Zerde/Albumen SMN

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Zerde/Albumen SMN
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By Lariae 2018-02-08 13:01:42
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Thanks to the community for helping with tips on WoC before, and now here we are at our last roadblock to Aeonics. I was wondering if anyone has had any success in a smn burn on these two NMs, and what you did?

Our setup is (PT1): Geo (PT2): Cor, Run, SMN, SMN, SMN, SMN. For fights that needed a bard I do double duty on the Cor by rolling, warping and switching to bard. Two of the SMN have Nirv and are missing just Lugalbanda earring. The other two are pretty well geared but non nirv. We've made it this far with this setup.

Albumen - Our last good attempt ended up at 50% before a petalback spin stopped the avatars, however his counter is what really messed with us. The agro on this guy seemed to be all over the place and uncontrollable.

Zerde - due to his -DT buff it seems like proccing blue !! is necessary. Are smn AC/AF Meteor strike all the way through on this guy?
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2018-02-08 13:15:12
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Albumen - Fan out around the ??? to minimize counters. Pop during the day, Phaenopsis at night will give him a massive evasion boost and give you trouble. Make sure to sync odyllic with start of conduit so they don't get amnesiaed.

Zerde - Just use BLMs, honestly. The only reason to use SMN on it is to save a job change if doing them all in one sitting. BLM is better.
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By Lariae 2018-02-08 13:23:42
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Forgot to mention that for zerde we were switching one smn to sch to stun initial and skillchain for meteor strike
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By Nocki 2018-02-08 13:24:36
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These two NMs took more attempts than the rest with SMN method for my group, here's what I learned...

Albumen:
Setup: RUN COR GEO SMN SMN SMN | GEO
We only had 2 Nirvana's (I don't have one) and 1 Idris. We pre-buffed the fight with a 2nd cor (companion's/tactician's) and a SCH that does Tabula Regen V + Embrava. Both geos stood in range, and the bubbles were (Idris) Frailty + Torpor from the outside geo and, Vex + Attunement from in party geo. Something you may or may not be doing, but we found to help a lot is as soon as someone uses conduit, use RUN's 1 hour Odyllic Subterfuge. This will floor the enemies magic accuracy and make things like paralyze, amnesia, or other annoying debuffs miss for 30 seconds (which is how long conduit lasts).

Zerde: RUN COR GEO SMN SMN SMN | GEO SCH
Same pre-buffs as for Albumen. Both geos stayed out of range and the bubbles were (Idris) Refresh + Malaise, and Focus + Languor + Entrust haste for the party with the SCH to Stun TP moves. If you want to stun every TP Move, you must use alacrity. We had the RUN Gambit + Rayke Fire on the boss then we all started conduit meteor spam, while again he used RUN 1 hour. For both fights we left the cor in alliance to Random Deal the SMNs after the apogee when conduit wears, and then wild card after that apogee just incase magically we get conduit back. COR + 1 GEO were also /whm to help the RUN from being stuck in debuff land.
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By Lariae 2018-02-08 13:33:32
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I was afraid of that.. me and the other nirvana smn would have to level and gear blm.. what's the gear/jp req for blm on zerde?
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By Shiva.Spynx 2018-02-08 13:46:03
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Another tip for Albumen is to try to have all avatar at a different angle as it likes to counter/guard which can massively reduce your avatar damage as soon as they start to take hate. Apart from that it should be a joke once odyllic is on considering your SMNs gear
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By Carbuncle.Papesse 2018-02-08 14:02:08
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Flaming Crush can easily reach 99k on Zerde without blue proc.
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By aisukage 2018-02-08 17:06:11
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Leviathan.Comeatmebro said: »
Zerde - Just use BLMs, honestly. The only reason to use SMN on it is to save a job change if doing them all in one sitting. BLM is better.

Really now? Cause a well gear SMN out bursts any well geared BLM on Zerde. My group has very well geared BLMs and we went with about a group of 11 of just 1 SMN and like 4 BLMs. That 1 SMN did roughly 50% of Zerde. I as a BLM did about 15% and the others between 10-15%.

Now even if we didn't have the best of the best gear we still had really good gear and thats still a 35% difference more than triple any BLM there. Bringing SMNs that know how to play the job make zerde a joke.
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By Asura.Eiryl 2018-02-08 17:09:23
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SMN is significantly better/faster/easier than blm, he knows that... im not even sure why he would suggest otherwise.
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By Staleyx 2018-02-08 17:53:49
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Smn is much better burster then blm on zerde.
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By Asura.Pergatory 2018-02-08 18:22:58
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Zerde doesn't really require a lot of firepower. I've done it with RUN WHM GEO SCH BLM SMN, with the BLM being stunner and me being the only actual source of damage. Killed before Conduit even wore off.

