Igqira Weskit Vs. Teal Saio From An Elvaan's PoV

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2010-09-08
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Igqira Weskit vs. Teal Saio from an Elvaan's PoV
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 Caitsith.Judaine
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By Caitsith.Judaine 2010-07-09 14:54:06
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Well, seeing that I'm a LOLELVAANBLM HURDURR,

I. NEED. MAGIC ACURRACY.
I resist every other few spells, even though I have ele skill merits and INT merits.

Would using a Teal Saio just be setting my damage higher and my m.accuracy lower vs. a weskit which gives Ele magic skill+5? All I've seen people post about is that Teal Saio = moar damage, but does it help out the lovely Elvaan blm's very much?
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 Gilgamesh.Kunimitsu
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By Gilgamesh.Kunimitsu 2010-07-09 14:58:43
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dont't quote me on this but i think the combination of magic acc + int will help your resist rate more than weskit. I cant remember the ratios so im not 100% but I think...yeah

Edit: wait maybe the int only factors into enfeebles...I cant remember! just wait till someone who knows what they talking about posts i guess. lol
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 Ramuh.Haseyo
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By Ramuh.Haseyo 2010-07-09 15:02:54
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I saw "Elvaan PoV" and got excited. I am disappoint.
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 Caitsith.Judaine
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By Caitsith.Judaine 2010-07-09 15:03:42
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Ramuh.Haseyo said:
I saw "Elvaan PoV" and got excited. I am disappoint.

I saw "Ramuh.Haseyo" and got excited. I am dissapoint.
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 Ramuh.Haseyo
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By Ramuh.Haseyo 2010-07-09 15:04:44
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Caitsith.Judaine said:
Ramuh.Haseyo said:
I saw "Elvaan PoV" and got excited. I am disappoint.

I saw "Ramuh.Haseyo" and got excited. I am dissapoint.

I don't know if I should be happy or hurt. Carry on!
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 Lakshmi.Toioiz
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By Lakshmi.Toioiz 2010-07-09 15:09:04
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The Saio will be better for you than the weskit. The thing that makes Elvaan BLM lawl, is more of the dINT, which weskit gives you no int, but Saio gives you 6.
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 Caitsith.Judaine
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By Caitsith.Judaine 2010-07-09 15:11:10
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Lakshmi.Toioiz said:
The Saio will be better for you than the weskit. The thing that makes Elvaan BLM lawl, is more of the dINT, which weskit gives you no int, but Saio gives you 6.

Thanks for the info! =D
Now I get to go drool over the saio till my blm hits 78 @_@
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 Lakshmi.Toioiz
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By Lakshmi.Toioiz 2010-07-09 15:11:41
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Caitsith.Judaine said:
Lakshmi.Toioiz said:
The Saio will be better for you than the weskit. The thing that makes Elvaan BLM lawl, is more of the dINT, which weskit gives you no int, but Saio gives you 6.

Thanks for the info! =D
Now I get to go drool over the saio till my blm hits 78 @_@

And then cringe every time you join a lvl 75 sync party.
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 Caitsith.Judaine
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By Caitsith.Judaine 2010-07-09 15:26:23
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Lakshmi.Toioiz said:
Caitsith.Judaine said:
Lakshmi.Toioiz said:
The Saio will be better for you than the weskit. The thing that makes Elvaan BLM lawl, is more of the dINT, which weskit gives you no int, but Saio gives you 6.

Thanks for the info! =D
Now I get to go drool over the saio till my blm hits 78 @_@

And then cringe every time you join a lvl 75 sync party.

/sigh then I'll go back to the weskit of shame.
 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-07-09 15:27:30
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You'll get more macc from Teal Saio (3-6 from INT + 4 macc) than an unaugmented Igqira Weskit (5 macc from skill).
 Phoenix.Smileybone
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By Phoenix.Smileybone 2010-07-09 15:31:17
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I guess since this thread is here I may as well ask. Ig Weskit with aug'd +2 INT or Saio? Hume with no INT merits. Going towards 8/8 ele merits tho.
 Bahamut.Zorander
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By Bahamut.Zorander 2010-07-09 15:39:47
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I use it with my Blm over Weskit I haven't used it much but so far I am liking it more than Weskit.

