/FrameRateDivisor Improving FPS, But Not Gameplay

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/FrameRateDivisor improving FPS, but not gameplay
 
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By 2019-06-05 20:29:27
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 Asura.Blackmagus
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By Asura.Blackmagus 2019-06-05 21:31:10
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Mine runs better at 2 (30) also, if I set it to 60 it almost seems like it slows down animations. I don’t know a whole lot about it though.
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By Bahamut.Nebohh 2019-06-05 22:12:49
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I just keep mines at 30fps because yeah, I run a lot of characters.
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-06-05 22:36:25
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You didn't check your reddit thread about it lol, oh well.
So here...

You are on a laptop so there is a few steps...

First go to display settings and click graphic settings.




Then click browse, add both pol.exe and windower.exe
On each click options, and set them to high perf.




Now go to the Power options settings and click change plan settings




Go click on change advanced power settings and find processor power management. Check that 'Plugged in' is not 0% somewhere around 30% should do.


Basically, your laptop thinks it's idle and is saving power unknowingly because FFXI was made eons ago.

Now my laptop went from 20fps to 60fps in towns with ppl around on asura, and that was with dgvoodoo2 in both cases with the changes described above.

The biggest issue with FFXI and laptops is that unless you set your min CPU state up a bit. Your computer is running at less than 5% capacity while in XI and that's very bad for frame rate since its almost 100% bottle necked by your CPU when/if running under dgvoodoo2.
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By 2019-06-06 04:59:17
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-06 07:58:23
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cptkel said: »
I have been through the ringer with trying to get Windower and this game optimized!

Why didn't anyone tell me that /FrameRateDivisor is cap sensitive? or is it?

I was able to get it set to (1) and get upwards of 60fps and (0) and upwards of 100fps. The weird part, is that the game runs better at (2) and 30 fps. Is this a condition of my computers components or is something funky going on?


The issues you are aepxerince is because the animation have a hardlocked animation rate per frame aka they expect a certatin fps


at 30fps they expect 30 fps and moves 1/30 of the animation per
if you drop to 20fps you still only move 1/30 per fream so now it takes 50% longer real world time to get through the entire naimation

whne you lock you fps to 60 they do 1/60 of the animation per frame
so if you fps drop to say like 45 you again experince that the animation are slow

You computer system might not have any issue running you game at 30 fps most of the time so you never experince the animation slow downs

but you might offten not be able to hit 60fps so when you run with 60fps settings, you often experince the animation slowdowns and it appaers like the game is running worse /slower


aka 30fps doing 1/30 of the animation is faster than running 45fps doing 1/60 of the animation


- Disabling shadow will helpt with performance issue with many ppl
- Dislabling blurreffet can help too
- disable weather ( this ons is rather random how big an impact it has)
- You also might consider installing project mercury and enable "no multicore stutter"



Also see here
https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/37945/ffxi-lag-and-you/
By Jetackuu 2019-06-06 22:48:36
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Just an fyi: don't keep your FRD at 0.
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By Pwolf Drkgawd 2019-06-07 02:05:46
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Asura.Elizabet said: »
You didn't check your reddit thread about it lol, oh well.
So here...

You are on a laptop so there is a few steps...

First go to display settings and click graphic settings.




Then click browse, add both pol.exe and windower.exe
On each click options, and set them to high perf.




Now go to the Power options settings and click change plan settings




Go click on change advanced power settings and find processor power management. Check that 'Plugged in' is not 0% somewhere around 30% should do.


Basically, your laptop thinks it's idle and is saving power unknowingly because FFXI was made eons ago.

Now my laptop went from 20fps to 60fps in towns with ppl around on asura, and that was with dgvoodoo2 in both cases with the changes described above.

The biggest issue with FFXI and laptops is that unless you set your min CPU state up a bit. Your computer is running at less than 5% capacity while in XI and that's very bad for frame rate since its almost 100% bottle necked by your CPU when/if running under dgvoodoo2.