The key is really in stunning. The stunning is everything. We usually have the SCH stun the first Desserts with ES, then begin Fusion skillchains. BLM waits a few seconds and then pops ES+Alacrity themselves, and stuns all subsequent Desserts (there will be at least 1 around 50%).

If the stuns go well, the fight is a breeze. If it lands Just Desserts, you pretty much lose. I've recovered from a single Just Desserts before when it was an early one that only popped 2 adds and didn't extend his Bio aura far enough to kill the mages. We got lucky with that. If the Bio aura reaches the mages, it's basically game over.

Lariae said: »
Albumen - Our last good attempt ended up at 50% before a petalback spin stopped the avatars, however his counter is what really messed with us. The agro on this guy seemed to be all over the place and uncontrollable.
The biggest problem with hate on Albumen is his enpetrify which resets hate on a target if it lands. Best way to avoid it is have the RUN use Battuta on pop. The parrying will vastly reduce the chances to be petrified. Then as soon as the Conduit begins, have the RUN pop Odyllic Subterfuge. This will help avoid Ramuh getting hit by Amnesia from Petalback, which Albumen likes to spam.
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By Lariae 2018-02-08 21:33:59
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ItemSet 356469. This is what I currently have for smn. Kei has been very selfish. So on Zerde obv I switch the apogee to magic path but what about nirvana is it still King for spamming meteor strike or do I need to get an espiritus or something? Are there any other upgrades that will help with that fight? I have bursted meteor in omen before but only hit for around 15k. However that was not with magic path apogee
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By Asura.Pergatory 2018-02-09 10:14:09
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You need a magic staff like Grioavolr or Espiritus.

This is what I use:

main={ name="Grioavolr", augments={'Blood Pact Dmg.+10','Pet: STR+5','Pet: Mag. Acc.+18','Pet: "Mag.Atk.Bns."+25',}}

Another good upgrade is Regal Belt or Incarnation Sash. That Klouskap is doing nothing for your magic BP. Same with Empath Necklace, if you don't have Adad or Deimos then just use a skill neck like Caller's Pendant. The rest looks workable.

Honestly though, it doesn't need to be perfect. I bursted 80k on Zerde once with no bubbles up. The lack of a magic staff is your big problem.
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By Brynach 2018-02-09 15:51:10
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Carbuncle.Papesse said: »
Flaming Crush can easily reach 99k on Zerde without blue proc.

Yeah, 2 smns for a group of 13 or 14 can easily handle Zerde with a run,2 geos and just 1 sch stunner actively doing anything. SMN can easily hit the 99k cap on FC on Zerde. It's no contest between smn and blm. But if you would prefer waiting for a sc to burst then rinse, repeat more power to ya.
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By Leviathan.Comeatmebro 2018-02-09 15:54:44
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Brynach said: »
Yeah, 2 smns for a group of 13 or 14 can easily handle Zerde with a run,2 geos and just 1 sch stunner actively doing anything. SMN can easily hit the 99k cap on FC on Zerde. It's no contest between smn and blm. But if you would prefer waiting for a sc to burst then rinse, repeat more power to ya.

I stand corrected then, always heard of people doing nonsense with SCH SC and meteor strike. If FC does 99k, SMN is indeed better than BLM.
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By Lariae 2018-02-10 12:19:23
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Can confirm. Definitely use flaming crush. Fire Threnody 2, Geo Def down and magic def down and i saw alot off 99ks.. went down ridiclously fast. Just stun that first Just Desserts lol
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By Shiva.Alistrianna 2018-02-10 19:01:58
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Asura.Pergatory said: »
Zerde doesn't really require a lot of firepower. I've done it with RUN WHM GEO SCH BLM SMN, with the BLM being stunner and me being the only actual source of damage. Killed before Conduit even wore off.

The key is really in stunning. The stunning is everything. We usually have the SCH stun the first Desserts with ES, then begin Fusion skillchains. BLM waits a few seconds and then pops ES+Alacrity themselves, and stuns all subsequent Desserts (there will be at least 1 around 50%).

