DRG In Delve/Plasm Farm?

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2010-09-08
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DRG In Delve/Plasm Farm?
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 Fenrir.Genesi
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By Fenrir.Genesi 2013-06-12 13:06:01
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You should expect to play as WHM SCH BRD COR PLD for plasm farms until you get a delve weapon. If by chance you get lucky and are asked to come DD without one, kudos to you but I wouldn't get my hopes up. If you don't have one of the above support jobs to pull you through then I would suggest working on leveling one ASAP. Most plasm farm leaders won't give two shits about what gear you have for the above jobs, except twilight set for PLD, so don't worry about that too much. With this in mind, you could level an above job and be plasm farming with everyone else in 2-3 days.
 Valefor.Darrtt
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By Valefor.Darrtt 2013-06-12 15:43:24
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That is terrible advice and is how we end up with CORs who dont use rolls. WHMs that dont know what a haste cycle is. And BRDs that dont reapply songs or know how to pull.

I was with a group last night and all 3 of these atrocities were in the same party as me. I spent the whole fracture with no rolls, maybe 1 song, and was always slowed until it wore off.

Basically, like any job in this game, if you are leveling it with the intention of using it for endgame content, learn how to play your ****ing job.
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 Bismarck.Bloodrose
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By Bismarck.Bloodrose 2013-06-12 16:07:44
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Valefor.Darrtt said: »
That is terrible advice and is how we end up with CORs who dont use rolls. WHMs that dont know what a haste cycle is. And BRDs that dont reapply songs or know how to pull.

I was with a group last night and all 3 of these atrocities were in the same party as me. I spent the whole fracture with no rolls, maybe 1 song, and was always slowed until it wore off.

Basically, like any job in this game, if you are leveling it with the intention of using it for endgame content, learn how to play your ****ing job.

Learn to play your job as well, by carrying some remedies. Or by manning up and saying to those people not doing their jobs, to well, do their job.

Letting it happen, and not speaking up when it's happening, means that they *think* they are doing what they are supposed to be doing. Remedies aren't that expensive to carry. If your whm is lazy, busy, or out of MP, pop a remedy or even a panacea.
 Fenrir.Genesi
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By Fenrir.Genesi 2013-06-12 16:39:07
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Valefor.Darrtt said: »
That is terrible advice and is how we end up with CORs who dont use rolls. WHMs that dont know what a haste cycle is. And BRDs that dont reapply songs or know how to pull.

I was with a group last night and all 3 of these atrocities were in the same party as me. I spent the whole fracture with no rolls, maybe 1 song, and was always slowed until it wore off.

Basically, like any job in this game, if you are leveling it with the intention of using it for endgame content, learn how to play your ****ing job.

You're missing the point. The goal is to get plasm as soon as possible. The quickest way to said goal is through what I said. It's not terrible advice for someone wanting plasm to buy weapons for their DD. If they get invited to go then the purpose is served, lol. Yeah they will probably be piss poor awful. But I see that ***in delve all the time between the COR/BRD/WHM. It's stressful, irritating and downright disgusting how bad someone can be at a job they leveled to 99. But if you want plasm now and have no other choice to get invites than this is the best route to take. Granted you'll probably drag your name through the mud for the 5-8 runs it takes to build up enough plasm to gear your DD.

The point is to get invited. Once invited, someone could AFK the entire run or be the worst <insert job here> in the world and there wouldn't be a single thing anyone could do to stop you from receiving the plasm lol. Granted you probably wouldn't be invited ever again.
 Quetzalcoatl.Sanriku
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By Quetzalcoatl.Sanriku 2013-06-12 17:17:01
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Fenrir.Genesi said: »
The point is to get invited. Once invited, someone could AFK the entire run or be the worst <insert job here> in the world and there wouldn't be a single thing anyone could do to stop you from receiving the plasm lol. Granted you probably wouldn't be invited ever again.

*Here it comes folks*

For real though... anyone else miss the day when playing your job was a requirement? You showed up as a whm w/o erase, you were kicked and replaced. Why did FFXI soften up?! If they are dead weight, kick them and let them be dead weight elsewhere! I'm no elitist, I'm just tired of seeing people slack and screw it up for the rest of us.

You want plasm but can't get any of your crappy jobs into delve?! Guess what? Go better your jobs or lvl something else that is useful and play that in delve runs!

/endrant
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-06-12 17:18:41
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unless you get 30k in a pug fracture, that philosophy could get you never invited to anything again. on Odin, at least, there are about a dozen people shouting regularly and they all keep and share lists of the asshats.
 Odin.Creaucent
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By Odin.Creaucent 2013-06-12 18:56:30
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Odin.Jassik said: »
unless you get 30k in a pug fracture, that philosophy could get you never invited to anything again. on Odin, at least, there are about a dozen people shouting regularly and they all keep and share lists of the asshats.