I need to check this out when i get home tonight... Also I personally can run 100+ fps in mob zones unless someone is around on my laptop. in jeuno i get 50+ at worst when 50 ppl load in at once.

I also downloaded msi afterburner with rivatuner and hard capped ffxi to 75 fps and keep it unlocked with FrameRateDivisor 0. Toggle on my hardcap with rivatuner and rarely drop below 75fps. most the time in jeuno im 60+ with no animation issues.

I guess now ill see if my cpu is acting off even though it is always around 70C while playing ffxi.
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By Pwolf Drkgawd 2019-06-07 02:06:32
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Jetackuu said: »
Just an fyi: don't keep your FRD at 0.

Its better that way. If you cap it through rivatuner to 75fps. more stable that way. at least for me.
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-07 06:36:16
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Just an FYI

When i tested high performance ( no core parking) vs balanced no benefits where seen in any of my testing. Except for HD tune.

I ma not saying its not worth to test out just that this tip is close to being an urban myth.

If you do gain some objectively measuremable difference i would be higly interested, and i woudl recommendem aybe to just try balanced mode with core parking disabled.
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-06-07 07:24:11
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DaneBlood said: »
Just an FYI

When i tested high performance ( no core parking) vs balanced no benefits where seen in any of my testing. Except for HD tune.

I ma not saying its not worth to test out just that this tip is close to being an urban myth.

If you do gain some objectively measuremable difference i would be higly interested, and i woudl recommendem aybe to just try balanced mode with core parking disabled.

High perf vs balanced mode for power settings won't change a thing for XI (at least on win10) since it's really not about core parking. It's about the fact FFXI doesn't tell the CPU it needs ressources. Since the cpu, parked or not, sits almost at idle to save energy. And even on high performance, the default settings on win10 for minimum processor state is 0% (at least on laptops, even while plugged)
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-07 07:44:12
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Asura.Elizabet said: »
High perf vs balanced mode for power settings won't change a thing for XI (at least on win10) since it's really not about core parking. It's about the fact FFXI doesn't tell the CPU it needs ressources. Since the cpu, parked or not, sits almost at idle to save energy. And even on high performance, the default settings on win10 for minimum processor state is 0% (at least on laptops, even while plugged)

This does not logically make sense to me.

IF what you says its correct then balanced vs high performance mode would make a difference
That has nothing to do with core parking that has to do with P states switching


Coreparking was just mentieodn because its the only feature of power savign settigns thta has shown an objectively meauserd differente

Balanced VS high performance is a lot more than just core parking. it seems like your statements is saying that is the only difference...



to put id idffent

if this is the issue
<i>It's about the fact FFXI doesn't tell the CPU it needs ressources<i>
The chaning poer setting would make a difference sicne epthe power stign changes P states. and what you are talking about is p state.

even though Software dont TELL if they need cpu ressources.
the cpu scheduler handles out cpu time for threads that are ready to run on the core.

But i am assuming you are just trying to do a high level not tech explenation of the process

But bottom line is software does not have to do anything to get CPU ressource sbesides exist/ the CPU schelduer will handle out cpu accordingly

Which is why the entire premies of you stamens evne correct for what high perofmrance and balacned modes accutally does. seems inccorect.


This above has nothing to do with core parking




Dealing with Coreparking
Coreparjing puts the cores in a Very Low C states ( not p state) which has a very slow time to get back to C0 states where the Core can actually execute code.
Windows 7 uses this on evey other logical cores. which can be benefician on system with SMT ( not going into that now)
Windows 10 does it by slowing down pairs of logical cores. which can be severely hardmful for perfrmacne as lgocial cores to a SMT system is in pairs connected to the physsical core.
aka windows 7 leave all physsical cores availbe windows 10 does not.