If the stuns go well, the fight is a breeze. If it lands Just Desserts, you pretty much lose. I've recovered from a single Just Desserts before when it was an early one that only popped 2 adds and didn't extend his Bio aura far enough to kill the mages. We got lucky with that. If the Bio aura reaches the mages, it's basically game over.

Lariae said: »
Albumen - Our last good attempt ended up at 50% before a petalback spin stopped the avatars, however his counter is what really messed with us. The agro on this guy seemed to be all over the place and uncontrollable.
The biggest problem with hate on Albumen is his enpetrify which resets hate on a target if it lands. Best way to avoid it is have the RUN use Battuta on pop. The parrying will vastly reduce the chances to be petrified. Then as soon as the Conduit begins, have the RUN pop Odyllic Subterfuge. This will help avoid Ramuh getting hit by Amnesia from Petalback, which Albumen likes to spam.
I just pop the petrify and amnesia screen temps before spawning it as RUN. Makes life much easier.
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By Asura.Toralin 2018-02-10 19:15:29
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GEO/BLM can stun Just Desserts fine,

pop bolster/ES >stun on pop -> super revit
geo-malaise/entrust languor/indi-focus. pop ES again

then just sit and watch for another Desserts.
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By Asura.Pergatory 2018-02-11 01:55:00
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Asura.Toralin said: »
GEO/BLM can stun Just Desserts fine,

pop bolster/ES >stun on pop -> super revit
geo-malaise/entrust languor/indi-focus. pop ES again

then just sit and watch for another Desserts.
Pray he doesn't do a third Desserts ^^ But yes that will almost always work. We had one today where he did a third Desserts.

And yeah good idea on the screens Ali, not sure why I didn't think of that but I'm usually on SMN for that guy.
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By Shiva.Alistrianna 2018-02-11 01:58:44
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I forgot about em the first time I fought Albumen. Was feeling pretty invincible with Epeo until a pink mandy pimp slapped me with every enfeeble under the sun in less than 5 seconds.
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By tyalangan 2018-02-11 01:59:59
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Can he use aura without executing Just Desserts? He never popped adds (making me think we landed all Just Desserts stuns) but had a Bio aura that killed us all. Bg does not give much info beyond Just Desserts.
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By geigei 2018-02-11 02:01:28
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No need for ES after the first one on pop.
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By cuddlyhamster 2018-02-11 02:57:16
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Bio aura is separate from Just Desserts.
Starts off small 5=10 distance and grows bigger as damage is done. Gets to be around 30 distance. Can be kept small by procing it with big fire damage
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By tyalangan 2018-02-11 08:09:52
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cuddlyhamster said: »
Bio aura is separate from Just Desserts.
Starts off small 5=10 distance and grows bigger as damage is done. Gets to be around 30 distance. Can be kept small by procing it with big fire damage

Hmmm, we use BLM Fusion method so that is a head-scratcher.
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By Ragnarok.Fcube 2018-02-11 10:09:49
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Carbuncle.Papesse said: »
Flaming Crush can easily reach 99k on Zerde without blue proc.

Is frailty needed?
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By Lariae 2018-02-11 12:40:19
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And we killed Albumen, completing our first set of Aeonics. Thank you everyone for all of the help and advice!
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By Ragnarok.Phuoc 2018-02-11 14:55:08
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Ragnarok.Fcube said: »
Carbuncle.Papesse said: »
Flaming Crush can easily reach 99k on Zerde without blue proc.

Is frailty needed?

If only 1 geo and wanna have 3 buffs, can indi-malaise geo-frailty entrust-languor, risky for the geo but with another -meva debuffer like brd, flaming will do 99999 many times with the right gear and the aoe acc/macc food.

gambit > rayle too for added effect on it but 2-3 summoners shouldnt have trouble destroying zerde in 10 seconds with this, if no brd can use rdm with frazzle 3.
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By Lariae 2018-02-11 22:14:45
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we didnt bother with Torpor his eva isnt that great. Can just frailty/malaise + Threnody II and 99k happens alot.
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By Sylph.Khelandros 2018-02-20 11:31:41
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For those who went with the Flaming Crush route, how long do your pets survive in melee range? We tried this last night without Threnody/Frazzle and noticed that the avatars were pretty much dead around the 15 second mark. Was wondering if this was normal without the second magic evasion debuff and if stunning all the TP moves was required. Buffs were Frailty/Malaise/Languor + Beast/Puppet roll and stewpot with Rayke/Gambit, Dia2 and Impact.
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