My blm is 79 and now that it is wicked easy to reach 320+ skill I am going with the 6int Macc > Ele skill of Weskit.

However I will most likely keep trying to get a nq weskit with a 5 Int augment.

Most of this will change as long as harder mobs are introduced..with old content and being elvaan I will stack as much Int as I can well over skill that is.
 Bahamut.Zorander
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By Bahamut.Zorander 2010-07-09 15:51:35
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Phoenix.Smileybone said:
I guess since this thread is here I may as well ask. Ig Weskit with aug'd 2 INT or Saio? Hume with no INT merits. Going towards 8/8 ele merits tho.
It's always going to depend on what your fighting but as long as you have capped skill with Ele Magic merits..I can't see where you'd wanna use Weskit over Teal.

Unless harder content is release where we need to force high skill to overcome resists..HNM was the case before but that is broken now with lvl increase.

For all old content resist rates should be floored all but maybe Kirin..but I'm not sure thats 100% correct.
 Sylph.Hitetsu
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By Sylph.Hitetsu 2010-07-09 15:58:22
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I'm curious, how does Teal compare to Genie Weskit? I would expect it to be pretty close, with Teal winning by a very slight margin.
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By omnichef 2010-07-09 16:13:14
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just going off what i have read from previous thread and such is that macc equals ele skill 1:1 so in terms of ele skill you would be looseing 1 macc by usuing teal saio ( not factoring in the int btw) you guys can correct me if i am wrong cuz it will just help me out also. and i have gained about 100-200 damage with teal saio. and my resists have gone down slightly also.
 Gilgamesh.Hatfield
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By Gilgamesh.Hatfield 2010-07-09 16:17:39
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As a fellow LOLELVBLM, i prefer Teal for right now. My skill is merited, and getting higher each level, while my INT is still too low to not lie about xD I think it really matters what your doing on your blm, but i personally use Teal for now and havent regretted it yet. good stuff for sch too
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By Bismarck.Elanabelle 2010-07-09 16:25:33
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When ACP was released, there was a lot of buzz about nuking with Royal Redingote (INT+5) augmented with Macc/MAB+4. At the time, there were "math-based" reports in various forums that stated Redingote was on-par with Genie Weskit and only inferior to Morrigan's.

So, I bought into that. And ended up being very disappointed. I noticed frequency of partial resists went up on nukes. And there really wasn't any significant increase in damage when the nukes were unresisted (compared to NQ Weskit).

So, I know Teal Saio is slightly better than Redingote (by +1 INT), but I believe NQ Weskit will remain superior for end-game nuking on BLM. I can't explain it with math, but just based on years of experience alone, it seems Elemental Skill is more potent than straight MagicAcc when it comes to preventing partial resists on nukes.

So, regardless of race, I'd stay with Weskit, whether NQ or HQ, augmented or unaugmented.
That said, I believe Teal Saio looks practical for RDM nuking, SCH nuking, and BLU nuking. And it's a decent nuking piece for BLM, just not superior.
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By Bahamut.Zorander 2010-07-09 16:43:42
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Bismarck.Elanabelle said:
When ACP was released, there was a lot of buzz about nuking with Royal Redingote (INT 5) augmented with Macc/MAB 4. At the time, there were "math-based" reports in various forums that stated Redingote was on-par with Genie Weskit and only inferior to Morrigan's. So, I bought into that. And ended up being very disappointed. I noticed frequency of partial resists went up on nukes. And there really wasn't any significant increase in damage when the nukes were unresisted (compared to NQ Weskit). So, I know Teal Saio is slightly better than Redingote (by 1 INT), but I believe NQ Weskit will remain superior for end-game nuking on BLM. I can't explain it with math, but just based on years of experience alone, it seems Elemental Skill is more potent than straight MagicAcc when it comes to preventing partial resists on nukes. So, regardless of race, I'd stay with Weskit, whether NQ or HQ, augmented or unaugmented. That said, I believe Teal Saio looks practical for RDM nuking, SCH nuking, and BLU nuking. And it's a decent nuking piece for BLM, just not superior.
this would be true if the lvl stayed at lvl 75...at 80 it is much different..Mobs that were an issue before are no longer hard and resist rates are floor without even wearing any skill+ gear. If resist are basically gone why wear more skill gear..granted you get acc from skill but why not add more Int?
 Gilgamesh.Hatfield
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By Gilgamesh.Hatfield 2010-07-09 16:45:55
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@ 75 sure stick w/ the weskit, thats what i did too im just sayin past 75, your skill gets a huge boost while your still elv and still have barely 70 int, factor in the mab and macc and its nice, im no expert but im lolelvblm and its been great for me
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-07-09 16:55:42
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Bismarck.Elanabelle said:
it seems Elemental Skill is more potent than straight MagicAcc when it comes to preventing partial resists on nukes.
No no and no, get your eyeballing ***out of here. Robonosto presented data on this what, a year and a half ago?