Correct that Coraprking is not enabled in windows 10 balanced
However it is still a features that is avaible

sideinfo: the AMD ryzne pwoer palns changes coreparking in windows 10 to work like it does in windows 7 aka evry other logical core locked down

Beside the slow time from goign from C6 to C0 for the core to be ready to execute time when a threa is scheuled for it
Coreparking has another fundemental flaw

Windows does not take affinty into consideration for releasing cores from locked status.

so if you sotware is set with affinity to run on logical core 0 and 2 on a system with 4 logical cores.
and there is no load on logical core 1 and 3
logical core 0 and 2 will enver be unlocked as there is plente of ressoruces free according to windows. however those rssoruces are never abaield to the process thas is affinity controlles to core 0 and 2 and your software never gets any cpu time.




TLDF:
What you are syaign does not make tecnhical esence on how high vs balced works
Even if we correct it . that is now how it works ( or should work)

Me mentioning of core parkinh was simply to states that that is the ONLY performance improvent i have seen coming from messing around with balanced vs high performance. and the rest of the difference is close to none existing.


as always if you have objective metrics on this i would be happy to see them
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-06-07 07:49:59
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DaneBlood said: »
Balanced VS high performance is a lot more than just core parking it seems liek your statments is saying that is the only difference...

Of course, I was pointing out that in both cases the minimum processor state is still 0%.
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-07 08:07:30
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Asura.Elizabet said: »
DaneBlood said: »
Balanced VS high performance is a lot more than just core parking it seems liek your statments is saying that is the only difference...

Of course, I was pointing out that in both cases the minimum processor state is still 0%.

OK i can follow that
but that would be inccort (unless i am again misunderstading you statements)

Balanced =5%
High performance = 100%

against this is P states adjustmetns and all my testing has show no gain from adjusting this ( not teste in FFXI though).
with the exceptinon of HD tune


What i was trying to say is that the people that has auctually experience an performance gaing going from balcned to high performance is not due to this P states adjustment but rather due to Coreparking beeing disabled (under windows 7)

So my avsie is to when ppl actually can measure a differente between balanced and high performance.
It would be worthfull o try measure balanced with core parking disabled.

You cna point out this is really not needed to bring up for wind10 since coreparking is disbled in both modes.
But then it falls back to my argument that not difference should be gained anyway changing between these 2 modes under windows 10


In other words:
Windows7
Balanced ( Natively with core parking) = possible slowdowsnb
High perforamnce ( native no core parking) = gains
Balanced ( Forced no core parking) = same gains as aboovve

Windows10
balanced ( native no core parking) = no slowdowns
High performance ( native no core parking) = Same as above no slowdowns


or in yet another words p state adjustments has show no gains at all
Adjusting the minimum processor state is a pretty much a myth for speed gains. Which is why people advartizing it never back it up with any kinds of benchmarks or measurements


--- P.S> ---
I do apologize for typo's
I am at work and is pretty much left handing it.
If anything is unclear i am happy to explain it better
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-07 08:20:49
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Your computer is running at less than 5% capacity while in XI and that's very bad for frame rate since its almost 100% bottle necked by your CPU.

This is also an incorrect assumption

Lower p state set to 5% or 100% it will still run at 100% if the software needs the cpu time

The lower p states is not FORCED upon the software to lower its cpu time.
It simply put in when the is no threads asking for cpu time ( once a certain treshold has been hit)

If this was truelly the issue there are other much better way to handle this. what we could do is adjuster the treshoeld for going into a lower p states and the tresheold for going into a higher p state
That would keep the power saving potential will avoiding the stall from p state to pstate change on the core


Low cpu utilization ( not to be confussed with core utilizaiton) is most likly due to the fact the XI only has one cpu heavy thread so it can only really use aroudn 100% of a core at a time.

multicore cpu will saa a loer total usage because the game simply cant grab all the cores

100% core utilziation on a ryzne 1700 *physsical/16logical will shgow 6.6% cpu utilization.
This again has nothing to do with p states. p statsw would still be runnig gat p0 giving away 100% of the core and ajusting the p states aka minim core state would have no change on it.


i beleive the above is more likely where you are getting the 5% cpu utilization from rather than anything involving p states
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-06-07 08:31:14
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DaneBlood said: »
Your computer is running at less than 5% capacity while in XI and that's very bad for frame rate since its almost 100% bottle necked by your CPU.