Sibs!
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By Ophannus 2013-06-12 19:25:43
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Speaking of asshats in pickup groups on Odin....Yocuz is the worst PLD ever. He has Ochain and Aegis and died from holding the Matamata in the first 5min of a Plasm run, then homepointed and disbanded.
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 Asura.Ivykyori
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By Asura.Ivykyori 2013-06-12 20:29:32
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Since this thread has long been derailed, I'd like to say on the topic of leveling support jobs:

My main job is SCH. Most of the time if I do get to go, I'm thrown into heal duty. It's made me actually dislike this job that I've played for a year. I still play it in plasm farms/nm's because it is literally the only job I have that is fairly decently geared. I have other jobs (DNC, DRG, BLU in terms of melee damage) but...BLU is never in plasm farms, neither is DNC (I can get the dagger, but I'm a stubborn *** and I would much rather use the plasm on a job that I will use on a regular basis, but I only have the T4-5 KI for the dagger and trident). My DRG is still in perle so I won't even count that.

So as a fallback plan, I'm in the process of leveling COR because out of the support jobs that I could finish leveling, COR seemed the less painful. This isn't to say that I'm gonna get it to 99 then be all like "hey, invite me plz, I'm COR" get an invite, and not know what the hell I'm doing. I did a 7-hour run to get my Morimar T5 win last night (and still didn't, grrr) and there was a whm who wasn't geared well (fine and dandy, I won't eat someone alive if their gear's a little off) but also didn't know what they were doing (not fine and dandy). I'm not saying that I'm perfect in all the jobs I play, but if you're a complete derpbag then chances are it's gonna spread like wildfire.

Now on topic: like I said, my DRG is still in perle for the most part, but my husband's main is DRG and he gets called more to do RDM (which he hates with a passion, but he had to put the Heka's he got 1/2 off Akvan to good use) than DRG, even though he has the delve weapon. So in short, go ahead and mention that you have DRG, just don't expect for it to be asked for much.
 Ragnarok.Sekundes
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By Ragnarok.Sekundes 2013-06-12 21:55:47
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I'm leveling cor too ^^; I'd planned to level it on my alt like most of my other support jobs but she can get in to anything just fine on her brd.
 Valefor.Darrtt
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By Valefor.Darrtt 2013-06-13 04:50:00
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I do speak up, but since i cannot actually play their character for them there is nothing i can do when they ignore me. Most of the time i get trolled by other players in the group telling me to stop complaining, or say "please".

Fact is, i say please *once* and after that F bombs come out because this stuff is not complicated. If I'm leading the run, those bad players are not invited back. If I'm not leading the run, i ask the leader to kick those players, or i just leave to do something else.

Also, you can remove players from the party in the fracture, which will prevent them from getting plasm. And to be on topic, i plasm farm on DRG every. single. time.
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By gargurty 2013-06-13 10:53:31
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That on delve to get in is true. I even had a freaking pl whm in mine. Saw red for 30 or more seconds and still no heal :/
And when the 5 minute mark came up he/she finaly looked at the screen to start lotting. My cor or brd hat to raise me else i still would be dead lol
 Asura.Ryndo
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By Asura.Ryndo 2013-06-14 05:09:42
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Weird.. I pulled in delve as NIN/THF and people loved me..
 Caitsith.Sutid
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By Caitsith.Sutid 2013-06-25 16:35:44
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All the DRG bashing is pathetic, whatever you like, I dont diss any job. I agree DRK is massively over powered and someone who can use DRK effectively will outstrip any DD by a mile. Im my case, a DRK in my shell will push the limits to beat me on DRG, and when he hits form he is easy 25% in front. Only person who matched or came close was a excellent monk. Im DRG is delve all the time, I'm always up there, on average I get 3rd, in some cases 2nd so I pull my weight. only DRG I came across who was better had a 99 mythic. And I have no qualms a mythic DRG beating me, he should be.

My Trident is rank 15 so I invested. (FYI I have no NNI gear and not had any gear drop luck from VW, mostly Delve/AF3+2 gear) My main job and I always looking improving it.

to finish, with DRK you can be average and hit big numbers, but doesnt make you a good/great player. Gear might help you but you cant discount knowledge and skill.