@Zorander: As I mentioned, lack of merits actually favors Teal over Igqira due to higher macc on Teal even at high dINT.

For T5/AMII nukes Genie's probably better than Teal (idk, I retired my BLM so not gonna math it), but Teal should be better than Igqira overall.
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 Bismarck.Elanabelle
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By Bismarck.Elanabelle 2010-07-09 17:58:52
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Fenrir.Nightfyre said:
No no and no, get your eyeballing ***out of here. Robonosto presented data on this what, a year and a half ago?

Blow me Nightfyre.
Nuking on endgame BLM since 2005 is not "eyeballing" anything. Experience is experience, even if it is anecdotal.
I was nuking in a Weskit before ToAU/ISNM, when Weskits cost 2-3M uninflated. I've cast a LOT of nukes, and I know when I'm getting more partial resists than usual.

I'm not saying research isn't important, because, well, it is important. But when I consistently see partial resists using augmented Royal Redingote, and I consistently see less partial resists using Weskit, over a large sample size, it's probably more than coincidence or bias.

When it comes to nuking endgame NMs and mobs that con IT, I'm telling you, pound-for-pound, you'll get less partial resists using an equal amount of Elemental Skill+ compared to Magic Accuracy+. Maybe it's not a huge difference, but it's there.
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 Fenrir.Nightfyre
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2010-07-09 18:02:21
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Data gathered without proper procedure is worthless. You're challenging Robonosto's data and making an implicated challenge against another 40000+ samples of data gathered by pchan with anecdotes. You have no hard evidence, no form of reliability, nothing, and the burden of evidence on you at this moment is massive.

Parse. Or. Get. The. ***. Out.
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 Bismarck.Maxse
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By Bismarck.Maxse 2010-07-09 18:14:43
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Bismarck.Elanabelle said:
Fenrir.Nightfyre said:
No no and no, get your eyeballing ***out of here. Robonosto presented data on this what, a year and a half ago?

Blow me Nightfyre.
Nuking on endgame BLM since 2005 is not "eyeballing" anything. Experience is experience, even if it is anecdotal.
I was nuking in a Weskit before ToAU/ISNM, when Weskits cost 2-3M uninflated. I've cast a LOT of nukes, and I know when I'm getting more partial resists than usual.

I'm not saying research isn't important, because, well, it is important. But when I consistently see partial resists using augmented Royal Redingote, and I consistently see less partial resists using Weskit, over a large sample size, it's probably more than coincidence or bias.

When it comes to nuking endgame NMs and mobs that con IT, I'm telling you, pound-for-pound, you'll get less partial resists using an equal amount of Elemental Skill compared to Magic Accuracy . Maybe it's not a huge difference, but it's there.

Ya Im so tired of this personal experience crap.

Your personal experience eyeballing ***is not > a large amount of data parsed by someone.
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 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-07-09 18:28:58
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As far as the macc vs skill. Eyeballing is eyeballing.

People always like to see patterns and there might even seem to be ones in limited settings. The other day doing VT pets I got around 66% resist rate on them for the first 30 min or so. Most would probably go omg I need more skill/macc.