I wasn't trying to say the min state sets it and locks it there, but rather that the FFXI thread is failing to ask more juice.

Either ways, I remember doing this because at the time I did it, I nearly doubled my FPS in FFXI. Now, there was many win10 updates since, and XI updates also (including the new installer and stuff). So I went ahead and set back the min p state to 0% and well, i'll be damned as just as you say there is no notable changes at all, and when I did that originally it nearly doubled my FPS.

So I removed dgvoodoo2, I deleted the pol.exe and windower.exe from the use high perf in the Grpahic Performance Preferences. I removed any and all FFXI related anything tied into any graphic driver I got on my laptop....

And now, I can't seem to get any lower than 50ish fps. I cannot seem to recreate the 20fps situation in towns with loads of people that I used to see a year or so ago. (Same laptop)

Now I am really confused.
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-07 08:40:54
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Asura.Elizabet said: »
I wasn't trying to say the min state sets it and locks it there, but rather that the FFXI thread is failing to ask more juice.
Software does not need to do anything specific to ask for juice.
its the widow cpu sheduler that hands out cpu time.
If a threads is ready to do somthing it will get a cpu slice in a heavily modified round robing disitrbution.


Asura.Elizabet said: »
Either ways, I remember doing this because at the time I did it, I nearly doubled my FPS in FFXI. Now, there was many win10 updates since, and XI updates also (including the new installer and stuff). So I went ahead and set back the min p state to 0% and well, i'll be damned as just as you say there is no notable changes at all, and when I did that originally it nearly doubled my FPS.

I havent followed windows 10 CPU scheduler that much i know it more complicated that the windows 7 since it went tickless.
I do believe remembering at one point there was a performance Degrading update for windows 10 that cause alot of bad games

Asura.Elizabet said: »
So I removed dgvoodoo2, I deleted the pol.exe and windower.exe from the use high perf in the Grpahic Performance Preferences. I removed any and all FFXI related anything tied into any graphic driver I got on my laptop....

And now, I can't seem to get any lower than 50ish fps. I cannot seem to recreate the 20fps situation in towns with loads of people that I used to see a year or so ago. (Same laptop)

Now I am really confused.

I haven no answers here :D
My best guestimate is the ussual laptop optimal / dual graphics BS that Dgvodoo solves might for some reason still have the game running on the dedicated GPU.

its a guess





Now why i have been addamit on this issue is because i see this "tweak" beeing spread around like wildfire.
and unlike most ppl I actually do some pretty heavy testing on it
Put ppl still share it as gospel without any thing to back it up.

the ttweak can be traced back to windows vista where peopel where confused by the little balls beeing higher on performance fr high performance mode.


THis is jsut one of the 11 computers i tested





P.S.
Thank you for keeping the debate civil and actually going back to do testing. It was really nice not having a disagreement run into a shout match
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By Asura.Elizabet 2019-06-07 08:43:49
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[ ] not < > for your spoiler tag XD

Thanks for the input though. It raised a lot of question and answered a few on my end as well as corrected my assumptions.

What ended up giving me a perf boost was probably something else that either fixed itself over the patches or is something I am missing atm. But, my motivation for finding how to *** my game's performance when it is running smoothly is a little bit on the low side if you'll excuse me ^^;
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By DaneBlood 2019-06-07 08:46:33
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Asura.Elizabet said: »
[ ] not < > for your spoiler tag XD

Thanks for the input though. It raised a lot of question and answered a few on my end as well as corrected my assumptions.

What ended up giving me a perf boost was probably something else that either fixed itself over the patches or is something I am missing atm. But, my motivation for finding how to *** my game's performance when it is running smoothly is a little bit on the low side if you'll excuse me ^^;

Thank you
It took me a few tries but i think i got it now :D
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