010-10-01 15:16:15
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Accuracy helps spells stick longer ie: bind/grav
 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-10-01 15:19:30
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No it doesn't.
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By Bahamut.Zorander 2010-10-01 15:23:54
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Titan.Cripnicc said:
Accuracy helps spells stick longer ie: bind/grav
Silly Lakers fan round #2.
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