But I knew I had enough and didn't jump to conclusions so didn't change gear. Sure enough for the next 3 hours I didn't get a single resist.

Regardless people have gone out and actually tested and recorded which will always be more believable than it seems better.

Teal will have 1-4 more macc probably 1 on most mobs given no new HNMs out there with insane int.

It will slightly depend on gearing but teal will be better than a non augmented NQ weskit on all nukes. Now HQ weskit which has come down in price alot should be a little less dmg on T4 about the same on T5 and slightly more on tier AM2.

Getting 2 int on NQ weskit is pretty similar comparison as HQ weskit. At least 3 int on NQ weskit will pretty much always be better than teal.
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By Asura.Barthalomew 2010-07-13 11:59:30
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What about my Weskit that has INT +3 augment on it vs Teal Saio? I'm thinking weskit.
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By Shiva.Xet 2010-07-13 12:23:03
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Teal is flat out better and allows you to play more with other slots. Having 6 int on your body allows you to wear other pieces like hecate's cape alot easier. Not saying its foreveryone but if you got the stats/gear use it. As for the OP, Just hit 120int and aim for 320 skill/macc (you should get way more then this with teal/mixed set.
Someone said Elvaan have 70 int. Lets use that. Saio (6) + chappaeu (6) = 12. Waist (5) + teal legs (5) + any feet (3) = 13. 2x rings + 1 earring = say 12 again. Ammo is 2 so add that up = 109. add a buggard +1 and a ixion = 115. Swap teal legs (5) for Mahatma (8) = 118. No merits for blm = err 301 skill @80 i think. Add Torque for +7 = 308 + 4 macc (6 if witchs)

I say you need with that cheap easy to get set can use food and/or get at least 2 int merits and like all jobs you need to get a fair few ele skill merits (4~8).

Editted cos thought math was wrong then edited cos it was right.

That was just with numbers i just pulled out my ***. Gear will cost (depending on server) about 5 mil minus staves. Cheap and you are effective on nearly any mob on the game.
 Ramuh.Dasva
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By Ramuh.Dasva 2010-07-13 12:27:30
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Asura.Barthalomew said:
What about my Weskit that has INT 3 augment on it vs Teal Saio? I'm thinking weskit.
Definitely on any t4 nuke or stronger you will cast pretty much not matter what you are nuking or your gear setup up.
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By Bahamut.Habs 2010-07-13 12:36:22
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Fenrir.Nightfyre said:
Data gathered without proper procedure is worthless. You're challenging Robonosto's data and making an implicated challenge against another 40000 samples of data gathered by pchan with anecdotes. You have no hard evidence, no form of reliability, nothing, and the burden of evidence on you at this moment is massive. Parse. Or. Get. The. ***. Out.
se has updated the game since the data was parsed.things change get with the program.
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 Ifrit.Darkanaseur
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-07-13 12:39:55
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Bahamut.Habs said:
Fenrir.Nightfyre said:
Data gathered without proper procedure is worthless. You're challenging Robonosto's data and making an implicated challenge against another 40000 samples of data gathered by pchan with anecdotes. You have no hard evidence, no form of reliability, nothing, and the burden of evidence on you at this moment is massive. Parse. Or. Get. The. ***. Out.
se has updated the game since the data was parsed.things change get with the program.

Just because the cap was raised doesn't mean they redefined the formulae for game mechanics.
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 Shiva.Flionheart
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-07-13 12:40:21
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Ifrit.Darkanaseur said:
Bahamut.Habs said:
Fenrir.Nightfyre said:
Data gathered without proper procedure is worthless. You're challenging Robonosto's data and making an implicated challenge against another 40000 samples of data gathered by pchan with anecdotes. You have no hard evidence, no form of reliability, nothing, and the burden of evidence on you at this moment is massive. Parse. Or. Get. The. ***. Out.
se has updated the game since the data was parsed.things change get with the program.

Just because the cap was raised doesn't mean they redefined the formulae for game mechanics.
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