Azuraeu (Ragnorak)
 Caitsith.Sutid
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By Caitsith.Sutid 2013-06-25 16:45:04
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Fenrir.Caladbolg said: »
Valefor.Prothescar said: »
The entirety of FFXI's combat system is incredibly simple to replicate using basic algebra. Those of us who bother taking the time to code a program to do that call those programs simulations, as they're simulating the game to the tiniest detail, even though most of those details are irrelevant to actual comparisons. For comparing jobs to each other, pieces of gear, entire gearsets, changes in conditions, etc., a true simulation is unparalleled for accuracy; accounting for human/operator error is impossible and can not be blamed on the simulation or its creator, and the results remain the same regardless. These types of mathematics produce absolute answers, you can not question or argue against a number that is hard coded into the game.

Spreadsheets do the exact same thing in a more compact form at the expense of some features in most cases. Their relevancy remains the same, however: you can not argue against cold, hard mathematical facts just on the basis of feels or because of human error. If X job is mathematically superior to Y job, the method used to represent that in numbers does not change the validity of the conclusion. Spreadsheets use the exact same math as simulations, they just don't always have the ability (easily, anyway) to change certain variables or simulate some other variables without becoming unwieldy or becoming actual simulations. Those variables are almost always certainly never going to change the end result of a comparison, they'll just reduce the accuracy of a result in terms of what you get out of your spreadsheet compared to what you'd see in the actual game by a few DPS, but that impacts every job equally.

Parses are a terrible way to compare anything unless you're comparing data gathered over a long period of time, they function best as tools to collect research data or to compare yourself to others around you and see who needs to be kicked from an alliance for not pulling their weight.

Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Numbers are easily abused by people who don't understand what they mean or their purpose. People look at a parse or a spreadsheet and when they don't understand the inner workings, they just go WELL THIS NUMBER IS LARGER!

Well, unfortunately that's not exactly how things work. A spreadsheet can tell you the maximum long-term limit average that a (semi-*)ideal player can achieve in a specific constructed circumstance.

In reality, any given player will only achieve some fraction of the ideal capacity in an ideal situation. There are a lot of things that factor into this: reaction time / reflexes, attentiveness, speed at which the player engages, aggressiveness, anxiety, computer quality, connection speed, ambient temperature, offspring, time in milliseconds since offspring last pooped, use of and/or quality of spellcast, current position in hormonal cycle of female significant other, number of times male significant other has previously masturbated on the current day, time in milliseconds since last cigarette, serum insulin levels, local population density of Anelpistarachne paichnididiakopi spiders, combustibility of pet goldfish, efficiency of macro setup, responsiveness of keyboard, probability that one will engage in oral sex during the event, just sucking in general ...

And there are really no ideal events and only complex simulations can accomodate the odd constraints that might be present to varying degrees, so really in practice you're always looking at a lower number than what you predict. A spreadsheet is meant to tell you what gives you the best chance.

Quite possibly the best two posts ever posted.

I second that, I loved reading them. I bow to your knowledge.
 
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 Leviathan.Kaparu
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By Leviathan.Kaparu 2013-06-28 03:58:29
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Sully your Napoleon complex and take to reading

Upukirex's performance was never relevant to this discussion
 Leviathan.Draylo
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By Leviathan.Draylo 2013-06-28 06:22:30
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Parse harder bro
 
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 Bahamut.Bojack
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By Bahamut.Bojack 2013-07-14 02:41:01
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Fenrir.Sylow said: »
Numbers are easily abused by people who don't understand what they mean or their purpose. People look at a parse or a spreadsheet and when they don't understand the inner workings, they just go WELL THIS NUMBER IS LARGER!

Well, unfortunately that's not exactly how things work. A spreadsheet can tell you the maximum long-term limit average that a (semi-*)ideal player can achieve in a specific constructed circumstance.

In reality, any given player will only achieve some fraction of the ideal capacity in an ideal situation. There are a lot of things that factor into this: reaction time / reflexes, attentiveness, speed at which the player engages, aggressiveness, anxiety, computer quality, connection speed, ambient temperature, offspring, time in milliseconds since offspring last pooped, use of and/or quality of spellcast, current position in hormonal cycle of female significant other, number of times male significant other has previously masturbated on the current day, time in milliseconds since last cigarette, serum insulin levels, local population density of Anelpistarachne paichnididiakopi spiders, combustibility of pet goldfish, efficiency of macro setup, responsiveness of keyboard, probability that one will engage in oral sex during the event, just sucking in general ...

And there are really no ideal events and only complex simulations can accomodate the odd constraints that might be present to varying degrees, so really in practice you're always looking at a lower number than what you predict. A spreadsheet is meant to tell you what gives you the best chance.

You forgot about how often your cat jumps up on top of you or on our keyboard and gets in your damn way.
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